Swastikas and Germany in the modern day...

[areo16]

Originally Posted by Gammelpreusse

Dunno. If you had some "first hand" expirience of national socialism, or it's aftermath, your eagerness to download according mods may have been a bit dampend.

Business practices based on some national laws, on the other hand, are an entirely differrent topic to begin with.

Many war veterans cannot watch war films or play wargames. But I don't think that brings reason to ban such war films or wargames. I'm trying to understand your point?

Originally Posted by Catfish

Tribesman you may be right in a lot of things, but if you are really interested in propaganda, you can look for re-education and "de-nazification" (lol) in Germany, after the war.

The problem is that over-simplified propaganda always falls back on the perpetrators, sooner or later. And if the wrong people find that out ...
The truth would have been enough.

I agree. Unfortunately often the propaganda falls later rather than sooner.
when its extreme the later makes a much bigger impact.
You are right about de-nazification, it was a joke.
I must say though I disagree with Skybird form earlier. I don't agree with an outright ban, to me the best solution for the ideoliogy is to put it right out in plains sight, give it a big platform under a full spotlight and laugh at the idiots and their conspiracies and hatred, plus of course at the moment when they cross the line into illegal activity which they invariably will then apply the law of their nation to their illegal activities.

[areo16]

Originally Posted by Tribesman

Well the neo Nazi has spoken, I hope Alex put you all right on the beautiful nationalist ideology of the crooked cross.
I bet education is a global jewish conspiracy

I hope you're not referring to me when you say this. I take great offense to this. You shouldn't be throwing around such labels without just cause.

[kranz]

Originally Posted by areo16

I hope you're not referring to me when you say this. I take great offense to this. You shouldn't be throwing around such labels without just cause.

you must be new here

[areo16]

Originally Posted by Aktungbby

The OP leaves out a few items: 1: Freedom of speech is not a blanket absolution even in America. You cannot for example yell "fire" in movie theatre which was the case cited by a Justice on the subject; as it would tend to cause harmful panic and destruction or even death from trampling. 2: In the South, as in previous threads, The Confederate battle flag cannot be flown over public buildings as formerly. It appears Germany deals with the incendiary issue of the Swastika similarily. However the issue is not completely dead as the Bavarian state which holds the copywrite on Mein Kampf prepares to republish what has been a good little money-maker on Amazon in English when the copywrite expires shortly and become eminent domain. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/04/24/mein-kampf-germany-bavaria-adolf-hitler-memoir_n_1449870.html The Dec. 8, 1999, file photo shows a book store displaying Adolf Hitler's "Mein Kampf" in downtown Sarajevo. (AP Photo/Hidajet Delic with swastika on book jacket)
One of the most controversial books in history is about to come back into print in its homeland -- something that hasn't been true in nearly 70 years. On Monday, the German state of Bavaria announced plans to publish an annotated version of Adolf Hitler’s infamous “Mein Kampf,” according to Der Spiegel.
The southern German state has held ownership of the book’s copyright since the end of World War II, the Associated Press notes, but those rights are due to expire in 2015.
“Mein Kampf” is currently banned in Austria and Russia, the Daily Mail writes. But contrary to popular belief, the notorious book is not banned in Germany -- Bavaria has simply prevented its printing in an effort to control production, the AP notes.
In January, a German magazine ignited controversy when it tried to publish excerpts from the book with critical commentary, the New York Times reports. German authorities took the matter to court, which ruled that any publication of the book violated Bavaria’s copyright.
But now, with the copyright expiration drawing near, Bavaria is publishing its own version of the book and calling it damage control. Der Spiegel reports that the book will include commentaries that condemn Hitler’s arguments. Not to be out done: In the United States the book can be found at almost any community library and can be bought, sold and traded in bookshops. The U.S. government seized the copyright during the Second World War under the Trading with the Enemy Act and in 1979, Houghton Mifflin, the U.S. publisher of the book, bought the rights from the government. 15,000 copies are sold a year. Clearly in Germany, the crooked cross may be banned...but the 'bible' is about to be republished?!! I suspect...Like many celebrities, ol' Adolph of Munich will earn more Deutschmarks dead than alive. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mein_Kampf note the swastika on the jacket-shortly to be republished.

This is very interesting. I do not agree with banning any written material, irregardless of its contents. But I am an American.

I'm getting the sense that the Americans here have a different ideal of Freedom of Speech than the rest of the posters here. Our ideal seems to be more free than the others. Perhaps the teaching of our Bill of Rights to us since a young age has left a permanent mark on our thinking of freedoms.

I do understand why yelling "fire" in a crowded place should be outlawed, as the yelling of the word would and could directly result in physical harm to others as people would be trampling over others, in frenzy. But, I do not think yelling "Hilter", using the word itself, would create any reaction that would harm another. Yelling "Hitler" is not the same as yelling, for example "Hurt that Jew!". The latter of course being a verbal threat, and illegal in most countries.

I do understand why the CSA flag should not be flown over public buildings because it is a flag that represents a different nation than the USA. Just as much so as we should not allow British flags be flown over our public buildings. This is Merica!

Originally Posted by areo16

I hope you're not referring to me when you say this. I take great offense to this. You shouldn't be throwing around such labels without just cause.

Are you a neo Nazi?
Have you repeatedly written about your belief in the global jewish conspiracy on this forum?
Do you regularly link to the sort of stuff that would normally be at home on Stormfront or VNN?
If the answer to those 3 is no then how can it possibly have been referring to you?

This is very interesting. I do not agree with banning any written material, irregardless of its contents. But I am an American.

William Powell is an American, he wants his book banned, something to do with its contents and how some people are using it.

[areo16]

I would now like to direct the conversation to another concerned matter of mine:
How are German World War 2 veterans treated in modern day Germany?

Let me all put this in context from my American point of view. World War 2 vets are treated as the "king of veterans" here in the states. WW2 overshadowed WW1, and Korea was seemingly forgotten. For some reason the public turned its back on the Vietnam vets, and the Gulf War veterans don't get the praises of the WW2 veterans because the Middle East wars weren't as bloody or grand as WW2. But of course, I am exaggerating this all a little bit. We do treat all of our veterans well today. Much better than we did in the 60's or 70's.

That being said, we praise our WW2 vets. They are in the news, newspapers, and the movies about the conflict always are popular. Can the same be said of the German veterans of WW2 in Germany? How were and how are they treated in modern-day Germany? Is there a since of pride? Can good things be sought from their actions during the war, even though they fought on the losing end? They did have initial victories.

[areo16]

Originally Posted by Tribesman

If the answer to those 3 is no then how can it possibly have been referring to you?

Because the comment wasn't quoting or replying anything. And, these labels get thrown around far too often without due diligence. That is why.

Because the comment wasn't quoting or replying anything

An individual made a comment about education, the individual was mentioned, education was mentioned, it was the preceeding post, how could you miss it?

Further to your Americans don't believe in banning books angle.
The list of the top 100 books some Americans want banned.
http://www.ala.org/bbooks/top-100-ba...ooks-2000-2009
William Powells book is on it again, plus a german tale of WW2 again.

[areo16]

btw I'm not antagonizing... I'm just having a laugh.

[areo16]

Originally Posted by Tribesman

An individual made a comment about education, the individual was mentioned, education was mentioned, it was the preceeding post, how could you miss it?

What?

[Betonov]

Originally Posted by Tribesman

Further to your Americans don't believe in banning books angle.
The list of the top 100 books some Americans want banned.
http://www.ala.org/bbooks/top-100-ba...ooks-2000-2009

Harry Potter series is #1...
Seriously ??????????????

[Oberon]

[Gammelpreusse]

Originally Posted by areo16

Many war veterans cannot watch war films or play wargames. But I don't think that brings reason to ban such war films or wargames. I'm trying to understand your point?

War != War. War != holocaust. It's also a difference if only your soldiers are sent to some distant place to fight for a "just" cause or when your very own home becomes a battleground and your mere existence a matter of surivial, only to hear afterwards that during this battle some of humankinds most heideous crimes have been comitted in ->your<- name.
Not asking for you to understand it, I guess that comes down to trying to explain to a blind man how colors look like.

I would now like to direct the conversation to another concerned matter of mine:
How are German World War 2 veterans treated in modern day Germany?

Let me all put this in context from my American point of view. World War 2 vets are treated as the "king of veterans" here in the states. WW2 overshadowed WW1, and Korea was seemingly forgotten. For some reason the public turned its back on the Vietnam vets, and the Gulf War veterans don't get the praises of the WW2 veterans because the Middle East wars weren't as bloody or grand as WW2. But of course, I am exaggerating this all a little bit. We do treat all of our veterans well today. Much better than we did in the 60's or 70's.

That being said, we praise our WW2 vets. They are in the news, newspapers, and the movies about the conflict always are popular. Can the same be said of the German veterans of WW2 in Germany? How were and how are they treated in modern-day Germany? Is there a since of pride? Can good things be sought from their actions during the war, even though they fought on the losing end? They did have initial victories.

In regards to german soldiers, that is like asking for rape victims to be praised. Most people back then went through hell and for what? Some gangsters with grandeur complexes. Everything in regards to bravery they may have shown was tainted to the core by their very own leadership. They and their love for the nation got abused, used, that simple. Would you want to be reminded of that every year, no matter in what light it would be shown?

I remember my gradfather, a distinguished soldier, holder of the iron cross 2 class and commander of a quad 20mm AAA unit, who severd in France, Sicily and Italy, in Monte Cassino amongst other locations, breaking out in tears when asked about WW2.

Quote in regards to Hitler "That damn a**hole!"

He neither got nor wanted any appreciation for that whole affair.

Btw., the denazification after the war was not very effective in regards to actual "brainwashing". Nazis stayed on board throughout all levels of society. National Socialism was a good idea badly implemented was a regular point of view well into the 70ies. What really brought the turnaround in how the country dealt with it's past was initiated by the 68ers, as mentioned before.

Originally Posted by Betonov

Harry Potter series is #1...
Seriously ??????????????

Well its ungodly isn't it, witches and wizards and stuff.
You will find much of the list is challenged on "religious" grounds, some people just don't like that aspect of freedom of speech.
Not that its an American thing(apart from the list which is of course), some people in other countries hold those same views on freedom of speech.