Is Norwegian merchant traffic wrong???

Wulfmann · 07-07-05, 11:22 AM

But, the traffic in SH3 is commercial traffic moving along the Norwegian coast and even into German occupied ports. Some how I think that trade was stopped by the, I don't know, WAR!!! LOL
The traffic along the coast was german traffic fater the fall of Norway. While I switched most to german in my RND.mis file, I left a few to be considered resistance ships meaning I have to carefully check them out and not open up without being very cautious.
If there was British traffic in the Baltic or German traffic in St Georges Vhannel it would be no different than this is, IMO
Nice info on your experiences.
Wulfmann

Jace11 · 07-07-05, 12:32 PM

Good find. I put all the traffic from September 1940 under a German flag till the end of the war.

I have many Norwegian ships in my convoys in the RND layer so changing these to axis or neutral wasnt an alternative.

Shadow9216 · 07-07-05, 12:48 PM

What effect, if any, would this have on friendly air attacks? If I see a Norwegian ship heading for Bergen in '43, and report it, I have a reasonable chance of it being sunk by the Luftwaffe, correct? Does changing the flag change the AI? Or does the AI still "read" it as a Norwegian, although it's flying a German flag?

Jace11 · 07-07-05, 01:24 PM

When I said putting "them under German flag" I mean't just changing their nationality to German. Done in the editor. German planes will not bomb German ships so no prob.

Shadow9216 · 07-07-05, 02:15 PM

Ah, I see! You meant it in the proper maritime parlance of "registry of a vessel within a specific country" vice the computer terminology of "I added a BB to Mexico in the roster" :P

Wulfmann · 07-07-05, 02:56 PM

I was referring to the traffic along the Norwegian coast. I also have put Norwegian ships in the convoys. But, I did leave a few around Norway so I would have to be a custom inspector while passing through.
I was thinking of changing a few to German 4 or 6 to see some ships that really might operate there. Might even catch them intercepting some allied ships.
Wulfmann

07-07-05, 11:49 PM

likely the Germans in those Nordic harbors are part of a blackmarket and on the take.

Shigawire · 07-08-05, 08:09 AM

What happens to Norwegian shipping traffic in SH3 should affect the game to a very strong degree.

It is worth of note that at the outbreak of the war, Norway had the fourth largest merchant fleet in the world - after the UK, USA and Japan.

I don't know if this is reflected in SH3 at all?

Wulfmann · 07-08-05, 01:04 PM

I did not know that, I would have thought Greece would be number four and actually counting all the Greek ships registered in other places to avoid taxes I believe they were. But, we might consider those tax shelter nations as add ons for fun particularly if we can still hear bazouki music and smell the Ouzo from them, LOL
However, bringing that to light I will add more Norwegian ships to my convoys in the RND files.

Wulfmann

jasonb885 · 07-08-05, 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shigawire

What happens to Norwegian shipping traffic in SH3 should affect the game to a very strong degree.

It is worth of note that at the outbreak of the war, Norway had the fourth largest merchant fleet in the world - after the UK, USA and Japan.

I don't know if this is reflected in SH3 at all?

You'll find many Norwegian ships in ImprovedConvoys!

Shigawire · 07-09-05, 04:06 AM

Yes, today the "largest merchant fleet" list is:

#1 China
#2 Russia
#3 Greece
#4 Norway
#5 Japan

The golden period in Norwegian shipping was in 1880 when Norway had the 3rd largest merchant fleet in the world.

What is "ImprovedConvoys"? Some mod I haven't noticed yet?

Can you me point me in the direction of more information and perhaps download? :hmm:

Wulfmann · 07-09-05, 10:17 AM

http://www.subsim.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=39977

I started a new discussion on the unreal (which is actually more real than RUB's RND) improved convoys. being Norwegian you will love all the extra Norwegian ships in the convoys.

Wulfmann

Wulfmann · 07-09-05, 10:19 AM

I am not sure if it still applies but a few years ago I read that if all the Greek ships registered elsewhere to avoid taxes were under the Greek flag, they would actually be number one on that list.
But, that was a few years ago so may longer apply.
Wulfmann

07-07-05, 02:56 PM	#6
Wulfmann Ace of the Deep Join Date: May 2005 Location: Florida Posts: 1,010 Downloads: 1 Uploads: 0	I was referring to the traffic along the Norwegian coast. I also have put Norwegian ships in the convoys. But, I did leave a few around Norway so I would have to be a custom inspector while passing through. I was thinking of changing a few to German 4 or 6 to see some ships that really might operate there. Might even catch them intercepting some allied ships. Wulfmann __________________ "The right to keep and bear arms should not be infringed upon, if only to prevent tyranny in government" Thomas Jefferson,; Constitutional debates

07-08-05, 01:04 PM	#9
Wulfmann Ace of the Deep Join Date: May 2005 Location: Florida Posts: 1,010 Downloads: 1 Uploads: 0	I did not know that, I would have thought Greece would be number four and actually counting all the Greek ships registered in other places to avoid taxes I believe they were. But, we might consider those tax shelter nations as add ons for fun particularly if we can still hear bazouki music and smell the Ouzo from them, LOL However, bringing that to light I will add more Norwegian ships to my convoys in the RND files. Wulfmann __________________ "The right to keep and bear arms should not be infringed upon, if only to prevent tyranny in government" Thomas Jefferson,; Constitutional debates

07-09-05, 10:17 AM	#12
Wulfmann Ace of the Deep Join Date: May 2005 Location: Florida Posts: 1,010 Downloads: 1 Uploads: 0	http://www.subsim.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=39977 I started a new discussion on the unreal (which is actually more real than RUB's RND) improved convoys. being Norwegian you will love all the extra Norwegian ships in the convoys. Wulfmann __________________ "The right to keep and bear arms should not be infringed upon, if only to prevent tyranny in government" Thomas Jefferson,; Constitutional debates

07-09-05, 10:19 AM	#13
Wulfmann Ace of the Deep Join Date: May 2005 Location: Florida Posts: 1,010 Downloads: 1 Uploads: 0	I am not sure if it still applies but a few years ago I read that if all the Greek ships registered elsewhere to avoid taxes were under the Greek flag, they would actually be number one on that list. But, that was a few years ago so may longer apply. Wulfmann __________________ "The right to keep and bear arms should not be infringed upon, if only to prevent tyranny in government" Thomas Jefferson,; Constitutional debates

07-07-05, 11:22 AM	#1
Wulfmann Ace of the Deep Join Date: May 2005 Location: Florida Posts: 1,010 Downloads: 1 Uploads: 0	But, the traffic in SH3 is commercial traffic moving along the Norwegian coast and even into German occupied ports. Some how I think that trade was stopped by the, I don't know, WAR!!! LOL The traffic along the coast was german traffic fater the fall of Norway. While I switched most to german in my RND.mis file, I left a few to be considered resistance ships meaning I have to carefully check them out and not open up without being very cautious. If there was British traffic in the Baltic or German traffic in St Georges Vhannel it would be no different than this is, IMO Nice info on your experiences. Wulfmann __________________ "The right to keep and bear arms should not be infringed upon, if only to prevent tyranny in government" Thomas Jefferson,; Constitutional debates

07-07-05, 12:32 PM	#2
Jace11 Seasoned Skipper Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: UK Posts: 683 Downloads: 104 Uploads: 1	Good find. I put all the traffic from September 1940 under a German flag till the end of the war. I have many Norwegian ships in my convoys in the RND layer so changing these to axis or neutral wasnt an alternative.

07-07-05, 12:48 PM	#3
Shadow9216 Frogman Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 296 Downloads: 91 Uploads: 0	What effect, if any, would this have on friendly air attacks? If I see a Norwegian ship heading for Bergen in '43, and report it, I have a reasonable chance of it being sunk by the Luftwaffe, correct? Does changing the flag change the AI? Or does the AI still "read" it as a Norwegian, although it's flying a German flag?

07-07-05, 01:24 PM	#4
Jace11 Seasoned Skipper Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: UK Posts: 683 Downloads: 104 Uploads: 1	When I said putting "them under German flag" I mean't just changing their nationality to German. Done in the editor. German planes will not bomb German ships so no prob.

07-07-05, 02:15 PM	#5
Shadow9216 Frogman Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 296 Downloads: 91 Uploads: 0	Ah, I see! You meant it in the proper maritime parlance of "registry of a vessel within a specific country" vice the computer terminology of "I added a BB to Mexico in the roster" :P

07-07-05, 11:49 PM	#7
Seaboy Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	likely the Germans in those Nordic harbors are part of a blackmarket and on the take.

07-08-05, 08:09 AM	#8
Shigawire Mate Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Norway, Brønnøysund Posts: 53 Downloads: 4 Uploads: 0	What happens to Norwegian shipping traffic in SH3 should affect the game to a very strong degree. It is worth of note that at the outbreak of the war, Norway had the fourth largest merchant fleet in the world - after the UK, USA and Japan. I don't know if this is reflected in SH3 at all?

07-09-05, 04:06 AM	#11
Shigawire Mate Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Norway, Brønnøysund Posts: 53 Downloads: 4 Uploads: 0	Yes, today the "largest merchant fleet" list is: #1 China #2 Russia #3 Greece #4 Norway #5 Japan The golden period in Norwegian shipping was in 1880 when Norway had the 3rd largest merchant fleet in the world. What is "ImprovedConvoys"? Some mod I haven't noticed yet? Can you me point me in the direction of more information and perhaps download? :hmm: