Questions about GW and IUB . . .

[Kamikaze]

I'm coming back to SH3 after a break. I had used IUB 1.02 and liked it alot. So now I see someone has taken up the torch to upgrade IUB to 1.03 (YEAH!) but there is also a package worth looking at called Grey Wolves.

I just tried my first mission with Grey Wolves. There were some things I liked . . . and did not like. With IUB it seemed more flexible and you could turn off more items. Grey Wolves seems more rigid regarding this aspect. Am I wrong? I did apply the 16Km LIGHT mod due to wanting the extra crew sighting capability (at least I hope this is what it does. As I said the Documentation is a bit weak).

I also noticed the First Mate no longer ID's ships. I know many in the community do not like this capability . . . but I've felt THATS what the crew is for! Can this be turned back on? Or at least the book didnt pop open like I'm used to it doing.

Damage is different . . .BOY is it different. 3 TORPS into a Small MERCHANT didnt sink it! All solid hits mid-section . . . sheesh.


I suppose what I would like somebody to reply with, a light comparison of where GW and IUB differ. I've been looking at the various posts . . . and many folks are saying how similar they are . . . .but in what ways are they different? Be brief and High-level. We know they both go for eye-candy so this can be left out.

This is almost from an aspect of . . . I liked IUB 1.02 . . . would I like or dislike GW?

Also . . if ya have links to threads where there are tips for modifying FW please link them.

Thanks in advance.

[RedChico]

I'm with you.

* About the crew.... its not modelled correctly in SH3, they don't do theire job, no crew shifts... bahh

* About the damage.... you just have to wait, sometimes it will take hours, minutes or seconds. I like it this way, its furstrating hence fun

[melinjkpg]

I like GW but i do realy miss the small buttons when you press on the WE and then torp. I dont like the big icons in the middel of the screen. I like more the IUB version with small icons in the left side. What is that mod called? I i can replace that one.

[Kpt. Lehmann]

Originally Posted by melinjkpg

I like GW but i do realy miss the small buttons when you press on the WE and then torp. I dont like the big icons in the middel of the screen. I like more the IUB version with small icons in the left side. What is that mod called? I i can replace that one.

Its called the "Integrated Orders Mod" by Chomo... once we get it GW compatible we will include it.

[oRGy]

I'm not involved in IuB anymore, but looking over the changes it seems IuB and GW are actually 90% similar, including most of the same mods.

Major differences seem to be crew fatigue model, campaign is richer particularly in the med and of course, the damage model, taken over from the NYGM mod if I'm not mistaken.

Certainly 3 torps in a small merchant doesn't seem right to me, but I'm not really on top of what is going on here at the moment so can't really comment. JonZ handles what goes into IuB at the moment.

[zzsteven]

Originally Posted by Kamikaze

I'm coming back to SH3 after a break. I had used IUB 1.02 and liked it alot. So now I see someone has taken up the torch to upgrade IUB to 1.03 (YEAH!) but there is also a package worth looking at called Grey Wolves.

I just tried my first mission with Grey Wolves. There were some things I liked . . . and did not like. With IUB it seemed more flexible and you could turn off more items. Grey Wolves seems more rigid regarding this aspect. Am I wrong? I did apply the 16Km LIGHT mod due to wanting the extra crew sighting capability (at least I hope this is what it does. As I said the Documentation is a bit weak).

I also noticed the First Mate no longer ID's ships. I know many in the community do not like this capability . . . but I've felt THATS what the crew is for! Can this be turned back on? Or at least the book didnt pop open like I'm used to it doing.

Damage is different . . .BOY is it different. 3 TORPS into a Small MERCHANT didnt sink it! All solid hits mid-section . . . sheesh.


I suppose what I would like somebody to reply with, a light comparison of where GW and IUB differ. I've been looking at the various posts . . . and many folks are saying how similar they are . . . .but in what ways are they different? Be brief and High-level. We know they both go for eye-candy so this can be left out.

This is almost from an aspect of . . . I liked IUB 1.02 . . . would I like or dislike GW?

Also . . if ya have links to threads where there are tips for modifying FW please link them.

Thanks in advance.

Once a compartment has been hit by a torpedo and it floods to 100%, further torpedo hits to that compartment have no effect. You have to target a different area of the ship to increase flooding. When firing a salvo, adjust the torpedo spread angle so they hit different compartments. I've sank several small merchants and large cargos with two torps.

zz

[irish1958]

Since most ship sink because of uncontrolled flooding, it takes a long time, sometimes hours.
irish1958

[Kpt. Lehmann]

Originally Posted by irish1958

Since most ship sink because of uncontrolled flooding, it takes a long time, sometimes hours.
irish1958

Exactly, and with the smaller ships, striking the same spot with a subsequent torpedo may have little or no effect in sinking the ship.

You can think of the ships as having more than one compartment that is "water-tight." Therefore, you really need to hit more than one place on the ship. There is always the chance for a critical hit... but largely you should never count on a critical.

Another thing about smaller ships and compartments... you can think of these compartments as being a little closer together, which can be a good thing or a bad thing for you... depending on where your torps hit.

Furthermore, re-modelling damage for one boat can actually have a cascade effect and cause problems in other boats.

There are some smaller ships/boats where I am going to review the DM, but I am still deciding as to whether or not the small merchants need futher attention at the moment.

At the very least... engaging enemy ships will yield an uncertain outcome for you... You will find yourself seriously asking "Is she worth another torpedo? Should I risk surfacing and using the deck gun?" Your decision may have a definite impact on your total end-of-patrol tonnage score.

Stock SH3 was full of certainties... These certainties are things that are going the way of the dinosaur.

Lack of certainty is a GOOD thing.

[Kamikaze]

Thanks everyone for replying!

The comments about the torps hits one the same location make perfect sense. Should have thought of that (Doah!).

A note for any of the GW creators . . . . .
Please add more infor on the what the OPTIONAL MODS do. Many of them do not have a readme. So its a guess as to what they will do. For example, the Stock Sea Floor . . .does that also change the water? Or just the floor? Need more info on what the 24hr schedule change does.

Guess I'll have to try a few more missions with GW and get a better feel. By then maybe IUB 1.03 may be out of BETA and I'll give that a whirl (thanks to JSGME . . . THANK YOU JONESOFT!).

Good Work to Both Developing Teams!

[Kamikaze]

I think I've had some clarification . . . please . . someone let me know if I am wrong.

This will let you know how long its been since I've played SH3.

I've just NOW looked at the SH3 COMMANDER. It looks like with this tool you can choose to turn off the crew fatigue . . . . if you so desired. Am I correct?

Also the seasonal Waves sound like a MUST HAVE effect? Any negative aspects? Besides probably more non-deck gun use?

Which version of the RUB fatigue is FW using? So if I play with this setting I can set it back . . . .

Thanks in advance.

[Kpt. Lehmann]

Originally Posted by Kamikaze

I think I've had some clarification . . . please . . someone let me know if I am wrong.

This will let you know how long its been since I've played SH3.

I've just NOW looked at the SH3 COMMANDER. It looks like with this tool you can choose to turn off the crew fatigue . . . . if you so desired. Am I correct?

Also the seasonal Waves sound like a MUST HAVE effect? Any negative aspects? Besides probably more non-deck gun use?

Which version of the RUB fatigue is FW using? So if I play with this setting I can set it back . . . . .

If you are attempting to use the GW default 8 hour fatigue model and SH3 Commander, just leave fatigue model options in SH3 Cmdr
un-checked.

If you want to choose one of the optional fatigue models present in SH3 Commander, then you use the selection method.
Thanks in advance.[/quote]

The biggest difference between IuB and GW is probably the damage model.


IuB use Hollywood adv Damage + minor tweaks.
- They make ship more harder to sink than stock
- redefine fatigue conditions (if installed in SH3 Commander)
- take longer to repair certains compartments of the sub

GW use NYGM Damage model.
- Based on uncertainly formula, harder to sink ship by flooding her compartments.

The big gameplay differences is probably felt on the sinking model.

Other differences:
RND SCR layers
AI detection (?)
Fatigue models

[melinjkpg]

Originally Posted by Kpt. Lehmann

Its called the "Integrated Orders Mod" by Chomo... once we get it GW compatible we will include it.

hope very soon then =) i hate that orginal buttons now. I have played to many hour with that mod to change back now.