"Affluenza" as a DUI defense...

[August]

Originally Posted by swamprat69er

He will remember what he did for the rest of his life. I hope he has a long one.

Unfortunately that only works if he has a conscience. Maybe he'll grow one someday. Maybe.

[swamprat69er]

Originally Posted by August

Unfortunately that only works if he has a conscience. Maybe he'll grow one someday. Maybe.

Maybe he wil screw up again while under probation and he might get lucky and get a judge that will actually punish him for all of his crimes.
We can only hope.

Originally Posted by August

Unfortunately that only works if he has a conscience. Maybe he'll grow one someday. Maybe.

Yep, it would look like his sense of entitlement has eroded anything resembling a conscience.

[Bubblehead1980]

Originally Posted by Jimbuna

I'm getting a strong sense of double standards and a fair amount of hypocrisy here.

Well, your senses are off then.There is a huge difference between a US citizen, a teenager at that, making a stupid decision vast majority of us have made at one point or another, to drive after consuming alcohol.Unfortunately, his stupid decision resulted in the tragedy of four people losing their lives.Now, the kid was 16 at time of incident and this specific case leads into the big picture issue of our flawed and failed justice/corrections(prison) system.Our system is focused on punishment and satisfying the human need for revenge in lieu of punishment and rehabilitation.Sure, some violent offenders are beyond help but the US has 2 million plus people in prison and an extremely high recidivism rate.People usually learn how to be "better" criminals in prison and once out, due to the stigma, are excluded from society in many ways and end up right back in prison.I am certainly no bleeding heart but I am for what works here, and how things are now, do not work.I believe that was part of the judge's thinking, prison is no place for a 16 year old kid who simply made an idiotic mistake that lead to tragedy.Dislike him all you want because is wealthy(seems a lot of hate, kid can't help if he is wealthy anymore than a kid who is poor can) but he is still a kid who made a stupid mistake, he deserves punishment sure but being removed from society and put in prison for many years? Ten years of felony probation is not a slap on the wrist, eps if he ends up with a hard nosed Probation Officer.Imagine trying to finish high school with all these special restrictions? Imagine trying to go to college? Imagine having to ask permission to leave the county, the state, the country? This kid is under the thumb of the government for ten years and I find it highly likely if he does not obey the terms, he will end up in prison.

The illegal immigrant who hit me is a different situation.First, he had no right whatsoever to be in the country.Second, he is not a 16 year old who made a stupid mistake but a criminal already illegally in the country who made matters worse with his dangerous behavior.Since an illegal, would not deserve the same consideration in my opinion, even if legally entitled.I seek no revenge, simply for him to be punished and deported, all within the law.The 16 year old in Texas was punished and sentenced within the law. I tried to put myself in the families of the victim's shoes, I would be angry as well and want revenge but once the initial anger and emotion calm down, 90 percent sure I would still not want him in prison. I think of a DUI manslaughter incident that occurred in my hometown a few years ago.17 year old kid was drinking and driving, hit a car and it killed a 16 year old girl.The victim's parents urged the judge NOT to sentence the boy to prison but to give probation, I believe he got a heft probation sentence along with other things.That is the definition of having evolved beyond the natural, gut reaction instinct of revenge and letting sense prevail. I like to think if it were me, I could do the same, 90% sure I could eventually but yet, just a a big thing to do.

[Bubblehead1980]

Originally Posted by Father Goose

I don't know...I think Tribesman will be here shortly to exploit this gaffe.

Your poor illegal Honduran is sitting in jail. How old is he?
This rich kid killed four people! That's four lives terminated, gone forever. He's free.
All the Honduran did differently was enter the country illegally and NOT kill four people.

Are you therefore saying that entering the country illegally is worse than killing four people?

I believe is in his early 30's, old enough to know better.Yes, he is sitting in jail where he belongs, because would likely flee and never be held accountable for what he did or would be roaming around as an illegal elsewhere.

The Honduran being illegal makes a big difference.The kid in texas had a right to be here, he screwed up, it happens but it's much more tragic if become the victim of someone who is in no way entitled to be even standing on the same land you are. The guy is a criminal anyways, multiple arrests, deported before etc and old enough to know better.

Worse than driving drunk and killing four people? No, but again it's apples and oranges, different situations.

[Father Goose]

Originally Posted by Bubblehead1980

I believe is in his early 30's, old enough to know better.Yes, he is sitting in jail where he belongs, because would likely flee and never be held accountable for what he did or would be roaming around as an illegal elsewhere.

The Honduran being illegal makes a big difference.The kid in texas had a right to be here, he screwed up, it happens but it's much more tragic if become the victim of someone who is in no way entitled to be even standing on the same land you are. The guy is a criminal anyways, multiple arrests, deported before etc and old enough to know better.

Worse than driving drunk and killing four people? No, but again it's apples and oranges, different situations.

Fair enough. That is your opinion and I respect that. Thank you for your explanation.

[Buddahaid]

Originally Posted by Bubblehead1980

Well, your senses are off then.There is a huge difference between a US citizen, a teenager at that, making a stupid decision vast majority of us have made at one point or another, to drive after consuming alcohol.Unfortunately, his stupid decision resulted in the tragedy of four people losing their lives.Now, the kid was 16 at time of incident and this specific case leads into the big picture issue of our flawed and failed justice/corrections(prison) system.Our system is focused on punishment and satisfying the human need for revenge in lieu of punishment and rehabilitation.Sure, some violent offenders are beyond help but the US has 2 million plus people in prison and an extremely high recidivism rate.People usually learn how to be "better" criminals in prison and once out, due to the stigma, are excluded from society in many ways and end up right back in prison.I am certainly no bleeding heart but I am for what works here, and how things are now, do not work.I believe that was part of the judge's thinking, prison is no place for a 16 year old kid who simply made an idiotic mistake that lead to tragedy.Dislike him all you want because is wealthy(seems a lot of hate, kid can't help if he is wealthy anymore than a kid who is poor can) but he is still a kid who made a stupid mistake, he deserves punishment sure but being removed from society and put in prison for many years? Ten years of felony probation is not a slap on the wrist, eps if he ends up with a hard nosed Probation Officer.Imagine trying to finish high school with all these special restrictions? Imagine trying to go to college? Imagine having to ask permission to leave the county, the state, the country? This kid is under the thumb of the government for ten years and I find it highly likely if he does not obey the terms, he will end up in prison........

A valid point I'll agree. That view, however, doesn't fit with the defense of "Afluenza" which reads something like "I never had to be responsible ever before so what's the problem".

[August]

Originally Posted by swamprat69er

Maybe he wil screw up again while under probation and he might get lucky and get a judge that will actually punish him for all of his crimes.
We can only hope.

Dig it.

[Stealhead]

Yeah but then he has A**fulenza I mean Afluenza so he'll just say "I can not be held responsible for for violating my probation because like I have Afluenza."

[vienna]

In case you are wondering where that waste of life named Etahn Crouch is likely to end up to serve his "gruelling punishment", here is a link to the rehab center's website:


http://www.newportacademy.com/facili...ential-campus/


Altogether now: "Nobody knows da trubble I's seen..."



<O>

[TarJak]

Originally Posted by Bubblehead1980

Well, your senses are off then.There is a huge difference between a US citizen, a teenager at that, making a stupid decision vast majority of us have made at one point or another, to drive after consuming alcohol.Unfortunately, his stupid decision resulted in the tragedy of four people losing their lives.Now, the kid was 16 at time of incident and this specific case leads into the big picture issue of our flawed and failed justice/corrections(prison) system.Our system is focused on punishment and satisfying the human need for revenge in lieu of punishment and rehabilitation.Sure, some violent offenders are beyond help but the US has 2 million plus people in prison and an extremely high recidivism rate.People usually learn how to be "better" criminals in prison and once out, due to the stigma, are excluded from society in many ways and end up right back in prison.I am certainly no bleeding heart but I am for what works here, and how things are now, do not work.I believe that was part of the judge's thinking, prison is no place for a 16 year old kid who simply made an idiotic mistake that lead to tragedy.Dislike him all you want because is wealthy(seems a lot of hate, kid can't help if he is wealthy anymore than a kid who is poor can) but he is still a kid who made a stupid mistake, he deserves punishment sure but being removed from society and put in prison for many years? Ten years of felony probation is not a slap on the wrist, eps if he ends up with a hard nosed Probation Officer.Imagine trying to finish high school with all these special restrictions? Imagine trying to go to college? Imagine having to ask permission to leave the county, the state, the country? This kid is under the thumb of the government for ten years and I find it highly likely if he does not obey the terms, he will end up in prison.

Interesting how your tune changes depending on the situation. I'd say Jim's senses are spot on:

Originally Posted by Bubblehead1980

Someone causes a wreck and is actually drunk, okay they deserve punishment,

How about if they kill someone? Particularly whilst both drunk and on drugs?

Originally Posted by vienna

In case you are wondering where that waste of life named Etahn Crouch is likely to end up to serve his "gruelling punishment", here is a link to the rehab center's website:


http://www.newportacademy.com/facili...ential-campus/



Altogether now: "Nobody knows da trubble I's seen..."



<O>

Shawshank redemption it aint.

[vienna]

Shawshank redemption it aint.

Also consider these are not like jails; they are not strict lockdown facilities and can be left easily. This place is similar to the "rehab" resort facilities in Malibu and other near by resort beach areas nearby where people like Lindsay Lohan, Chris Brown go and we've all seen how well they've done with their "problems"...


I expect to hear he's gotten out and done some more damage here in California. If he does, he's SOL because the voters of California eliminated 'diminished capacity' as a defense after ther Dan White "twinkie defense" debacle...



<O>

Originally Posted by TarJak

Interesting how your tune changes depending on the situation. I'd say Jim's senses are spot on:



How about if they kill someone? Particularly whilst both drunk and on drugs?

what struck me about that post you responded to is the claim that the vast majority of people are drunk drivers. It seems a hell of a stretch, possibly influenced by the persons own perceptions based on their own actions.
But on the specifics, how many drivers have driven at high speed while ****faced on drink and drugs, after consuming alcohol while underage which they had stolen?

[TarJak]

Originally Posted by Tribesman

what struck me about that post you responded to is the claim that the vast majority of people are drunk drivers. It seems a hell of a stretch, possibly influenced by the persons own perceptions based on their own actions.
But on the specifics, how many drivers have driven at high speed while ****faced on drink and drugs, after consuming alcohol while underage which they had stolen?

I noticed that. He tried covering himself by saying consume alcohol and not drunk. Which actually is another contradiction on previous posts in the same thread my 2nd quote comes from.

[Bubblehead1980]

Originally Posted by TarJak

Interesting how your tune changes depending on the situation. I'd say Jim's senses are spot on:



How about if they kill someone? Particularly whilst both drunk and on drugs?


Shawshank redemption it aint.

I explained why Jim's sense are invalid and why there is a difference between the illegal immigrant who crashed into us and the 16 year old in Texas.