OT: Comparing old chess CPUs: Z80, 1802, 6502, H8, 68000

[Skybird]

I never told you, but I am a low-intensity collector of old chess computers, years around 78-84 - the magix boxes that kept me wanting them when I was at school.

A friend of mine is a collector too, but he has many more computers than me, more than a hundred, for me it is only roughly one dozen . We wondered if it is possible to have a tournament in which only the quality of the machine's software is the deciding issue, not the technical specs. For that we wonder if giving a machine only half as much time for calculation when it has twice as much MHz, well, if this makes sense? Also, does anyone know to what degree the folliwng processor's capabilities compare to each other, so that they can be expressed in calculation potential ratios too each other, I hope you see what I mean!?

Z80, 1802, 6502, H8, 68000

I found much material on these CPU, but these were technical manuals which I were not able to understand, my technical background knowledge is far too limited.

And in general, does it make sense to say that roughly a 16 Bit CPU calculates twice as much bits per second than an 8 Bit CPU? We ignore different RAM siozes and hash tables (which were not that common in those early years anyway).The general idea is that the faster a chess computer is, the lesser time it shall be given, so that both machines in a duel are equalized that way, and their software has more room to make the major difference in scoring results.

We want to have a tournament in which every machine plays with it's own individual time reserve that is tailored so that technological speed differences between hardware are somewhat filtered out.

It's funny what kind of chess these early gladiators were doing! Much more entertaining than modern PC killer applications. I feel like playing against HAL when starting my Fritz or Hiarcs software...

[Onkel Neal]

I still have my Chess computer game from 1995, we called it Saitek

[Skybird]

That' no computer type, but a company, the called their computers "Kasparov". Miami-based Fidelity/Consumenta Electronics was bought by German H+G in the early 90s ("Mephisto"), later H+G was swallowed by Saitek, forming a co-labelled product line "Kasparov/Mephisto".

I personally always liked the Mephistos and the Chess Challengers the most. The Chess Challenger Sensory Champion was a fantastic design, bringing the best of the CC Voice and CC Sensory together. The Mephisto Exclusive sensory board (wood, 40x40) is my most favourite computer desgin ever.

Star in my collection is an old Sargon 2.5 ARB (with a minor defect in power supply, unfortunately) - everyone's desire in those good old times - gotta miss them... Lookin for a CC Sensory Champion, currently.

[porphy]

It's funny what kind of chess these early gladiators were doing! Much more entertaining than modern PC killer applications. I feel like playing against HAL when starting my Fritz or Hiarcs software...

I can't stand playing blitz against Fritz anymore... I just get crushed. It's like trying to outrun a sports car in a sprint event. Against human opponents it's at least possible to use a bit of psychology warfare on the board when you know all is lost against a computer.... :|\

Cheers Porphy

[Skybird]

Porphy,

use that level that in the German version is named "Freundschaftspartie" (friendship match). It is not the sparring-level (Shi-F, if I am not wrong). Here Fritz will slightly adjust the handicap with each match you play, depending on your performance. While the changes are big after just four or five matches, they become more and more precise and smaller the more matches you have played. after some time you will have found Fritz adopting himself to your performance level very nicely, and automatically increase the challenge carefully if you got used to it and always win.

One of the many very valuable options in the Fritz interface. I almost always use this level myself.

[porphy]

Thanks for that tip Skybird. I didn't know about this function. Sounds really good.

Now, if we only could get Fritz to feel the grim reality of loosing a game of chess... Nothing is hidden, no luck involved, and still the whole position disintegrates before your eyes... I wish "him" to experience this.

Cheers Porphy

[Wim Libaers]

Some variants of these are still available commercially. The Ti-83 calculators use a Z80 compatible processor, the Ti-89 and Ti-92 a 68000. (of course they are used in other devices too, but in the calculators you can still do your own programming on them)

For 8-bit and 16-bit, there are different definitions. It usually refers to instruction word size (i.e. the largest number size that the processor calculates with), but is sometimes used to refer to bus width (largest number that the processor can get from main memory at once).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/68000

[Onkel Neal]

Originally Posted by Skybird

That' no computer type, but a company, the called their computers "Kasparov". Miami-based Fidelity/Consumenta Electronics was bought by German H+G in the early 90s ("Mephisto"), later H+G was swallowed by Saitek, forming a co-labelled product line "Kasparov/Mephisto".

No, you don't understand. I'm not say what type it was, I'm saying it was a chess computer and we called it Saitek. Like we called our dog Marcus, we called the chess computer Saitek.

[Skybird]

Strange Texan habits Over here we simply use to call them "blöde Dinger".

Saitek, btw, was formerly known as "SciSys" (the company, not your box).