Correct/missing planes in SH4

[Rockin Robbins]

My point is that effort spent to cosmetic effects of airplanes is effort not spent on items that bear on the quality of the gameplay. All that is eyecandy and doesn't mean a thing. If they were Wright Fliers and dropped bombs in the right places and shot guns at you at appropriate times the gameplay is completely unaffected.

We don't have any problem with encountering the Yamato and sinking it five times in a career. It doesn't matter that all equipment is 199% reliable. It doesn't matter that the mouse is much too sensitive for the stadimeter and fine adjustments are not possible. It doesn't matter that you're standing on the bridge with a large control tower between you and the target you can somehow see through 12' of steel. How about the target you just put four torpedoes into that doesn't have a single hole in it? But that airplane you'll never see has to have the right markings and exact configuration?

It's a matter of priorities. Eye candy needs to come last. Gameplay needs to be king, even at the expense of eye candy.

[Bilge_Rat]

The issue with incorrect planes has been known for a long time. It is a copyright issue, Il2 "Pacific Fighters" had the same issue. Personally it has never bothered me since I dive deep whenever a plane appears.

I don't see what the issue is, if Leandros wants to create a mod with the proper planes, go for it. I'm sure some here will use it.

Originally Posted by Rockin Robbins

It's a matter of priorities. Eye candy needs to come last. Gameplay needs to be king, even at the expense of eye candy.

I disagree, its a matter of what each individual modder feels is important to them.

that is the spirit which created the vast array and scope of mods we have today,

that no one conforms to the opinions of others as to what is important to mod.

if someone wants to make better seagulls or anything else like dolphins and whales (all decried as needless eye candy) im all for that, please do, I would like to have it in my game, after all, its not like its going to be taking any of my time or effort for them to do that

we understand you don't think its a good use of some ones time, but if he wants to do it, why continue to poo-poo the idea?

[Leandros]

Originally Posted by Bilge_Rat

The issue with incorrect planes has been known for a long time. It is a copyright issue, Il2 "Pacific Fighters" had the same issue. Personally it has never bothered me since I dive deep whenever a plane appears.

I don't see what the issue is, if Leandros wants to create a mod with the proper planes, go for it. I'm sure some here will use it.

Unfortunately I am not in the position to create new planes, way above my head. But, I have learnt to use the mission editor which is quite cool - when it wants to....! I have also tried to transfer planes from SHIII to SH4. About a year ago I got into it again but trying anew now, it is as uncooperative as it has always been. It is so sad because it's a terrific creative tool when it works.

Its latest "idea" now is to try to rename every new scenario, and put them into a SH mission folder that I actually have deleted. I'm not able to figure this out however much I try.

Fred

Originally Posted by Leandros

Unfortunately I am not in the position to create new planes, way above my head. But, I have learnt to use the mission editor which is quite cool - when it wants to....! I have also tried to transfer planes from SHIII to SH4. About a year ago I got into it again but trying anew now, it is as uncooperative as it has always been. It is so sad because it's a terrific creative tool when it works.

Its latest "idea" now is to try to rename every new scenario, and put them into a SH mission folder that I actually have deleted. I'm not able to figure this out however much I try.

Fred

just open the planes sim and zon files (not sure which, might be both) and you will find the values that control the way they dive and turn as well as max and min heights they will fly. not sure just how much is possible but im sure they can be "adjusted" to look less "plane on a stick" movements.

as to the appearance there are the image files that can be used to retexture then as you like. just talk to guys on the forum and look at the ship texture work that's been done. im pretty sure the exact same principles and methods can be used for planes

all you need is some spare time to play around with it and create some missions to be able to test and see the results of the changes you make.

the main ingredient you need is the want and desire to do it

[Leandros]

Originally Posted by Webster

....all you need is some spare time to play around with it and create some missions to be able to test and see the results of the changes you make.

the main ingredient you need is the want and desire to do it

Thank you, Webster - that is all well - but, as I indicated, the ME has its strange idiosyncrasies which I have problems understanding. I have made dozens of scenarios of all sorts.

For some reason, it seems to me that the ME is more stable when using it in SHIII than in SH4.

Fred

Originally Posted by Leandros

Thank you, Webster - that is all well - but, as I indicated, the ME has its strange idiosyncrasies which I have problems understanding. I have made dozens of scenarios of all sorts.

For some reason, it seems to me that the ME is more stable when using it in SHIII than in SH4.

Fred

cant argue about that, it has a mind of its own sometimes, especially trying to script aircraft to spawn dependably

[Leandros]

Here is a recent modification of an old scenario that works. I have trouble generating new ones these days.

1: This SBD Dauntless flies beautifully. Note the bomb. I believe I transferred this one from SH3. I shall go in and mod it with heavier bombs.

2 and 3: All three SBD's were shot down. They flew in at 200 m. so that is not surprising. I shall correct their dive altitude, too. The cruisers are Haguro and Nachi (look-alikes, anyway........).

Funny with this scenario, I originally had a heap of B-17F's attacking them but they never showed up. Now a year later I see that their entry date was wrong. Not only that, I corrected it several times but it wouldn't budge - went back to the old date every time. Then the bell rang. The B-17F didn't get into play until September '42, I was making a scenario in January. I suppose I could have corrected that in the software but more correct would be to use an earlier B-17 version. Which isn't there......I think..

Fred

[Barkerov]

Originally Posted by Rockin Robbins

It's a matter of priorities. Eye candy needs to come last. Gameplay needs to be king, even at the expense of eye candy.

With you 100% RR. Gameplay should come first but unfortunately far too many games these days are putting emphasis on eye candy at the expense of gameplay.

I might add to your argument that even if you could get all the correct planes, they still won't use attack and approach tactics that real pilots would use which is a far more important and more difficult to solve problem than the aircraft skin.

Originally Posted by Leandros

Funny with this scenario, I originally had a heap of B-17F's attacking them but they never showed up. Now a year later I see that their entry date was wrong. Not only that, I corrected it several times but it wouldn't budge - went back to the old date every time. Then the bell rang. The B-17F didn't get into play until September '42, I was making a scenario in January. I suppose I could have corrected that in the software but more correct would be to use an earlier B-17 version. Which isn't there......I think..

Fred

well if you use ms notebook to open the files then save before exiting they stay where you put them.

the ME tends to "correct" things for you like that so after the missions are done go in manually to reset the dates using windows notepad.

[Leandros]

Originally Posted by Webster

well if you use ms notebook to open the files then save before exiting they stay where you put them.

the ME tends to "correct" things for you like that so after the missions are done go in manually to reset the dates using windows notepad.

Another funny thing. When I loaded the SBD with other than "basic" load the crews disappeared from the planes. That wasn't any fun so I switched back.......

Fred

The SBD's finally did it. Haguro well down by the aft here with good help from a Vindicator crashing into it.





The game call this a Devastator but it is really a Vindicator.





Here's a cool one....

[Rockin Robbins]

Those are some of the finest screenshots to come out of SH4! I especially like the first one.

[sfc]

if you are looking for more planes, look at several of the mods -such as RSRDC_SH15_V550. it is for sh5 iI think but have been able to get acouple to work in sh4.
also look at the mod ASW_9.0_STANDARD_1.5, and in the fall of the raising sun there is a bunch of planes that do work in sh4. including PBYs
also look at Rubini's posts, he created a mod where jap planes drop torpedos and they do explode.
I hope this helps you on your search, I went through alot of troubles to find these, but finally did find some that work. good luck

[Bilge_Rat]

leandros, I really like the sea colour, what env mod are you using?

[Leandros]

Originally Posted by Bilge_Rat

leandros, I really like the sea colour, what env mod are you using?

Hi, BR - please don't ask - I installed it on my new computer a little more than a year ago.......

Fred