"Islam is like a drug"

Skybird · 09-17-10, 11:33 AM

http://www.spiegel.de/international/...717589,00.html

I use to not launch threads on Islam as often anymore as I used to do years ago. I almost do not do it anymore at all, just react to other people's threads. But this interview is about a person that I recently have referred to repeatedly in two threads, and that I hold in a certain ammount of respect, althought I do not agree with anything he thinks and says, and I also do not agree with his views of that you can take Sharia and Quran away from Islam and still call what is left as "Islam" anymore (he thinks Islam can be reformed by deleting major parts of it, while I think in poltiica effect it is monolithic (he even confirms that himself in the interview), cannot be reformed by picking the rosins only, but must be replaced), and finally I think that he is not being fully consistent with his claims and somewhat contradicts himself when he says he has left major essential content of Islam behind him, but still insists on seeing himself as a Muslim. Where he does so, he is mixing up ethnic and cultural origin, with ideologic education.

However.

I have experienced him live some time ago and chatted with him for some minutes or so, I liked him for his calm and polite behavior, and I think that if Muhammedan communities would listen more to people like him and would bring up more thinking minds like him, problems for all of us would be significantly smaller.

Sometimes one must not agree on every single detail - and still can be able to come to terms with each other. This is a good man. We would desperately need many more like him - to educate the ignorrant masses in the Islamic world - and to replace the many idiotic know-it-alls on our side of the river who carelessly trade our freedoms and identities and dignity away, because they do not understand that only the strong are able to practice tolerance if they wish (or not): the weak never are tolerant, but just suffer what they must.

http://www.spiegel.de/international/...717589,00.html

Takeda Shingen · 09-17-10, 11:36 AM

antikristuseke · 09-17-10, 11:41 AM

Religion self contradictory, surely this is a jest.
Like it or not skybird, religions change over time, christianity was a bloodthirsty religion in the past but has mellowed out for the most part, the same will happen to islam. It is not going to happen overnight though.

Skybird · 09-17-10, 11:52 AM

Islam is not a religion like Christianity or Judaism, and even more: it is more political than religious an ideology anyway. This comparision that you try, is tried very often - but it is completely ignoring the nature of Islam. Primarily it is a political movement - the religion only has a supporting secondary function.

As long as this is not understood in the West, any approach to and any understanding of Islam must necessarily fail from beginning on. Even more, in our secular culture that differs between religion and politics, we render ourselves as defenceless to Islam's political movement, that it tries to make untouchable to opposition and criticism and questioning, under the protecting umbrella of guaranteed Western freedom of religious practicing. This is not what our constitutional guarantees for freedom of religion have been meant for: it is not meant to make political agendas unavailable for critical review, opposition and political dispute.

antikristuseke · 09-17-10, 11:58 AM

Christianity was allso more of a political ideology in the past, at least at the higher levels, then the darndest thing happened, it changed.

Tchocky · 09-17-10, 12:01 PM

I think it's time to replace this record player.

STEED · 09-17-10, 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tchocky

I think it's time to replace this record player.

What with?

A tape deck?

antikristuseke · 09-17-10, 12:11 PM

I vote for an 8-track

Penguin · 09-17-10, 12:12 PM

well, old Marx already knew that 150 years ago

However indeed an interesting interview and one of the religious persons who has some views which I as an agnostic can support. Of course he also gets threats from radicals

In this interview (available only in german) http://www.heise.de/tp/r4/artikel/32/32217/1.html he states that he considers the spiritual side of islam as timeless as well as he says that the "earthly-juristic" side belongs into the 7th century and has nothing to lose in the 21st century.

HunterICX · 09-17-10, 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by antikristuseke

I vote for an 8-track

an Edison cylinder

HunterICX

STEED · 09-17-10, 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HunterICX

an Edison cylinder

HunterICX

AVGWarhawk · 09-17-10, 12:38 PM

Where is Tribesman?

nikimcbee · 09-17-10, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by STEED

+2

JU_88 · 09-17-10, 12:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skybird

"Islam is like a drug (bla bla bla muslims eat babies etc etc.)"

I think you are the one on drugs.
I'm bored with your nonsense. (As is everyone else by the looks of it.)

TLAM Strike · 09-17-10, 12:56 PM

Islam is not a drug. Drugs make you feel good and mellow out, every one on Islam I've seen is yelling nonsense, blowing themselves up, and burning stuff.

Ok maybe Islam is a bad trip...

09-17-10, 11:33 AM	#1
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 42,615 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	"Islam is like a drug" http://www.spiegel.de/international/...717589,00.html I use to not launch threads on Islam as often anymore as I used to do years ago. I almost do not do it anymore at all, just react to other people's threads. But this interview is about a person that I recently have referred to repeatedly in two threads, and that I hold in a certain ammount of respect, althought I do not agree with anything he thinks and says, and I also do not agree with his views of that you can take Sharia and Quran away from Islam and still call what is left as "Islam" anymore (he thinks Islam can be reformed by deleting major parts of it, while I think in poltiica effect it is monolithic (he even confirms that himself in the interview), cannot be reformed by picking the rosins only, but must be replaced), and finally I think that he is not being fully consistent with his claims and somewhat contradicts himself when he says he has left major essential content of Islam behind him, but still insists on seeing himself as a Muslim. Where he does so, he is mixing up ethnic and cultural origin, with ideologic education. However. I have experienced him live some time ago and chatted with him for some minutes or so, I liked him for his calm and polite behavior, and I think that if Muhammedan communities would listen more to people like him and would bring up more thinking minds like him, problems for all of us would be significantly smaller. Sometimes one must not agree on every single detail - and still can be able to come to terms with each other. This is a good man. We would desperately need many more like him - to educate the ignorrant masses in the Islamic world - and to replace the many idiotic know-it-alls on our side of the river who carelessly trade our freedoms and identities and dignity away, because they do not understand that only the strong are able to practice tolerance if they wish (or not): the weak never are tolerant, but just suffer what they must. http://www.spiegel.de/international/...717589,00.html __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert. Last edited by Skybird; 09-17-10 at 11:57 AM.

09-17-10, 11:52 AM	#4
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 42,615 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	Islam is not a religion like Christianity or Judaism, and even more: it is more political than religious an ideology anyway. This comparision that you try, is tried very often - but it is completely ignoring the nature of Islam. Primarily it is a political movement - the religion only has a supporting secondary function. As long as this is not understood in the West, any approach to and any understanding of Islam must necessarily fail from beginning on. Even more, in our secular culture that differs between religion and politics, we render ourselves as defenceless to Islam's political movement, that it tries to make untouchable to opposition and criticism and questioning, under the protecting umbrella of guaranteed Western freedom of religious practicing. This is not what our constitutional guarantees for freedom of religion have been meant for: it is not meant to make political agendas unavailable for critical review, opposition and political dispute. __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert.

09-17-10, 12:01 PM	#6
Tchocky Navy Seal Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 5,874 Downloads: 6 Uploads: 0	I think it's time to replace this record player. __________________ [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

09-17-10, 12:38 PM	#12
AVGWarhawk Lucky Jack Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: In a 1954 Buick. Posts: 28,255 Downloads: 90 Uploads: 0	Where is Tribesman? __________________ “You're painfully alive in a drugged and dying culture.” ― Richard Yates, Revolutionary Road

09-17-10, 12:56 PM	#15
TLAM Strike Navy Seal Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Rochester, New York Posts: 8,633 Downloads: 29 Uploads: 6	Islam is not a drug. Drugs make you feel good and mellow out, every one on Islam I've seen is yelling nonsense, blowing themselves up, and burning stuff. Ok maybe Islam is a bad trip... __________________

09-17-10, 11:36 AM	#2
Takeda Shingen Navy Seal Join Date: Mar 2000 Posts: 8,643 Downloads: 19 Uploads: 0

09-17-10, 11:41 AM	#3
antikristuseke Silent Hunter Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Estland Posts: 4,330 Downloads: 3 Uploads: 0	Religion self contradictory, surely this is a jest. Like it or not skybird, religions change over time, christianity was a bloodthirsty religion in the past but has mellowed out for the most part, the same will happen to islam. It is not going to happen overnight though.

09-17-10, 11:58 AM	#5
antikristuseke Silent Hunter Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Estland Posts: 4,330 Downloads: 3 Uploads: 0	Christianity was allso more of a political ideology in the past, at least at the higher levels, then the darndest thing happened, it changed.

09-17-10, 12:11 PM	#8
antikristuseke Silent Hunter Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Estland Posts: 4,330 Downloads: 3 Uploads: 0	I vote for an 8-track

09-17-10, 12:12 PM	#9
Penguin Ocean Warrior Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Rheinische Republik Posts: 3,322 Downloads: 92 Uploads: 0	well, old Marx already knew that 150 years ago However indeed an interesting interview and one of the religious persons who has some views which I as an agnostic can support. Of course he also gets threats from radicals In this interview (available only in german) http://www.heise.de/tp/r4/artikel/32/32217/1.html he states that he considers the spiritual side of islam as timeless as well as he says that the "earthly-juristic" side belongs into the 7th century and has nothing to lose in the 21st century.