Im about ready to slam my head into the wall!!!

So Ive decided I need help, the past few careers Ive gotten, Ive been off'd in my first patrol, all because of Convoys. I dont get it, I approach at night on the surface far enough away from any ship and magically destroyers know Im there (this is before radar, I start in 40 to avoid the seas east of Britain)

I approach submerged and bam they still know Im there, (I know theyre not listening because I know they either stop and listen or move and use asdic, and they are always moving unless they know your there and there is more than 1 destroyer after you)

So ive decided I need some good ole' coaching with convoys, can anybody direct me to a thread that has lots of tips strategys or etc on convoy attacks or could anyone suggest a few things to me themselves?? I

Im tired of lone merchants and I want to make the move to the big leagues!

[the.terrabyte.pirate]

Originally Posted by USNSRCaseySmith

So Ive decided I need help, the past few careers Ive gotten, Ive been off'd in my first patrol, all because of Convoys. I dont get it, I approach at night on the surface far enough away from any ship and magically destroyers know Im there (this is before radar, I start in 40 to avoid the seas east of Britain)

How far is "far enough away"? Even at night, on the surface you can be spotted. It also depends on how clear things are.

Originally Posted by USNSRCaseySmith

I approach submerged and bam they still know Im there, (I know theyre not listening because I know they either stop and listen or move and use asdic, and they are always moving unless they know your there and there is more than 1 destroyer after you)

That's not true. DD's can use their hydrophones while moving just like you can. Are you switching to silent running?

Originally Posted by USNSRCaseySmith

So ive decided I need some good ole' coaching with convoys, can anybody direct me to a thread that has lots of tips strategys or etc on convoy attacks or could anyone suggest a few things to me themselves?? I

Im tired of lone merchants and I want to make the move to the big leagues!

My method (quite successful so far)

On a clear night: I never go any closer than 5-6 km to the convoy. This is usually far enough to keep me away from the escorting destroyers, but still close enough to have a reasonable chance of hitting something if my speed calcs are up to scratch. I'm using the fast 90 method, so differences in range are irrelevant. I'm on the surface, but I'm at decks awash to lower my profile. I fire all my eels at once. Once fired, I gun the boat away to be somewhere else when they hit. As soon as the first eels hit, I dive, go on silent running and reduce my speed to slow. Usually by then I'm far enough away by the time the DD's come looking that they're no-where near me. If I think they're too close, I'll reduce speed to 1 knot or less

On a clear day: Again never closer than 5-6 km from the convoy. I'm at peri depth and tracking them on my hydrophones. I'm at silent running, and never faster than slow. If I've done things right, I'm already in position for an attack using fast 90. Periscope stays DOWN for the majority of the time. I'll fire my eels all at once, change course and depth, stay at ahead slow, and pretend to be a hole in the water. I find it takes too long to completely reverse course, so I'll usually change the rudder to 10 - 15 degrees so my speed doesn't drop until I'm 90 degrees to my previous direction. After the eels hit I reduce speed to less than 1 knot. Again usually by the time the DD's come looking I'm far enough away from my point of firing that they come no-where near me.

9 times out of 10 though I will NOT attack on a clear day. I will wait until a clear night. The only reason I would attack on a clear day is if I have no way of shadowing it until then (such as proximity of land, or speed of the convoy).

On a murky day / night: I'm a lot closer at periscope depth, silent running, less than 1 knot. I've already plotted the course of the convoy using hydrophones, and have "set a trap" by getting into position early on the surface. I'll pretend to be a hole in the water while the lead escort passes. Once it's passed (and shrouded by the fog / rain) I'll surface to decks awash if the weather allows it, or to the surface if it's rough (at reduced speed). Once on the surface I'll move closer to the convoy at speed. I'll take my shots, then surface fully and gun the boat hard to get away. My goal is to vanish into the murk before the DD's can react. Keep gunning it directly away from the convoy. You have a better chance of escaping on the surface in this situation. Diving will only reduce your speed dramatically, and keep you in the area longer. The plan is to be far enough away by the time the escorts reach your firing point that they can't see you. The murk is your friend. By the time they work out where you were, you're already setting up for another go at the convoy.

On a poor visibility day/night: You know the ones. Wind at 15 knots. Rain. Visibility down to a few hundred meters. I normally don't attack in this weather. I find that I need to be on the surface to get close enough to see anything, and I seem to get sprung by DD's a lot. These are the strategies that others follow in these circumstances.

You want to be a lot closer to the convoy than normal. Your goal is to get into the lanes of the convoy. You need to be far enough away to avoid the lead escort, stationary, silent and at periscope depth so you can follow it on the hydrophones, but you don't want to be so far away that you can't get into the bulk of the convoy before it passes. Once the lead escort has passed (hopefully without detecting you) you surface slowly, then gun it into the convoy. Ideally you want to be in the midst of the convoy lanes before the edge escorts get too close. Once in the convoy lanes you take shots at whatever you can, remembering that you need at least 350m for the fish to arm, and that that distance leaves you at great risk of being run down by another merchant in the adjacent column. Once you've taken your shots, plot a course out the back of the convoy, slow and silent. Here the plan is to let the remaining ships in the convoy act as a shield while you change your depth. Their bulk will prevent depth charge runs, and their noise will hopefully mask your own. By the time you're out of the back of the convoy, you change direction to avoid the tail end escort (if they're still in position), and creep away.

For an excellent resource I'm referring you to Brag's site:

http://www.freewebs.com/kielman/

[Edit] Some of my fellow kauleins in their large boats with their decadent torpedo capacity will take out the escorts first, and then go to town on the convoy with impunity. In my Type II however I play a "hit and run" game. My 5 eels need to count.

Ive infiltrated convoys before at night on a clear night and come within 500 meters before of ships and no one had a clue I was there. Im talking Ill be over 1 to 2km out and all of a sudden sky flares go up and lights come on.

And I swear I read a manual on evading DDs in GWX and it said verbatum (Destroyers either are using ASDIC or listening if theyre sitting still, never both however)

[the.terrabyte.pirate]

Originally Posted by USNSRCaseySmith

And I swear I read a manual on evading DDs in GWX and it said verbatum (Destroyers either are using ASDIC or listening if theyre sitting still, never both however)

The only reference I can find that relates to this is on page b-19 of the manual:

"ASW ships in Silent Hunter III will either listen passively with hydrophones or actively search with ASDIC/sonar while your U-boat tries to avoid detection."

There's nothing in the manual about them sitting still.

well either way I know better now lol. I think Im going to start in 39 out of wilhelmshaven instead for a change. thanks for the advice

[Gargamel]

I like to get inside the convoy and knife fight.

Setup 5-10km in front of the convoy, submerged, with at least one column having a starboard AOB, and at least one column having a Port AOB. Meaning, they will pass on either side of you. But don't go right up the middle, as the lead escort will run you over. If your just to the side of him (about 1km), and at all stop or 50rpm, he'll slide right by and never see you.

As the convoy drives past, you can pick you juiciest target for the first strike, and secondary target, and a stern target if your in a VII or IX. Then when all hell breaks loose, the escorts have a helluva time finding you in all the traffic, and you should slide right out the back without being detected.