Man intentionally crashes light plane into IRS offices

SteamWake · 02-18-10, 03:34 PM

In texas...

Look out private pilots your life is about to become more complicated.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,586581,00.html

White house states "Its not terrorisim"!

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010...+Politics%2529

Just some angry guy in a plane I guess.

FIREWALL · 02-18-10, 03:46 PM

How much you wanna bet other IRS workers in buildings near airports are a bit nervous now.

I like the White House response.

Oberon · 02-18-10, 03:54 PM

Define Terrorism. I'd say that the people at the IRS office were hardly calm and collected...

lorka42 · 02-18-10, 04:16 PM

pardon me, but I was under the impression that a terrorist ws someone who does violence against people for their beliefs, or because of the peoples beliefs that the violence is directed against. Am I mistaken?

Oberon · 02-18-10, 04:24 PM

It would seem that there is no proper international definition of Terrorism, however Dictionary.com has it defined as:

Quote:

The unlawful use or threatened use of force or violence by a person or an organized group against people or property with the intention of intimidating or coercing societies or governments, often for ideological or political reasons.

Unlawful use of violence by a person - Crashing a plane is pretty violent
Against people or property - IRS office
Intention of intimidating or coercing societies or governments - Well, he didn't do it for lols, that's for certain.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Definition_of_terrorism

UnderseaLcpl · 02-18-10, 04:59 PM

Anyone remember that report on domestic terrorism that came out a while ago? I remember it, because Libertarians and Ron Paul supporters were thoroughly pissed off about it, since they were mentioned as candidates for acts of "domestic terror". I was pissed off about that, too, as I couldn't concieve the idea of Libertarian (or similar) radical actually comitting an act of terror; it is completely against our principles. It would be using force or coercion against people who had not attacked us.

However, I think I may have been very wrong. What makes me think that is this statement from the pilot's suicide note:
"If you’re reading this, you’re no doubt asking yourself, “Why did this have to happen?'" the note read. "The simple truth is that it is complicated and has been coming for a long time...
"Violence not only is the answer, it is the only answer...

I pretty sure there isn't one person in this country who really likes the IRS. Even some of the IRS employees I have talked to don't like the IRS, but Libertarians hate the IRS with a passion. Well, some of them do, anyway. The reason for that hatred is belief in the theory that taxation is theft. It more or less goes that since governments derive their authority from force and the use of force against someone who did not violate your rights first is immoral, taxation is immoral. After all, if you don't pay your taxes you go to jail and if you won't go to jail, they will force you to go to jail and maybe kill you - not much different from a street thug who robs you at gunpoint. I feel wierd saying this given what I quoted above, but, its actually a lot more complicated than that.. but this thread isn't about ethics and political theory.

Anyhow, the last words in the text quoted make me think that this guy was a Libertarian (or some variation thereof) radical. If I'm right about him, he is a person who strongly believes in individualism, and that is why his last words are so seemingly cryptic; he wants people to question them and search them for meaning, because he is certain that they will ultimately arrive at the same conclusion he has. People of all beliefs do that from time to time, but it is particularly prevalent amongst believers in individualism. Assuming I'm correct about all this, the only thing I don't really understand is why he would fly a plane into a building full of people who had never hurt him. Even if he had problems with the IRS, the use of force against unarmed people who don't know they are hurting you is unethical. Employees of the IRS are not the IRS. Perhaps his perception was skewed, or perhaps he was just a wacko to begin with.

There are a lot of people in the US, and especially in Texas, who are ready and willing to revolt against the government and establish what they see as a free state. I'm one of them. If there was a Libertarian revolution tommorrow I'd be on the front lines by the next day. But I'm not about to fly a plane into a freaking building or try to kill scores of innocent people by any other means because I'm not a freaking madman.

I really hope I'm wrong about this guy, because if I am right about him it means that we who are economic conservatives and social liberals are being undermined by our own. J.A. Stack, and anyone who follows him, are doing to us what radical Muslims have done to Islam. We will triumph because we are right, and our vision will be adopted or rejected by others of their own free will, not by coercion or terror.

02-18-10, 03:34 PM	#1
SteamWake Rear Admiral Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 13,224 Downloads: 5 Uploads: 0	Man intentionally crashes light plane into IRS offices In texas... Look out private pilots your life is about to become more complicated. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,586581,00.html White house states "Its not terrorisim"! http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010...+Politics%2529 Just some angry guy in a plane I guess. __________________ Follow the progress of Mr. Mulligan : http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=147648

02-18-10, 03:46 PM	#2
FIREWALL Eternal Patrol Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: CATALINA IS. SO . CAL USA Posts: 10,108 Downloads: 511 Uploads: 0	How much you wanna bet other IRS workers in buildings near airports are a bit nervous now. I like the White House response. __________________ RIP FIREWALL I Play GWX. Silent Hunter Who ???

02-18-10, 04:59 PM	#6
UnderseaLcpl Silent Hunter Join Date: May 2008 Location: Storming the beaches! Posts: 4,254 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Anyone remember that report on domestic terrorism that came out a while ago? I remember it, because Libertarians and Ron Paul supporters were thoroughly pissed off about it, since they were mentioned as candidates for acts of "domestic terror". I was pissed off about that, too, as I couldn't concieve the idea of Libertarian (or similar) radical actually comitting an act of terror; it is completely against our principles. It would be using force or coercion against people who had not attacked us. However, I think I may have been very wrong. What makes me think that is this statement from the pilot's suicide note: "If you’re reading this, you’re no doubt asking yourself, “Why did this have to happen?'" the note read. "The simple truth is that it is complicated and has been coming for a long time... "Violence not only is the answer, it is the only answer... I pretty sure there isn't one person in this country who really likes the IRS. Even some of the IRS employees I have talked to don't like the IRS, but Libertarians hate the IRS with a passion. Well, some of them do, anyway. The reason for that hatred is belief in the theory that taxation is theft. It more or less goes that since governments derive their authority from force and the use of force against someone who did not violate your rights first is immoral, taxation is immoral. After all, if you don't pay your taxes you go to jail and if you won't go to jail, they will force you to go to jail and maybe kill you - not much different from a street thug who robs you at gunpoint. I feel wierd saying this given what I quoted above, but, its actually a lot more complicated than that.. but this thread isn't about ethics and political theory. Anyhow, the last words in the text quoted make me think that this guy was a Libertarian (or some variation thereof) radical. If I'm right about him, he is a person who strongly believes in individualism, and that is why his last words are so seemingly cryptic; he wants people to question them and search them for meaning, because he is certain that they will ultimately arrive at the same conclusion he has. People of all beliefs do that from time to time, but it is particularly prevalent amongst believers in individualism. Assuming I'm correct about all this, the only thing I don't really understand is why he would fly a plane into a building full of people who had never hurt him. Even if he had problems with the IRS, the use of force against unarmed people who don't know they are hurting you is unethical. Employees of the IRS are not the IRS. Perhaps his perception was skewed, or perhaps he was just a wacko to begin with. There are a lot of people in the US, and especially in Texas, who are ready and willing to revolt against the government and establish what they see as a free state. I'm one of them. If there was a Libertarian revolution tommorrow I'd be on the front lines by the next day. But I'm not about to fly a plane into a freaking building or try to kill scores of innocent people by any other means because I'm not a freaking madman. I really hope I'm wrong about this guy, because if I am right about him it means that we who are economic conservatives and social liberals are being undermined by our own. J.A. Stack, and anyone who follows him, are doing to us what radical Muslims have done to Islam. We will triumph because we are right, and our vision will be adopted or rejected by others of their own free will, not by coercion or terror. __________________ I stole this sig from Task Force

02-18-10, 03:54 PM	#3
Oberon Lucky Jack Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 25,976 Downloads: 61 Uploads: 20	Define Terrorism. I'd say that the people at the IRS office were hardly calm and collected...

02-18-10, 04:16 PM	#4
lorka42 Planesman Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 190 Downloads: 35 Uploads: 5	pardon me, but I was under the impression that a terrorist ws someone who does violence against people for their beliefs, or because of the peoples beliefs that the violence is directed against. Am I mistaken?