Knut the Polar Bear Dies Young

Gargamel · 03-22-11, 07:48 AM

The star Polar bear at a German zoo died the other day. Rights activists have claimed the zoo mistreated him by basically domesticating him.

http://news.discovery.com/animals/kn...ng-110321.html

http://news.yahoo.com/s/yblog_theloo...olar-bear-knut

As being the only polar bear ever born and raised in captivity because it's mother abandoned him, I think the inadvertent 'domestication' is almost unavoidable.

Good pics though:

Feuer Frei! · 03-22-11, 07:55 AM

I read this the other day.
Really sad tbh.
I don't know about anyone else but it has never sat comfortably with me in regards to the domestication of wild-life. Or the attempts to domesticate and attempt to create a (un)natural habitat for the animal, in enclosed surrounds.
I appreciate on the other hand animal welfare groups treating and/or nursing injured or abandoned or both back to strength or until they can fend for themselves out in the wild, out where they are really at home.
That to me is humane.
Either taking a animal out of it's habitat, it's natural surrounds, it's home and putting it into an enclosure for indefinite periods of time, without any apparent or intelligent and constructive and conducive reason behind it is...well...wrong.

Gargamel · 03-22-11, 08:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Feuer Frei!

Either taking a animal out of it's habitat, it's natural surrounds, it's home and putting it into an enclosure for indefinite periods of time, without any apparent or intelligent and constructive and conducive reason behind it is...well...wrong.

Does this mean you are opposed to zoo's in general, or those people who collect the exotic animal's as pets?

For zoo's, I feel the research learned from the animals can help in their conservation in the wild. Not to mention the number of young kids (adults too!) who fell in love with those animals at the zoo and decided they wanted to do something in a related field when they grow up. Zoo's aren't known as being profit crunching machines (even though they have to be to stay afloat), so saying this is an monetary exploitation is a bit of a stretch for me. Performing animals, on the other hand, are a different story.

I think zoo's serve an important role in human culture, as they strive to help conserve and educate. But they have to do it the right way, and be humane about it. The problem with building a good zoo is they need to be BIG. most places that have elephant and other big animal enclosures are just that, enclosures. Those guys need lots of room, and you can't do that in a little (relatively) building.

Feuer Frei! · 03-22-11, 08:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gargamel

Does this mean you are opposed to zoo's in general

I see the benefits of zoos, the educational purposes and research objectives, i guess i'm a bit of a softy, i have visited many zoos in my lifetime and no matter how often i go or been, i always take a sympathetic stance with the animals. Thoughts of 'i wish i could free you (as crazy as that sounds) or 'you poor thing'.

Quote:

or those people who collect the exotic animal's as pets?

Moreso, yes.
Inhumane.

Quote:

I think zoo's serve an important role in human culture, as they strive to help conserve and educate. But they have to do it the right way, and be humane about it. The problem with building a good zoo is they need to be BIG. most places that have elephant and other big animal enclosures are just that, enclosures. Those guys need lots of room, and you can't do that in a little (relatively) building.

Agreed.

AVGWarhawk · 03-22-11, 08:43 AM

It is sad. I watched the video. It looked like he was having a stroke IMO.

Skybird · 03-22-11, 09:59 AM

After they had the body on the table, doctors say the bear had a brain-based disease. Knut started to turn in place , then fell into the water, and drowned, says the news.

Zoos can be habitats for some animals only. It must not even be big animals like elephants to question the concept. Highgly intelligent animals like apes, social animals being held in small groups or alone, and big cats in cages, are just sad and deeply depressing sights to me. Also, dolphins and orcas in seaworlds.

But I enjoy big aquariums with small tropical fishes any time. But by "big" I mean "big", even if the fishes are small.

Feuer Frei! · 03-22-11, 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skybird

Zoos can be habitats for some animals only. It must not even be big animals like elephants to question the concept. Highgly intelligent animals like apes, social animals being held in small groups or alone, and big cats in cages, are just sad and deeply depressing sights to me. Also, dolphins and orcas in seaworlds.

I concur

Takeda Shingen · 03-22-11, 10:51 AM

I generally agree with the sadness of animal captivity. These animals have instincts to run, jump, swim, forage and hunt, and as they are deprived of this, they do appear unhappy in the cages and pens. That being said, the German zoo in questions was trying to provide Knut a place to live and be after being abandoned, so I don't fault them in their efforts.

Penguin · 03-22-11, 11:16 AM

I was sad!

RIP Knut!

I hope his story brought many people to think about the fate of these beautiful creatures.

That being said, I think many zoos in Germany improved over the last 20,30 years, though it certainly is not a natural surrounding, but at least they try to make an effort.
The worst are the small private zoos and the circusses....

I personally support a bear shelter, which takes mistreated bears and provides them an appropriate surrounding in a forest environment. You can't put these creatures back into the wild, as they never developed the skills to survive without help, but there they can live at least the rest of their lives without suffering.

Takeda Shingen · 03-22-11, 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Penguin

The worst are the small private zoos and the circusses....

Circuses are nortorious for their treatment of the animals.

Freiwillige · 03-22-11, 11:53 AM

autopsy report

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20110322...20110322144737

Torvald Von Mansee · 03-22-11, 12:10 PM

RIP

Feuer Frei! · 03-22-11, 07:48 PM

And now they have plans to stuff him and put him on display!

Quote:

as plans were revealed to have the polar stuffed and put on display in Berlin museum to allow fans a chance to say their farewells.

Why are we so caught up all the time in parading things?
Let it be, bury and respect the dead i say.

Penguin · 03-23-11, 06:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Feuer Frei!

And now they have plans to stuff him and put him on display!

This could become Berlin's very own Lenin...

03-22-11, 07:48 AM	#1
Gargamel Lucky Sailor Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Rome Posts: 4,273 Downloads: 81 Uploads: 0	Knut the Polar Bear Dies Young The star Polar bear at a German zoo died the other day. Rights activists have claimed the zoo mistreated him by basically domesticating him. http://news.discovery.com/animals/kn...ng-110321.html http://news.yahoo.com/s/yblog_theloo...olar-bear-knut As being the only polar bear ever born and raised in captivity because it's mother abandoned him, I think the inadvertent 'domestication' is almost unavoidable. Good pics though: __________________ Luck is a residue of Design.

03-22-11, 07:55 AM	#2
Feuer Frei! Navy Seal Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Valhalla Posts: 5,295 Downloads: 141 Uploads: 17	I read this the other day. Really sad tbh. I don't know about anyone else but it has never sat comfortably with me in regards to the domestication of wild-life. Or the attempts to domesticate and attempt to create a (un)natural habitat for the animal, in enclosed surrounds. I appreciate on the other hand animal welfare groups treating and/or nursing injured or abandoned or both back to strength or until they can fend for themselves out in the wild, out where they are really at home. That to me is humane. Either taking a animal out of it's habitat, it's natural surrounds, it's home and putting it into an enclosure for indefinite periods of time, without any apparent or intelligent and constructive and conducive reason behind it is...well...wrong. __________________ "History is the lies that the victors agree on"- Napoleon LINK TO MY SH 3 MODS

03-22-11, 08:43 AM	#5
AVGWarhawk Lucky Jack Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: In a 1954 Buick. Posts: 28,261 Downloads: 90 Uploads: 0	It is sad. I watched the video. It looked like he was having a stroke IMO. __________________ “You're painfully alive in a drugged and dying culture.” ― Richard Yates, Revolutionary Road

03-22-11, 09:59 AM	#6
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 42,636 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	After they had the body on the table, doctors say the bear had a brain-based disease. Knut started to turn in place , then fell into the water, and drowned, says the news. Zoos can be habitats for some animals only. It must not even be big animals like elephants to question the concept. Highgly intelligent animals like apes, social animals being held in small groups or alone, and big cats in cages, are just sad and deeply depressing sights to me. Also, dolphins and orcas in seaworlds. But I enjoy big aquariums with small tropical fishes any time. But by "big" I mean "big", even if the fishes are small. __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert.

03-22-11, 12:10 PM	#12
Torvald Von Mansee Sea Lord Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: CA4528 Posts: 1,693 Downloads: 3 Uploads: 0	RIP __________________ "You may not be interested in war, but war is interested in you" - Leon Trotsky

03-22-11, 10:51 AM	#8
Takeda Shingen Navy Seal Join Date: Mar 2000 Posts: 8,643 Downloads: 19 Uploads: 0	I generally agree with the sadness of animal captivity. These animals have instincts to run, jump, swim, forage and hunt, and as they are deprived of this, they do appear unhappy in the cages and pens. That being said, the German zoo in questions was trying to provide Knut a place to live and be after being abandoned, so I don't fault them in their efforts.

03-22-11, 11:16 AM	#9
Penguin Ocean Warrior Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Rheinische Republik Posts: 3,322 Downloads: 92 Uploads: 0	I was sad! RIP Knut! I hope his story brought many people to think about the fate of these beautiful creatures. That being said, I think many zoos in Germany improved over the last 20,30 years, though it certainly is not a natural surrounding, but at least they try to make an effort. The worst are the small private zoos and the circusses.... I personally support a bear shelter, which takes mistreated bears and provides them an appropriate surrounding in a forest environment. You can't put these creatures back into the wild, as they never developed the skills to survive without help, but there they can live at least the rest of their lives without suffering.

03-22-11, 11:53 AM	#11
Freiwillige The Old Man Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Phx. Az Posts: 1,458 Downloads: 24 Uploads: 0	autopsy report http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20110322...20110322144737