Manual Targeting ~ Now or later?

[KibaKazuma]

Hello all.
I have been curious as to how long did it take for you to start using Manual targeting on SH3 and SH4, I've played for just over a week and been watching how-to videos for the past few days and it does seem quite intimidating...
So I'm looking for a rough idea as to when I should start even trying the system manually
I'll be looking forward to all your responses

[Sailor Steve]

I've been playing SH3 for nine years, subsims for twenty-seven, and I still don't use manual targeting.

But I'm a bad example.

And a bad influence.

Ignore that man behind the curtain.

[KibaKazuma]

I don't see that as a bad example, I guess even from what you're telling me it just depends on playing style..

[smilingmonkey]

Yes indeed. This is a question that has been running through my mind lately.

I have been playing SH4 for about the same time as you. I have been experimenting with the various mega mods and a combination of other smaller mods that I like the look of in game. And now I am fairly comfortable with the basics. Though, playing Real Fleet Boats has ramped up the difficulty (and immersion) a fair amount by disabling a few of the map updates for ship positions and hydrophone lines that I was getting used to. Not that it is a bad thing, I have to think about actually steering the sub in the correct direction now, and stalking has become much more challenging (and fufilling as a result). Having had some success there, I began thinking about manual targeting as the next logical step.

It does look intimidating for sure. But as far as I can see it seems o be repeating only a few steps and deciding on some factors that familiarity with ship types and behaviours will be helpful for. My big issue with it all is my evasive maneuvers in the face of a group of hunting destroyers. Will I have the time to run through the plotting solutions with them coming in fast and head on. Or will I simply have to alter my approach entirely in that circumstance. I shall be interested to find out.

Anyway, good luck.

[Panthera Pardus]

Welcome to SubSim, KibaKazuma,

when I startet to play SH3 a few months ago, I didn't used manual Targeting. But after a few patrols, automatic targeting became a little bit boring. At the same time I found SubSim and joined it, because here are a lot of usefull Informations. For example the link below.

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=88961

This is the Tutorial I used to learn Manual Targeting, in addition it shows you one way to intercept a Convoy or single Ship. One patrol was sufficient for me to know how it goes, because of the well done explanation in this Tutorial. Since then, I have never used the automatic targeting again.
When you should start to learn/practice the manual targeting, depends on you. I'd say. If you feel ready for it, it's time to try it.

I myself have learned it to raise my difficulty settings. Because I wanted to join the Donitz Elite Flotilla, and for that I had to raise my difficulty settings. But I still could use the help of the Weapons Officer, just for the case that I need a quick target solution. As example:

We choosed a Medium Cargo and fired tube 5 and 6. Immediately we turned our ship around 180 degree, and prepared tube one and four. The target was a Granville Type Freighter, but we had to wait until it is in firing position. Meanwhile, the medium Cargo got hit, but not very well. It would take a while until it might sink. A few minutes later the Granville type Freighter was in position, we fired Tube 1. However, befor we could fire tube 4, we detected the front Escort. It was on a direct course in our direction. We stopped everything and waited for what would happen. We were allready in ASDIC range but without being pinged. I Pulled down the Periscope, so that we barely could see where it is moving. It passed us on our left Flank, just 300 meters away. To our luck, our last stern torpedo was ready in tube 5. The Destroyer, a Black Swan Class, started to turn left. (here I used the help of the Weapons Officer) I immediately gave the data for a torpedo launch to the weapons officer. And in the moment when the destroyer reached the 200 degree mark we were pinged. At the same time our Torpedo left our Boat, and we all hoped that it would hit before they know our Position. That were the longest 25 seconds in my life so far. And thanks to God, the destroyer exploded before he knew where we were.

I hope that this was helpfull for you. Have a nice Day and good hunting.

Joy and Happiness
Panthera Pardus

P.S.: Here is a copy of the full text in my quote. Just in case that someone is interested.

 

My first Convoy attack as Member of the Dönitz Elite Flotilla
Convoy Attack Report

March 19, 1940 at 20:10 GMT We had sight and sound contact with the Large Convoy we tried to intercept. And here they are, just north east from our current Location. Due to our well-planned intercept, we had enough time to bring our U-boat in position. We had enough distance to anticipate traveling escort ship. A destroyer of the Black Swan class. While we waited for the approach of the convoy, we counted the ships. 16 merchant and cargo ships were on their way, plus a second escort ship at the end. Also, a destroyer of the Black Swan class. In addition, directly behind the last row with cargo ships, an enemy U-Boat. We had almost overlooked it. After identifying the ships, we searched the four Largest out. An ammunition ship and three Large Merchants. We had only 9 Bow and 5 Stern Torpedoes left, so we had to be considered.
I decided to fire on the ammunition ship first, and then on the first of the large merchant ships. So we prepared ourselves for the firing of Tube 1 to 4. A couple of minutes later, the Ammunition Ship was in good Position and we fired tube 1 and 2. Directly after firing the Torpedoes we logged in the first Large Merchant. 3 Minutes later, tube 3 and 4 were on their way. All four Torpedoes hit their Targets, with a small delay of 10 seconds between the second and third one. The Large Merchant immediately began to sink, the Ammunition Ship got slowed down but was still fighting. At the same time the Escorts changed their course, and started to search for us. But to our Luck they searched around the Ammunition Ship, while we were on the right Flank of the Convoy.
After I saw that they were looking in the wrong area, I gave the following commands. "Back Slow" and "Hard to Port". The Crew were allready reloading tube one till four, but I wanted to waste no time. And we had two Torpedoes in our Stern tubes, ready to fire and hungry for a target. So we made a turn of allmost 180 degree, and at the same time we logged in the second large Merchant. As soon as we were in firing position we hit the Button, and the Torpedoes closed in to their target. I gave new commands to the Crew: "Ahead Slow" and "Hard to Starboard". We made a second 180 degree turn, and at its End Tube 1 and 2 were ready to fire. The Crew was young and unexperienced, but they did a great job with an excellent timing. But no time to honor it right now, there is still one Large Merchant left. So we prepared the TDC with the correct data, and a moment later tube 1 and 2 were empty again. After logging in the second large Merchant, we turned our ship in west direction. It looked like we had to fire a third Torpedo on it. Because we hit it a little bit too much in the front half of the Ship. We waited for Tube three and in the Moment it was ready, the Ship gave up and began to sink. Directly next to it there was a Coastal Freighter, he was hardly slowing down to avoid that he would hit the Wreck. We changed the TDC settings and fired. He took a hit directly in his back.
It was time to left the Convoy alone for a while, so we moved on a course Southwest. With 5 km distance between us and the Convoy we surfaced our U-Boat and set a parallel Course to the Convoy. With only five Torpedoes left, two Bow and 3 Stern, we decided us for a second run on the Convoy. This time we wanted to attack on their left flank. Therefore we took a course on which we could cross their route in front of them. Our Stern was in the right direction as they appeared. We choosed a Medium Cargo and fired tube 5 and 6. Immediately we turned our ship around 180 degree, and prepared tube one and four. The target was a Granville Type Freighter, but we had to wait until it is in firing position. Meanwhile, the medium Cargo got hit, but not very well. It would take a while until it might sink. A few minutes later the Granville type Freighter was in position, we fired Tube 1. However, befor we could fire tube 4, we detected the front Escort. It was on a direct course in our direction. We stopped everything and waited for what would happen. We were allready in ASDIC range but without being pinged. I Pulled down the Periscope, so that we barely could see where it is moving. It passed us on our left Flank, just 300 meters away. To our luck, our last stern torpedo was ready in tube 5. The Destroyer, a Black Swan Class, started to turn left. I immediately gave the data for a torpedo launch to the weapons officer. And in the moment when the destroyer reached the 200 degree mark we were pinged. At the same time our Torpedo left our Boat, and we all hoped that it would hit before they know our Position. That were the longest 25 seconds in my life so far. And thanks to God, the destroyer exploded before he knew where we were.
Right after, we targeted back to the Granville Type Freighter, and fired our last torpedo. But the second torpedo bounced off of the Hull, as well as the first shot before. Therefore, we went on a course in direction west, and dived to a depth of 120 meters. With enough distance between us and the Convoy, we surfaced the U-boat and prepared for a Status report.

Respectfully

Leo von Pard
Oberleutnant z.S. and commanding Officer of U-666

I have written this report simply for fun, and I hope you liked it. Oh and Sorry, if there are Grammatical, Spelling or Translation Errors. If you find one let me know via PM. This way I can avoid it next time.

Joy and Happiness
Panthera Pardus
aka Leo von Pard

[banryu79]

Hello KibaKazuma
I started playing SH3 just 3 mounths ago.
I never played a subsim game before, so I was fresh new.
I like the "hard way" in this kind of game, so I started right away with GWX (a mod) and manual targeting.

It is hard? Not at all, if you know how things works and what your are doing.

To lear how things works I kept my desire for actual playing under control and spent many hours in reading tutorials, studying them well, watching videos of let's play and read a ton of stuff in general (game specific or historical).

To know what I am doing I played a little in non-combat situation (doing the naval trainings, the in game tutorials, till I obtained good results and feel very comfortabe with the interface and everything, and the GWX first patrol during peace time, before the war declaration).

Was all of this "keeping-myself-from-actually-playing-the-game" thing boring? Well, that's depend, obviously. For me it was a lot of fun.

Now I'm doing my third patrol in GWX, and at least I think I know what I'm doing, I sunk good tonnage, patrolled enemy waters in a sensible manner and, most importat of all, kept my kaleun and my men alive (and unscathed, till know).

So, is starting with manual targeting a good thing to do? Well: why not?

[Pisces]

Originally Posted by GalaKev

...
I think one of the main problems is that in the game its either all or nothing, which does not happen in real life.

In real life the team (not just on a firing solution), comes to a solution to a problem. Yes the captain has the final say, but more often than not, the captain, will really be checking that the information is correct and make the important decision whether to use it or not.

I am ex Royal Navy and information is being thrown at the officer in charge all the time. It is his responsibility what information to act on that and decide what to use. If ever you see a documentary on telly about any warship, not just a submarine, you will see this. It actually can get quite manic on a bridge/control room.

The captain, is the decision maker yes, but cannot be the master of all trades. This immersion is where the game lacks, rather than the all or nothing scenario we have now.

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/show....php?p=2211648