Hundreds of Occupy Wall Street protesters arrested

[tater]

Originally Posted by soopaman2

I guess your not aware of the massive homeless problem in NYC?

Alot of people sleep on the street...

Generally they are left alone by the police, as long as they aren't causing a problem. Most don't. They simply want to be left alone from people who think they should be incarcerated because they are poor.

I don't see many, but then again, when I'm in the city I'm not in places where they likely crash. In ABQ, they'd have to go to a shelter. Pitching a tent in a park would get you hauled off.

Again, if backpacker tourists would not be allowed to simply camp at will on sidewalks or parks, they need to properly protest, and sleep at home.

[mookiemookie]

Originally Posted by CaptainHaplo

Irony can be humorous....

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/m...UqYHrGPCaZaLRK

How is it ironic?

[soopaman2]

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

OWS is causing problems.

I'm not sure how factual this is but interesting to read:


http://pajamasmedia.com/tatler/2011/...massive-theft/

Yes Mr. Warhawk I agree here. Zucotti park is privately owned, they should not try to take ownership.

But...

The list of demands given is fair. It would go a long way to bring justice...Which deep down inside is all we all want. Even if you see them as pinko commy traitors, dirty lazy Obama and Ron Paul voters, you realize their gripe has merit behind it.

They are fair demands. Thieves should go to jail. To bail out the banks was vile. you do that, you may as well bail out all the moron homeowners too.

Too much favoritism when it came to giving out aid...Glass-Steagall would have prevented most of this to big to fail mess.

Accountability. If the underwater homeowner must have it, then why should not the banks who packaged debt, sold it, then bet against the derivatives and made a killing from it.

Then got bailed out, and got performance bonuses?

[mookiemookie]

Originally Posted by soopaman2

Yes Mr. Warhawk I agree here. Zucotti park is privately owned, they should not try to take ownership.

But...

The list of demands given is fair. It would go a long way to bring justice...Which deep down inside is all we all want. Even if you see them as pinko commy traitors, dirty lazy Obama and Ron Paul voters, you realize their gripe has merit behind it.

They are fair demands. Thieves should go to jail. To bail out the banks was vile. you do that, you may as well bail out all the moron homeowners too.

Too much favoritism when it came to giving out aid...Glass-Steagall would have prevented most of this to big to fail mess.

Agreed. Anyone who says that this is about "redistribution of wealth" or getting rid of capitalism in favor of socialism is an idiot. Real capitalism is letting companies who screw up feel the repercussions of their screwups. It's not using taxpayer money to bail them out so they can continue to screw everyone.

[tater]

Most of those demands have no merit. Gotta love "forgive student loan debts."

LOL.

Unemployment for the under-educated is ~20% in the US, and remains pretty "normal" for those with a degree (and approaches zero for anyone with a post-graduate degree).

Anyone with college loans is lucky. Course the protesters probably have Art History majors.

Getting into the "1%" is also not terribly hard. They make it sound (as Obama does) that the top 1% are "millionaires." With jets. "Corporate Fat Cats." Top 1% starts around 400k per year. There are stagehands at Lincoln Center that make more than that (the average at LC is 290k/year for stagehands at AF HAll and AT Hall). Top stage hand at Carnegie Hall makes over 500k/year. I have friends in Chelsea that make nearly that much combined and live in a studio apartment the size of my master bedroom (their AGI doesn't get lumped as married because they are gay). "Top 0.1% doesn't make as good a placard, I guess.

40% pulling no weight, and the only the top of the next 60% pulling even their own weight, with only the very top subsidizing the bulk isn't enough I guess.

I'm fine with letting banks, etc fail. I was against bail outs. Ditto Obama's give away to unions at GM.

[CaptainHaplo]

Originally Posted by mookiemookie

How is it ironic?

Oh cmon, Mookie - you don't see irony?

Here these folks are, protesting to take stuff away from others (the "rich") and "share it" with everyone - but when its their stuff that gets taken - oh its just not right. They get all bent out of shape.

Someone didn't have $5,500 for a macbook, but someone else did. That isn't FAIR - so why shouldn't the taker be allowed one?

Course, if anyone had any sense - they would have put the money on something a little more useful than a macbook (man the 99% must be really poor to drop that kind of money on a piece of technology) - like paying off those college loans. Maybe hiring a professional to review their resume (if they have one). Even go take a certification test to make themselves more viable in the job market.

But oh nooooo - gotta have a 5500 buck macbook - and its MINE - but you have money so give me some of it!

Like I said.... IRONY!

[flatsixes]

Originally Posted by mookiemookie

... Anyone who says that this is about "redistribution of wealth" or getting rid of capitalism in favor of socialism is an idiot....

Well, okay then. Now at least we know who's camping out in Zuccotti Park. You guessed it: a bunch of "idiots."*

The protesters have a distinct ideology and are bound by a deep commitment to radical left-wing policies. On Oct. 10 and 11, Arielle Alter Confino, a senior researcher at my polling firm, interviewed nearly 200 protesters in New York's Zuccotti Park. Our findings probably represent the first systematic random sample of Occupy Wall Street opinion.

Our research shows clearly that the movement doesn't represent unemployed America and is not ideologically diverse. Rather, it comprises an unrepresentative segment of the electorate that believes in radical redistribution of wealth, civil disobedience and, in some instances, violence. Half (52%) have participated in a political movement before, virtually all (98%) say they would support civil disobedience to achieve their goals, and nearly one-third (31%) would support violence to advance their agenda.

The vast majority of demonstrators are actually employed, and the proportion of protesters unemployed (15%) is within single digits of the national unemployment rate (9.1%).

An overwhelming majority of demonstrators supported Barack Obama in 2008. Now 51% disapprove of the president while 44% approve, and only 48% say they will vote to re-elect him in 2012, while at least a quarter won't vote.

Fewer than one in three (32%) call themselves Democrats, while roughly the same proportion (33%) say they aren't represented by any political party.

(*Not that there anything wrong with that!)

[mookiemookie]

Originally Posted by tater

Most of those demands have no merit. Gotta love "forgive student loan debts."

LOL.

Forgiving them is far-fetched. Reforming a system that's stacked against the consumer is another matter. Student loan debt is not disgorged in bankruptcy. Thanks to the bank bailouts, neither is credit card debt. Many student loans are guaranteed by the government, so to the lender, it's essentially a riskless transaction. They still screw the borrower though.

Unemployment for the under-educated is ~20% in the US, and remains pretty "normal" for those with a degree (and approaches zero for anyone with a post-graduate degree).

Anyone with college loans is lucky. Course the protesters probably have Art History majors.

Yeah, let's lump everyone together and make sweeping generalizations. That's the hallmark of a great argument.

Getting into the "1%" is also not terribly hard.

Statements like this are why your posts are always so head shakingly funny. if it was easy to be rich, then everyone would be rich.

There are stagehands at Lincoln Center that make more than that (the average at LC is 290k/year for stagehands at AF HAll and AT Hall). Top stage hand at Carnegie Hall makes over 500k/year.

Why don't you quote the average pay for stagehands, which is $9.79 an hour. Oh, I get it, quoting an outlier like it's the average makes your argument look strong. Righty-o.

Originally Posted by CaptainHaplo

protesting to take stuff away from others (the "rich") and "share it" with everyone -

No they're not.

Course, if anyone had any sense - they would have put the money on something a little more useful than a macbook (man the 99% must be really poor to drop that kind of money on a piece of technology) - like paying off those college loans. Maybe hiring a professional to review their resume (if they have one). Even go take a certification test to make themselves more viable in the job market.

But oh nooooo - gotta have a 5500 buck macbook - and its MINE - but you have money so give me some of it!

And you know this person's personal financial situation well enough to give this advice.....how?

Originally Posted by flatsixes

Well, okay then. Now at least we know who's camping out in Zuccotti Park. You guessed it: a bunch of "idiots."*



(*Not that there anything wrong with that!)

So a biased poll of 200 people, most likely cherry picked, tells the story of a global movement. Sure. By the way, quoting an opinion piece out of the Rupert Murdoch owned WSJ on the OWS movement like it's a reputable and reliable piece of journalism...that's a knee slapper. If that's the standard we're going for, why don't I just start quoting Daily Kos.

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by soopaman2

Yes Mr. Warhawk I agree here. Zucotti park is privately owned, they should not try to take ownership.

But...

The list of demands given is fair. It would go a long way to bring justice...Which deep down inside is all we all want. Even if you see them as pinko commy traitors, dirty lazy Obama and Ron Paul voters, you realize their gripe has merit behind it.

They are fair demands. Thieves should go to jail. To bail out the banks was vile. you do that, you may as well bail out all the moron homeowners too.

Too much favoritism when it came to giving out aid...Glass-Steagall would have prevented most of this to big to fail mess.

Accountability. If the underwater homeowner must have it, then why should not the banks who packaged debt, sold it, then bet against the derivatives and made a killing from it.

Then got bailed out, and got performance bonuses?

Fair demands? Saying the government should just let the students loans go? What about my kids in a few year when they go to college and need a loan? Do they get the high hard one or a free ride like these folks want? Moron home owners? Yes, there are a few. How about the other morons who did not default on their home loans? Another high hard one? You bet'cha. Underwater homeowners do not have accountability. They are walking without much recourse. Some who can afford their homes are walking as a result of upside down loans. The picture is much bigger than performance bonuses and failed policy concerning lending money to of all things....a bank.

Gordon Gecko is not going to cutting checks. The protest is getting as stale as the park itself. They should be camping out on the mall in Washington. Not Wall Street.

[soopaman2]

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

Gordon Gecko is not going to cutting checks. The protest is getting as stale as the park itself. They should be camping out on the mall in Washington. Not Wall Street.

Exactly...DC is the problem, and I have said that alot here..
But it seems everyone who hates them inexplicably glosses over the other demands on that list. Glass-steagall? Breaking up too big to fails? Flash trading? Justice for fraudster bansters who got rewarded for breaking the worlds economy?

Sure just read what you hate and harp on that one point only, to invalidate the ones that are relevant. (Works for Fox News and MSNBC)

Why are you so in favor of the status quo? (honestly, you don't think something is wrong here?)

[mookiemookie]

Originally Posted by soopaman2

Why are you so in favor of the status quo?

This is what I don't get either. It's like it would be poison for some people to admit that the government is corrupt and money holds more say than a person's vote. That's the root of the whole protest, but for some reason, people buy into the smears that it's about communism or a bunch of lazy people wanting free stuff.

The people with their hand on the throat of democracy and true capitalism in this country feel threatened by the protests. They can only maintain their grip so long as nobody points it out. When it's pointed out, they put out a story that these people are communists or socialists or whatever in order to divert the attention away from themselves. And the rubes lap it up and spew it back at anyone who dares say that the protesters have a point. Unbelievable.

[CaptainHaplo]

Originally Posted by mookiemookie

No they're not.

Yes Mookie - they are. Look at what they are protesting...

Social and economic "injustice". The only fix presented is the same one that the left has been on about for months now - tax the rich. And where does the majority of taxes go? Social programs. Who uses the social programs? The disadvantaged.

So its

Take from the rich
Give to the poor.

Just don't take their 5500 dollar macbook - cuz they are the 99% poor remember...

[mookiemookie]

Originally Posted by CaptainHaplo

Yes Mookie - they are. Look at what they are protesting...

Social and economic "injustice". The only fix presented is the same one that the left has been on about for months now - tax the rich. And where does the majority of taxes go? Social programs. Who uses the social programs? The disadvantaged.

So its

Take from the rich
Give to the poor.

Just don't take their 5500 dollar macbook - cuz they are the 99% poor remember...

So where does "bail out the rich and let them continue to screw everyone" fit into that story? Because I don't know if you were paying attention over the past 3 years or so, but that's kind of what's happened.

The rich have taken from everyone else - they blow up the economy and now are back to doing better than ever, while everyone else gets to pick up the pieces and gets stuck with the tab. Where's that fit into the story?

Why are you okay with money having more say in politics than your vote? Seriously, how is that okay or at all how the Founders intended the country to work. I'd love to hear the explanation, because you're sure defending that system pretty hard.

This is what I don't get either.

What is even more illustrative is those who go beyond praising the system that shafted them and have gotten into lapping up a proposal which asks them to bend over even further for an even bigger backdoor delivery.

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by soopaman2

Exactly...DC is the problem, and I have said that alot here..
But it seems everyone who hates them inexplicably glosses over the other demands on that list. Glass-steagall? Breaking up too big to fails? Flash trading? Justice for fraudster bansters who got rewarded for breaking the worlds economy?

Sure just read what you hate and harp on that one point only, to invalidate the ones that are relevant. (Works for Fox News and MSNBC)

Why are you so in favor of the status quo? (honestly, you don't think something is wrong here?)

Really guy? In favor of status quo? You are participating in the Cain threat driving the Libs crazy correct? Honestly, there is something wrong here...at PA Ave. Wall St is like a kid given a lollipop. They ate it all without sharing. What did Washington expect when they handed the lollipop to banks?

My issue is protesting at Wall St make very little sense and you agree as well. However, do these folks believe Wall St is going to do anything? Do you think Obama who embraced the protest is going to do anything? No sir...status quo is what is going to happen.