Surface Attack?

[Folducker]

I have never been successful trying to attack a convoy on the surface at night. I always get spotted and sunk immediately, no matter what speed or how I approach.

I usually go to 300 feet, silent running in front of the convoy. If I time it just right, I make it to periscope depth between two lines of ships. I can not do this with the periscope raised as raising the periscope gets me spotted immediately, even on the blackest of nights. I know that historically, it's almost impossible to spot a scope at night, (Or during the day for that matter) So what gives? Is this a game bug or am I doing something wrong?
Thanks

[irish1958]

Same here. I thought I was just inept!
BDU fired me for loosing so many U-boats, so I thought I would try over here.

[aanker]

This post by Hitman may help as a guide to editing sim.cfg to your liking - but it is a fine balance; it is no fun if the AI is stupid:

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/show...2&postcount=18

Anyway, Happy Hunting!

Art

[Armistead]

I run TMO1.7 as hard as it gets and can make attacks, although I agree they spot you way early, beyond reality.

The best thing I've found is to have tracking done. My last look will be at around 2000 yards from the nearest DD, running silent at 1/2 knot. Then I will go to 100 ft and fire when the TDC shows the proper angle. After that I will usually go up and try and fire another salvo while they're in range.

If further than 1000 yards I will shoot a spread of three, first towards aft, middle, then bow. I reverse that with merchants, just what works for me because of the turbo speed of the ships.

Surface attacks, best I can do is decks awash at 3000 yards, 1 kt, narrow profile.

[rditto48801]

Wow, I thought I had it bad with stock.

I once was cruising near Wake, 1/3 speed in the middle of the night with intent to dive and silent run to look for any moored/anchored ships, just to get attacked without warning. Nothing was seen, nothing on hydrophone, and 'boom', something damaged the sub.
I used the external camera, and saw a splash near the rear of the sub, then a 'streak' of a low angle 'shot' that directly hit the conning tower. The only hint of an actual attacker was a feint 'flash' in the distance. As far as I could tell, a shore battery had spotted my black painted sub... 6-7nm away, in the middle of the night...

As for surface attacks...
There are a few things I try to do or not do.
I will not surface if there is at least one escort nearby, even a small destroyer escort is likely to win out in a slugging match with a sub.
Similar goes for if the merchant ships are apparently armed with cannons, as a sub with holes might master the diving ability and loose the surface ability if the sub goes to deep.
In such cases, I prefer to make an attempt to torpedo any 'well armed' ships first, even a small merchant ship with an apparent deck gun will be a higher priority than a big fat yet unarmed tanker, as removing opposition is very useful if a surface attack is going to be done.

When it comes to sinking ships with a deck gun, I have two things I usually do.
I will use HE shells, aimed as close to the water line as possible, spreading them out over the hull. The idea behind this is many ships can likely stay afloat with one or two compartments flooded, but if they have to many compartments flooding, it's a different matter.
I will use AP shells, generally a half dozen to a dozen, aimed at the hull in general below the stack(s), with intent to attempt to damage their engines. Bigger ships usually have quite a bit more shells needed to be put into them.
If there are two or more ships, a slow or dead in the water target can suddenly be marked off on the map and left behind as I can chase down faster ships, and know the wounded ship won't get as far (or go nowhere at all), making it easy(er) to track them down and sink them afterwards.
I have never really tried shooting at the rear of a ship where the props and rudder are at, except one time I was stuck staring at the rear of a fleeing ship, but I suppose it could be another valid tactic in impairing a ship.

I have no clue if SH4 even takes such factors as flooding in different compartments into consideration when tracking damage, but I do it anyways.

Patience also helps, after putting quite a few holes in a ship, ceasing fire and 'observing' the target for a while, looking for signs of them listing or starting to run deep in the water, and making sure to keep a safe distance, as even a smaller merchant ship can probably do some nasty things to a sub in a collision. If aircraft or a warship is detected/spotted, I immediately dive, as I feel it is better to live and leave a target crippled, than to die a hero in battle.

I will sometimes just put the deck gun on automatic when engaging an unarmed ship on the surface, especially when dealing with a larger ship, then use my AA gun to pepper the bridge area with gun fire, sometimes firing at other parts of the ship (like below the stacks or where fuel might be), keeping in mind it is war, and all is fair in love and war Again, and that every little bit helps, although I don't know if such a thing has any bearing in SH4, but I do it anyways, because it seems like a legitimate tactic.

If I am dealing with larger and harder to sink targets, such as a tanker, a torpedo or two helps speed things up in terms of sinking a ship, or at least helps to slow down the faster merchants. That way, to many torpedoes or to many cannon shells don't get wasted on a single target, but an equal mix of the two, as running out of torpedoes or running out of deck gun shells sort of eliminates a little bit of the subs offensive flexibility IMO.

We just have to remember that a subs is built for stealth, evasion, and moving underwater, they are meant for sneaky strikes and hitting the enemy when they least expect it, and not for slugging it out with armed surface ships in any sort of lasting surface battle. Generally speaking, if there is so much as a single destroyer or destroyer escort or any sort of well armed small ship or merchant with cannons, a surface attack with a sub becomes more of a suicide mission than a surface attack, especially if a threat cannot be quickly dealt with or proves to have gunners that can do better than hitting the broadside of a barn from the inside.
Just look at Germany in WWII, at some point, they started to remove deck guns in general, they even built a sub design that had no deck gun to begin with (The XXI?).


I have yet to be sunk during an actual planned/expected surface attack in SH4 since I usually put a lot of effort into avoiding dangerous situations (*cough* psycho SH2 destroyer *cough*), although I have come close to a kamikaze freighter trying to literally run me over when I surfaced near them on the same course with intent of shelling them, although I could turn and slow down and get out of their turning arc, causing them to then try to turn away and try to run away.

It does make things interesting in that my deck gun is on the rear. I guess being able to attack something while running away makes a little more sense to me than attacking something while charging at it.

I guess to much time playing SH1 years ago helps out a little bit, plus a little bit of experience with SH2 and SH3.

I am far from being a pro at SH4, I'm just a gamer with to much spare time and a love of submarines and blowing stuff up in games...
and someone who types to much at times due to boredom...
(sorry for any eyes that exploded into flames trying to read all of that...)

[vanjast]

When on the surface there are things to remember..

- Is the Moon up and shining (moonless [no light] nights are better)
- Is the weather clear, cloudy or misty (obvious)
- Are the seas rough or smooth (Harder to see in rough weather)
- What speed are you travelling (higher speed makes a visible bow spray )
- At what bearing is the escort (Same as sonar detection.. you can be detected easier if you're side-on, more sub to see).

Minimise all of these and you're a sub captain, sneaking right into convoys, undetected.

[Sniper_Fox]

I love surface attacking. It's my favourite tactic. Go in hard and fast, i even like to pump off a few deck gun shells depending if i have ladder or acoustic torpedoes.

position yourself according to where the moon is inrelation to the convoy. if the moon is behind you its harder for them to see you. Go in at flank and empty your tubes. dive immediately to a depth of at least 100m and change direction to keep up with the convoy. drop speed and listen for explosions.