Utah - Home of the M1911

[Oberon]

Originally Posted by Platapus

I spy with my little eye a nit that needs to be picked.



AK 47 is not a machine gun.

The AK 47 is an Assault Rifle

Where ever there is a nit to be picked, I will be there.

You know originally I wrote SMG, then I looked it up and thought, no...the AK47 is not an SMG so it must be an MG...

[UnderseaLcpl]

Speaking of SMGs......

While the M1911 is a fine weapon and I agree with TorpX that the M9(Beretta 92F) is a poor replacement, I still have no idea why we didn't replace pistols with SMGs in US military service a long time ago. Pistols are very inflexible weapons that require a lot of training to use effectively in close combat, which is the only time one would ever use them.

[Penguin]

Originally Posted by UnderseaLcpl

Speaking of SMGs......

While the M1911 is a fine weapon and I agree with TorpX that the M9(Beretta 92F) is a poor replacement, I still have no idea why we didn't replace pistols with SMGs in US military service a long time ago. Pistols are very inflexible weapons that require a lot of training to use effectively in close combat, which is the only time one would ever use them.

Well a full-sized SMG would be too inflexible, but I guess you're more thinking about something like a PDW.
The reasons for that are probably only of financial nature - and the stockpile of pistols still in the arsenals.

[Platapus]

Originally Posted by UnderseaLcpl

I still have no idea why we didn't replace pistols with SMGs in US military service a long time ago.

Well, think about the requirements for a side arm.

One of them is the ability to be carried easily and with little encumbrance. Since the sidearm is a weapon of last resort, most of the time it is in the holster.

I would also opine that with the average amount of training that our military gets, a SMG would probably be more hazardous than a side arm.

Just go to any clearing barrel on a military base, look under it and count the holes caused by weapons that were unloaded.

[MaddogK]

Plastic guns are nice, but an empty 1911 will still crack your head open if someone hits you with it.

I'd love to have mine chambered for a .40 like the browning HP, but I'm not trading mine in for a double action, the .45 is a bit much for home defense. For accuracy I still prefer my old 9X18 makarov (2 hands NOT required).

[Growler]

Weight is a sign of reliability. And if it doesn't work, you can always hit him with it.

Let's see. Part of the legend of the 1911 is that it was designed to put a .45 slug into a target that wasn't being stopped by a .38, so here we are today, replacing that .45 cal with a 9mm (roughly .36 cal)... hmm...

[yubba]

Just put a new barrel and some springs in my great grandfathers Colt 1911 , yet to be fired, hasn't been fired in 60 years. It is in remarkable shape, United States property No. 518629.

[em2nought]

USA hasn't made really good decisions in quite awhile. 9mm's being a great example.

[Freiwillige]

Actually I just read an article that say's some of the recent hot load 9mm has reached the stopping power of the .45

Impressive as that sounds one has to wonder what a hot loaded .45 equates too? I'm thinking Pirate cannon!

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by MaddogK

...the .45 is a bit much for home defense.

I have a friend who swears that the .45 is the absolute best for home defense. His reasoning is that the bullet is heavy but slow, and less likely to go through walls and kill the wrong person. I don't know, I'm just sayin'. Of course he can choose which eye to hit at 20 feet, so I'm not him.

On the other hand, it's my opinion that the best handgun is the one you feel most comfortable with, so all size arguments are null and void.

[August]

Originally Posted by em2nought

USA hasn't made really good decisions in quite awhile. 9mm's being a great example.

It was part of a NATO ammo standardization deal. The other member countries pick up the 5.56mm and we adopt the 9mm.

[TLAM Strike]

Originally Posted by August

It was part of a NATO ammo standardization deal. The other member countries pick up the 5.56mm and we adopt the 9mm.

In hindsight a crummy deal both ways...

[TorpX]

Originally Posted by TLAM Strike

In hindsight a crummy deal both ways...

Yes, especially since NATO seems like such a dinosaur these days.

[Gargamel]

Originally Posted by Vendor

"Security is mostly a superstition. It does not exist in nature, nor do the children of men as a whole experience it. Avoiding danger is no safer in the long run than outright exposure. Life is either a daring adventure, or nothing." -Helen Keller

While I respect that quote, I gotta admit, to her, Avoiding danger was missing the couch in the morning.


Anyways.... to the M1911

[Growler]

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

I have a friend who swears that the .45 is the absolute best for home defense. His reasoning is that the bullet is heavy but slow, and less likely to go through walls and kill the wrong person. I don't know, I'm just sayin'. Of course he can choose which eye to hit at 20 feet, so I'm not him.

On the other hand, it's my opinion that the best handgun is the one you feel most comfortable with, so all size arguments are null and void.

On a similar note, I grew up a few doors down from a dude who owned a "liberated" P08. One night, he heard noises from the downstairs living room - someone had unlawfully entered the house. Dude's pop goes to the top of the step and chambers a round. In the otherwise quiet house, the sound was apparently loud and very distinctive. Perp vanished with their toaster by jumping through the front sunroom window.

I'd also heard it said the the best home defense weapon was an unloaded pump shotgun. Just rack the slide once and watch the bad guy(s) leave, then analyze the stain they left on the floor for DNA.