How much do you value difficulty?

[karamazovnew]

With the recent scare about the SH5 interface, I fear that speculation might do more damage than good in the following months. From what we have seen so far, SH5 seems to already offer a great deal for gamers. Realism freaks will likely continue to cry fault and will rely on mods in the years to come, as they have done with both SH3 and SH4. Realism means difficulty. Sometimes realism can make a game so difficult that players respect it, but find it prohibitive. Falcon 4 and Black Shark are good examples of sims that I value and cherish, but I've never been good at them. Also realism can provide a bit of Role-Play. Having many options and many things to do can be immersive. But doing them all is difficult.

So I'd like to open a poll regarding your difficulty needs in relation to how you are currently playing SH3 or SH4. This isn't about what you want to see in SH5, or even how you would like to play it in the future. We all have our reasons for playing the game, vanilla or modded (love the navy, love WW2, bored of XBOX games, etc). But this isn't about that. I want for you to think clearly and pick your current style of play.

1. Minimum Difficulty (for me, SH is a game):
I view SH as an exotic shooter. I don't like to mess around with plots or tactics. I want to sink everything in sight, the bigger the better. If I get sunk, I load up the last save and keep on going. But I usually never get sunk

2. Moderate Difficulty (for me SH is a challenging sim):
Plotting, manual targeting, tactics are still a bit of mystery to me, but I keep on trying. I try to follow orders, plan my attacks with plotting. I like to know what's going on in the game. I like realism but I don't want it to get to the point of frustrating me. I know that the game can offer more, but this is all I can give it.

3. Normal Difficulty (for me SH is reason enough to join the Navy, if it weren't so boring!!!):
I love a challenge. I want as many realistic options as possible, which I can toggle off while I learn the art of this sim.

4. Real deal (for me SH fills that gap I never knew I had):
This is my sub. There are many other like it, but this one is mine. If it goes down, I go with it. I care about my crew and I respect my enemy. I learn from them and from my mistakes, to be able to give this job 100%, with or without manual targeting. If I bring down a few ships and then get my crew home, it means I've done my duty.


I'd like to point out that for 3 years after SH3 came out, I was a perfect example of Option 1 and I still respect it. Please don't try to boast as it would defeat the purpose of such a poll. Which is to remind Ubi who we are and what we expect from them in the future.

[GoldenRivet]

Had to vote Real Deal

it describes the way I view it to a greater extent than the rest.

I have a Persona or Character that I play SH3 as... if he dies, thats it, no coming back.

When SH5 comes out... for the first couple of weeks i will play moderate realism as i slip into the game

however, once versed in the ways of SH5 - i'll go full on real placing my character into the Sh5 world and Playing out his campaign in Ultra low time compression if i use any at all.

of course i will have another low realism setting character for when i only have a short time and want to get a quick fix with a quick mission.

[Sailor Steve]

I voted 3) Normal Difficulty. Actually 4 kind of describes my attitude, but I've never been able to master manual targeting or wean myself from the external views, especially when I'm in port.

I almost never wander from my assigned grid (in SH3 - SH4 lets you request a new zone and sometimes lets you run free), even if it means getting zero tonnage for the patrol.

While I use the Weapons Officer / Auto Targeting I always take several periscope observations, which doesn't change my chances of hitting but does increase the chance of my being spotted.

I never man the deck or flak guns myself. I keep Auto Reload turned off, and never reload the torpedoes while I'm escaping (a steep dive angle could make one of those one-ton suckers break lose and go right through the hull), or while surfaced if the wind speed is more than 6. I never reload externals except at a dead stop in a dead calm sea.

I always return all the way to port and dock the boat myself.

I use SH3 Commander, and set if for 'Realistic Career Length'. I don't expect to ever go all the way through the war - I'll get promoted to a desk job long before that happens (assuming I survive that long).

And of course Dead Is Dead.

[karamazovnew]

Steve you should've gone for 4. You're a perfect personification of that option. By difficulty I didn't mean at which percentage you play the game. As I've stated, it's about immersion, and realism expectation which both lead to a particular style of play (a sort of INNER difficulty). Let me give another example:

GUITAR HERO 3... don't laugh please...

Option 1: Love the game at parties or for a quick fix.
Option 2: Cool game, I've beaten it on Hard but some songs on Expert are torture... _uck this.
Option 3: I'm one of the only 3 guys that beat Through Fire and Flames 100% on Expert in the world. Ok, not yet... but next time!!!
Option 4: When I get drunk, I play this game and I'm ON THE STAGE!

I'm both Option 2 and Option 4. But the last one is evidently more relevant. It's something that you have, or don't have... and you have it (for SH, I mean) . As you can see, I didn't even talk about type of targeting for that option. Some play it like I do with max time compression, some with minimum (respect Golden ). Some load, some don't. But all of them never shy away from sheer difficulty, but accept as a part of "real life", not even something to beat or master (as option 3 does).

EDIT: there, changed option 3 to make it more relevant . Hope it's a bit more clear now. As I said, it's hard to distinguish difficulty options from realism and immersion. Especially for one with a non-english native language.

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by karamazovnew

Steve you should've gone for 4.

Given what you just said, maybe you're right. I came up 'Hardcore' in the 'What Kind Of Subsim Skipper Are You?' quiz.

GUITAR HERO 3... don't laugh please...

Option 4: When I get drunk, I play this game and I'm ON THE STAGE!

I've never played that game, mainly because I play for real and I'm on the stage fairly regularly. Can't beat the high you get from that.

[karamazovnew]

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

I've never played that game, mainly because I play for real and I'm on the stage fairly regularly. Can't beat the high you get from that.

Cool, link vids on PM please...
I play a real guitar too, quite good in fact, but not at the point where I can actually ENJOY it. Of course the game is simply silly, but after a few beers it's hypnotic. It's like Rally games (Richard Burns for example), we all drive cars but not all of us can drive THOSE cars. Of course the game isn't real and doesn't even hold a candle to the real thing, but it's still fun.

[Reece]

I voted Normal Difficulty, it is still a game and playing it for example in 1x TC is just not my cup of tea, I play manual TDC but generally prefer quick 90 method just a couple of examples!!

[Carotio]

I voted 3 normal.

Using free view, cause I love to look at all the eye candy.
Using auto tdc, cause I'm too lazy to fully study manual tdc, and because the captain asked his officers to do the calculations, so it doesn't hurt my realism comprehension.
Always using the units on the map.
On rare occasions, I have manned the flak gun myself just to try, and depending on the situation, I man the deck gun now and then.
I follow orders to go do what is asked for, and I always return to port at the dock.
I don't order reload of external torpedos in bad weather, meaning storm. Rain is okay.
DID? Well, I have never finished a career in either SH3 or SH4, but I think mods have more to do with that than the DID decision. I use DID, if I'm to be blamed for the death. If it's a game fault, a bad save or similar, it doesn't count in my book.

[codmander]

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

I voted 3) Normal Difficulty. Actually 4 kind of describes my attitude, but I've never been able to master manual targeting or wean myself from the external views, especially when I'm in port.

I almost never wander from my assigned grid (in SH3 - SH4 lets you request a new zone and sometimes lets you run free), even if it means getting zero tonnage for the patrol.

While I use the Weapons Officer / Auto Targeting I always take several periscope observations, which doesn't change my chances of hitting but does increase the chance of my being spotted.

I never man the deck or flak guns myself. I keep Auto Reload turned off, and never reload the torpedoes while I'm escaping (a steep dive angle could make one of those one-ton suckers break lose and go right through the hull), or while surfaced if the wind speed is more than 6. I never reload externals except at a dead stop in a dead calm sea.

I always return all the way to port and dock the boat myself.

I use SH3 Commander, and set if for 'Realistic Career Length'. I don't expect to ever go all the way through the war - I'll get promoted to a desk job long before that happens (assuming I survive that long).

And of course Dead Is Dead.

Keep praticing MTDC theres nothing better than whackin a ship from 3500 using mtdc I started by just getting in close and just using the bearing to aim as time goes by you'll add angle and range to your settings ..beleive me theres nothing better in sh3 than hitting a ship at a distance with mtdc youll amaze yourself

[danasan]

I like the intention of this thread. I would put myself in between 3 and 4 for some reasons:

"In whatever mode I never used the free cam and I dont have screenshots to prove it." Thanks for that wordplay. Hope you don't mind using it.

I can't get used to MTDC in EVERY situation and sometimes there is no second chance... but maybe that IS real life

I never do a savegame. If I go down, I go back to the start and try again. Regardless the careers state.

Let me add something to the realism - thing. Impressing to me, some words from another (wiser) guy than me. Hope, I can translate the sense.

As far as a simulation goes, you can't add two options.

1. The fear of death

2. The causing of human tragedy

Just my two cents

danasan

[sharkbit]

Originally Posted by danasan

As far a as simulation goes, you can't add two options.

1. The fear of death

2. The causing of human tragedy

Just my two cents

danasan

Nicely put.
I think we all would act a little different if every decision you made meant life and death.

Welcome aboard.

[THE_MASK]

Does it need to be a pure simulation to feel real ?

[Sailor Steve]

Originally Posted by danasan

I never do a savegame. If I go down, I go back to the start and try again. Regardless the careers state.

That's interesting. I save all the time, mainly because when SH3 was new it had the habit of crashing every time I sank a ship. I also can't always finish a session before I have to be somewhere.

As for going back to the beginning, I do that every time some new mod comes out that changes the way the harbors look, or sometimes my boat. In AOD and SH1 I got into the habit of running simultaneous careers from each available base or flotilla, and I continue that to this day. If one of my captains dies, I start a new career, but in the same month rather than back at the beginning of the war.

[danasan]

quote:

Originally Posted by danasan
I never do a savegame. If I go down, I go back to the start and try again. Regardless the careers state.

/ quote

I've got an older machine running XP / SH3 only. SH runs stable since the first day. I once put LSH3 V 4 on it. It runs stable since the first day. I once put WAC 4.1 on it. That is definitely the limit of graphics of that machine. Sometimes it waits for a week or so in the Taskbar for being reactivated. I did not change or add any other mod. Alter some sounds OK. If I have to shut down the machine, I have to save the game, of course. It is a technical limitation. But I never roll back after a killing... That would be some kind of cheating. Nothing to be honored for, in my opinion.

All the best for the new year. It's on now here...

[THE_MASK]

I voted 3 . Depending how SH5 turns out it might be 4 .