A complaint about this game

[stormrider_sp]

Originally Posted by 0rpheus

While this is in some respects true, in that release of 'rushed' or incomplete games is becoming the norm in some cases - it has more to do with the relative ease of modern communications mediums (the patching process, especially when 'delivered' by a third party interface like Steam) and cash-strapped Publishers pushing devs to finish working on a game before its ready in order to recoup investments or running costs from the release. It has very little to do with the actual developers, in the great majority of cases.

While your 'take a stand' notion is a noble one, unless you can simultaneously convince a good 80% of the current gaming demographic to join in your protest, it will achieve nothing. Beyond that, it would do you credit to consider the circumstances of each game/dev/publisher independently - consider NWAC, with its team of six or so relatively independent devs under a small publisher, and corporations like Ubi, like EA and so on - the larger, 'peer' companies that actively enforce this business model.

Target your ire if you wish it to be effective, and remember that polite ire is harder to ignore than impolite.

You´re right.

[stormrider_sp]

Originally Posted by Julhelm

Maybe it's because I work in game development and have first hand experience of having to ship a game no matter what and then be rewarded by usersgoing on a crusade to blast the product because they stumbled upon some bug (Apple doesn't let the really gamebreaking bugs past their review). We even had users consistently post scathing, blasting reviews on iTunes for each new patch even though we had long patched their original complaint, which was a server bug that would randomly not award XP after a match.

So yeah, take a chill pill. They've said they're trying their hardest to fix it ASAP. So be reasonable about it. Game development is a hell of a lot more difficult than you probably imagine it to be.

So is my job.
But I´ll be fired if I fail.

[Daniel Prates]

You take a chill pill, julie. I am making a valid protest, without any sort of swearing or insulting. You on the other hand have found it valid to insult me personally as a means of argument. A moderator have even shown up a dozen of posts earlier to pinch your ear for it, in case you havent noticed. This says enough about the validity of your points.

So you are a dev to, eh? Actually this explains a lot. You know, you have given me an Idea (expressly by the way). The NWAC people can afterward tank you pesonally for it. Why don't I just go to the custumers reviews page on gamersgate and steam, if indeed I am the bitchy unresonable sob you are posing me to be, and report all this nice conversations we are having? The guys from "total whatsoever" that are developing this game (under the wings of poor old paradox, which I assume must also be subject of pity from our part) can then thank you personally for that. How about it? How about new custumers seing for themselves that a complaint is responded by some random guy like you insulting me on a personal stance?

So, again, you take a chill pill, dude.

[Julhelm]

Originally Posted by Daniel Prates

You take a chill pill, julie. I am making a valid protest, without any sort of swearing or insulting. You on the other hand have found it valid to insult me personally as a means of argument. A moderator have even shown up a dozen of posts earlier to pinch your ear for it, in case you havent noticed. This says enough about the validity of your points.

Point out exactly where I have "insulted you personally".

[0rpheus]

Originally Posted by Daniel Prates

You take a chill pill, julie. I am making a valid protest, without any sort of swearing or insulting. You on the other hand have found it valid to insult me personally as a means of argument. A moderator have even shown up a dozen of posts earlier to pinch your ear for it, in case you havent noticed. This says enough about the validity of your points.

So you are a dev to, eh? Actually this explains a lot. You know, you have given me an Idea (expressly by the way). The NWAC people can afterward tank you pesonally for it. Why don't I just go to the custumers reviews page on gamersgate and steam, if indeed I am the bitchy unresonable sob you are posing me to be, and report all this nice conversations we are having? The guys from "total whatsoever" that are developing this game (under the wings of poor old paradox, which I assume must also be subject of pity from our part) can then thank you personally for that. How about it? How about new custumers seing for themselves that a complaint is responded by some random guy like you insulting me on a personal stance?

So, again, you take a chill pill, dude.

But you're protesting to us, here, which is useless, because none of us are involved with the game.

As for posting an argument with a stranger from a different forum as evidence that the NWAC guys are somehow terrible people, well now we're in bizarro-land, so I will leave you with this



and wish you well!

[Sorge]

Originally Posted by Arclight

T'is the underhanded stuff;

There's no reason there to take a shot at the game because you don't like the mission end screen.

That's why I'm bothering you. Not because I think you don't have a right to complain, but because you do so in a manner that is downright offensive.

Seriously? I think you're reading a bit much in there. I didn't pick up on any attitude in that statement at all.

Reality is, people just feel different about the state of this game based on their personal experience. I see no resolution for that. Is the product perfect? No. Could it have matured more before release? Probably. Are they putting in the effort to fix and improve it? Definitely. Are we so used to buggy games that we accept mediocre quality? Most likely.

Let's agree to disagree. And if someone's bitching about the game in the forums, so what? Let the devs deal with them, it's their product to defend. My 2 centavos.

[jpinard]

Originally Posted by Daniel Prates

On this subject, many opinions (not coincidentaly, coming from people who got the game to work) fall into a generic cathegory: its a cheap game, chill out, its being worked out etc.

I would like again to stress out that the whole reason I am taking this matter so seriously is not the bug itself. Its a matter of PRICIPLE. It is the problem that this kind of rushed-out, flawed games are becoming increasingly common. It is the posture that the comunity is taking, in increasingly larger numbers, to silence complaints and treat the developers and distributors as people doing us favours.

Where this road is going to lead us? It has become so impopular do cricticize the devs, that many people has sent me private messages to agree with me. Why private? Are we afraid to say what we think, now?

You're like the guy who cries about the quality of his $1000 Caviar while his neighbors are starving.

What pisses me off, is watching two friends die the past 2 weeks in their early 40's. One from an illness that could have been helped if he had proper health insurance. So not a lot of sympathy in my heart for your principled stance on a $20 game that has already had patches and has further patches coming. I want to live in your world where berating 6 developers for their game not being perfect "yet" is the worst I have to deal with.

No one is trying to tell you you cannoot speak, but if you're going to be this shallow - then don't whine when you're called out on it.

[jpinard]

In case you missed it on the official forum - my game has issus too (I can't get past Baltic Breakout due to it hanging). But I have a bit of decency, and understand making a game doesn't carry the same critical urgency as the software in a dialysis machine or pacemaker. I know they will fix it.

[Arclight]

Originally Posted by Sorge

Seriously? I think you're reading a bit much in there. I didn't pick up on any attitude in that statement at all.

I really don't think I am. I'm not basing it off a single post; it goes back to every post here and at Paradox. I know one of his major complaints is the way missions terminate.

Anyway, I'll throw in the towel. I've had a discusion with Daniel over at Paradox and that was perfectly civil. We both had our say, made our points and even though we don't nescesarily agree I feel we understand eachother. Sadly it doesn't work out like that with everyone.

[Daniel Prates]

Originally Posted by Arclight

I really don't think I am. I'm not basing it off a single post; it goes back to every post here and at Paradox. I know one of his major complaints is the way missions terminate.

Anyway, I'll throw in the towel. I've had a discusion with Daniel over at Paradox and that was perfectly civil. We both had our say, made our points and even though we don't nescesarily agree I feel we understand eachother. Sadly it doesn't work out like that with everyone.

Arch is absolutely right - and I should mention that from my part (and his) we have also kept it civil here too, not only there.

This past few days have been enlightening - some other guys compared this conversation to death of close ones, others to caviar.... others suddenly don't remember that they have said themselves just a few days ago and have to be quoted on themselves. It goes to show how far into neverland are opinions going these days.

I am throwing in the towell too.

[jpinard]

Originally Posted by Daniel Prates

Arch is absolutely right - and I should mention that from my part (and his) we have also kept it civil here too, not only there.

This past few days have been enlightening - some other guys compared this conversation to death of close ones, others to caviar.... others suddenly don't remember that they have said themselves just a few days ago and have to be quoted on themselves. It goes to show how far into neverland are opinions going these days.

I am throwing in the towell too.

Both of those quotes were from me. It's not the fact you posted this here, but that you took it from another forum, made up stuff to give yourself sympathy, and in the meantime, the developers had already promised to fix the issues. You played the "victim card", and then got upset when people called you on it and out thoughts are, "why be a jerk to honest hard-working people?" You totally missed my point. I NEVER compared this thread to death, my point was: spend that anger & energy on something that deserves it.

Maybe (I hope) this is all a language issue since English may not be your first language. If so, I'll be happy to explain (in pm's) what I was trying to say so it won't be misinterpreted.

[Orm]

Daniel,

I know exactly what you are feeling as I got the same treatment from the guys of Paradox when, before the game was release, I complained about differents topics such as the lack of NTDS symbology or of ice cap on the North Pole.
As a former Harpoon, FC and DW player, I thought that in 2012 we would get a simulation that will beat the old ones, but I just saw a pale copy of those old but very sophisticate ones.
I then exrpress my doubts to Paradox, explaining that if they don't add some features they are going to lose a lot of customers (the hard-core ones), and I just got laughts from Janh and worsely from future customers.

so, I decided not to buy this game, and I see now that I WAS RIGHT.

[Bilge_Rat]

I finished campaign mission 6 over the weekend. There are a few bugs and missing features, but on the whole this is one solid simulation: radar modeling, air ops, refueling, weapon effects, AI are all very well handled.

If the developpers keep nurturing this one and every indication is that they will, NWAC is well on its way to be a classic.

[stormrider_sp]

Originally Posted by Orm

Daniel,

I know exactly what you are feeling as I got the same treatment from the guys of Paradox when, before the game was release, I complained about differents topics such as the lack of NTDS symbology or of ice cap on the North Pole.
As a former Harpoon, FC and DW player, I thought that in 2012 we would get a simulation that will beat the old ones, but I just saw a pale copy of those old but very sophisticate ones.
I then exrpress my doubts to Paradox, explaining that if they don't add some features they are going to lose a lot of customers (the hard-core ones), and I just got laughts from Janh and worsely from future customers.

so, I decided not to buy this game, and I see now that I WAS RIGHT.

+1

It lacks what Kotler calls Brand Positioning.
“act of designing the company’s offering and image to occupy a distinctive place in the minds of target market.” Kotler

Currently it holds no positioning. Its neither a simple fun game like Naval Fields, nor is a complex simulator like Harpoon. It only tries to simplify/imitate simple games like Fleet Command, which it does poorly!

[stormrider_sp]

Originally Posted by Bilge_Rat

I finished campaign mission 6 over the weekend. There are a few bugs and missing features, but on the whole this is one solid simulation: radar modeling, air ops, refueling, weapon effects, AI are all very well handled.

If the developpers keep nurturing this one and every indication is that they will, NWAC is well on its way to be a classic.

My friend, what do you call radar modeling, when you can guide your F-35´s AMRAAMs using the information provided by that "Einsteinian Quantum Physics" datalink from a non-wire guided torpedo? Do you call that good radar modeling?