Who does this guy think he is?!

[GoldenRivet]

Originally Posted by antikristuseke

In what way?

basically by saying we have lost, and taking the position of "War in Afghanistan?... oh never mind that, we will just reverse our policy and make nice with the enemy now..."

[Schroeder]

Originally Posted by Kapt Z

Wait a minute. You're not talking about bombing holy cities again are you?

I hope not, that would just be such a nice thing for the radicals to happen. Finaly they would have the means for an all out war with plenty of support.

[Enigma]

basically by saying we have lost, and taking the position of "War in Afghanistan?... oh never mind that, we will just reverse our policy and make nice with the enemy now..."

He didn't, though. He said we are not winning, not that we lost. I also don't see where the article suggests he wants to make nice with the enemy.

He says...

"The national government still has not gained the confidence of the Afghan people," he said. "And so it's going to be critical for us to not only, get through these national elections to stabilize the security situation, but we've got to recast our policy so that our military, diplomatic and development goals are all aligned to ensure that al-Qaida and extremists that would do us harm don't have the kinds of safe havens that allow them to operate."

He also says (bold mine)

There may be opportunities to reach out to moderates in the Taliban, but the situation in Afghanistan is more complicated than the challenges the American military faced in Iraq, Obama said.
U.S. troops were able to persuade Sunni Muslim insurgents in Iraq to cooperate in some instances because they had been alienated by the tactics of al-Qaida terrorists.

The article also says that Gen. David Petraeus has discussed this as his own idea for months, Robert Gates is on board, etc.

So, I'd have to say with respect, the twilight zone, wtf, and Obama slapping dead soldiers in the face? Come on, maaaan.....

basically by saying we have lost

Would that be like the pentagon studies from the 50's& early60's where the US military said indo-china couldn't be won .
hey you're right the politicians and generals proved them studies wrong didn't they.
Stupid bloody can-do attitude...bloody and stupid being the important words.

But hold on didn't the measures to temporarily solve the problem in Iraq to facilitate the hand over involve paying the sunni insurgents to stop attacking the coilition ? Did Bush bitch slap every dead serviceman by doing that ?

[GoldenRivet]

I live in a military family... and from all accounts i have heard so far, this Obama guy is full of sh*t.

but... your right guys

i was wrong and i apologize

we should give up, turn tail and run and hope our civilian centers never get attacked on the scale of 9/11 again.

because hope is enough right?

we should turn several years of combating evil into a single moment of "never mind.. forget we were ever mad at you"

we should also dump trillions of our hard earned dollars into a big federal bucket and just hand it over to the poor crack heads, and irresponsible welfare mothers while we are at it.

i suppose we should kill unborn children too.

I guess the leftist policies are the best policies after all?

am i the only person who takes issue with this stuff???

[fatty]

Originally Posted by GoldenRivet

am i the only person who takes issue with this stuff???

Unfortunately, no, you have an army of morons right behind you determined to connect abortion and negotiating with moderate cells of the Taliban insurgency.

Are you for real? Goddamn.

[GoldenRivet]

Originally Posted by fatty

Unfortunately, no, you have an army of morons right behind you determined to connect abortion and negotiating with moderate cells of the Taliban insurgency.

Are you for real? Goddamn.

wow dude

anger much?

Im not connecting the two issues.

im calling out multiple leftist issues.

thanks for the good laugh though



besides cannuck... what difference should it make to you what my views on the political stance of my nation are?

[joegrundman]

So what would you say are the key differences between this proposed strategy in Afghanistan and the policy Petraeus followed in Iraq (of making deals with various groups that were formerly united in opposition)?

[joegrundman]

Im not connecting the two issues.

im calling out multiple leftist issues.

and what's the point of that apart from demonstrating your "anger much", if you aren't trying to connect issues?

[Enigma]

So, your saying that the President (or, "this Obama guy") Secretary Gates and Gen Patreus believe:

we should give up, turn tail and run and hope our civilian centers never get attacked on the scale of 9/11 again.

Your posts have simply been a blatant mis-characterization of an article you posted.


Whatayagonnado.

[antikristuseke]

Originally Posted by GoldenRivet

I live in a military family... and from all accounts i have heard so far, this Obama guy is full of sh*t.

but... your right guys

i was wrong and i apologize

we should give up, turn tail and run and hope our civilian centers never get attacked on the scale of 9/11 again.

because hope is enough right?

we should turn several years of combating evil into a single moment of "never mind.. forget we were ever mad at you"

we should also dump trillions of our hard earned dollars into a big federal bucket and just hand it over to the poor crack heads, and irresponsible welfare mothers while we are at it.

i suppose we should kill unborn children too.

I guess the leftist policies are the best policies after all?

am i the only person who takes issue with this stuff???

Strawman much?

For the first part, NOONE is claiming that all troops should pull out imediately and we should hope that they do not attack, whoever says that is an idiot. Allso those who think that just by keeping the fight going, without looking for possible diplomatic solutions, it can be won is an idiot, want to see evidence of that, look at Israel.
As for abortion, which is an act of grater cruelty, aborting a fetus or bringing an unwanted child into this world?
Sidenote to this, abstinance only sexual education does not work, demonstrably so. It is like communism in that regards, nice idea, **** in practice.

[GoldenRivet]

So let me get this straight.

By exercising my right to disagree with the president I'm an idiot and a strawman?

The Taliban is the enemy... Why take 30 years of non-negotiation policy and just reverse it ?

[GoldenRivet]

Originally Posted by antikristuseke

which is an act of grater cruelty, aborting a fetus or bringing an unwanted child into this world?

There is no such thing as an unwanted child.

Someone - Somewhere wants a child in their life

[antikristuseke]

Originally Posted by GoldenRivet

So let me get this straight.

By exercising my right to disagree with the president I'm an idiot and a strawman?

The Taliban is the enemy... Why take 30 years of non-negotiation policy and just reverse it ?

Thats not what I said. The strawman was your misrepresentation of the article posted, instead of arguing what was written you constructed a position that was not expressed and argued against that and I never called you an idiot. As to why change the position, 30 years of just fighting clearly has not worked, alternatives have to be sought.

There is no such thing as an unwanted child.

Someone - Somewhere wants a child in their life

While this is probably true that someone somewhere wants a child in their life, it is completely irrelevant to the point of having the right to abort an unwanted pregnancy.
If everything was that simple there would'nt be loads of children living under government care.

[CaptainHaplo]

GR - take a moment here mate. I understand the frustration - but you kind of implied a connection between other left wing issues and this - which isn't connected other than it being hard left agenda items. I understand where your coming from, but the post kind of appeared to be throwing things out there that aren't relevant to the topic you started. While I can probably agree with you on most of the issues - lets try to keep it on one so we can have a serious discussion. Otherwise it turns into a shouting match between ideologies - when it should be a discussion of specific ideas.

As a former wearer of a funny green suit for too many hours a day, for too many years, I don't agree with the policy. BUT - I don't see it as a slap in the face to the brave men and women who have given up life, limb or time to fight for the interests of this country. As a soldier, your duty is to carry out your oath to the country, and as long as your not violating that oath, follow the directives of the duly elected President. The President has changed, in a valid election, and thus the directives have changed. That does not reduce the sacrifice already given.

Tribesman - am I ignorant of history? Not on your life. I am a student of it. If you would like a little insight on the middle east and how terrorists cannot be trusted - here are a few links for you to review.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mitche..._b_154021.html

Hamas breaking an Egyptian brokered ceasfire.

http://olehgirl.com/?p=1867

Also - from a witness at the time....

And lastly.....

http://www.peacewithrealism.org/pdc/niceguys.htm

A historical view of a hudna and its true purpose - confirmed by the actions of Mohammed himself, as well as a more modern leader, Yasser Arafat in his stated intent to NOT abide by the Oslo peace accord.

I could give you links all day long. No, Israel is not blamesless, but the vast majority of duplicity is not perpetrated by them, but upon them. This is using one single group as an example, though I could do the same for others.

If you want a bit more on the history of the "honor" that Mohammed showed - check here:

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/Mu...-hudaibiya.htm

The end states it all - if your dealing with a muslim - their RELIGION says its ok for them to make an agreement and break it if its expedient, as long as the other person is a non-muslim.

That means any treaty or truce you make - is sure to be broken as soon as the follower of Islam feels its expedient. When you figure this out, you realize that open agreements, openly arrived at, are useless when dealing with the people of the middle east.

And just to keep some here from blowing off the sources, I even avoided putting anything in from foxnews.com.