Questions I should have asked earlier

hulkamania · 03-15-09, 06:57 PM

I played this game when it first came out, then stopped for awhile, then recently reinstalled and started playing again. I started a career at the earliest possible point with 1st Flotilla (in a IIa) and have now made it to late 1943 without dying once (although, I've had to abandon a couple of patrols and return to base, due to extreme damage).

Anyhow, I have a couple of questions, and probably more I can't remember to ask (so I'll add them to this thread later). Here they are:

1) Do the various torpedos have different sizes of warheads? The in-game descriptions aren't very clear about this. I calculate all my firing solutions and very rarely miss, regardless of speed settings, weather, etc. Having said that, I would prefer to be carrying a full load-out of torpedos that make the largest possible explosion, but I don't even know if they have varying warhead sizes amongst all the different types available at this point in my career.

2) Is the effectiveness of your hydrophone affected by your depth? I realize it actually has to be submerged to pick up sound, but is there a difference between using it at periscope depth vs. some greater depth?

3) How in God's name do I increase the morale of crewmembers? The only thing I've seen do it is awarding of particular medals. Other than that, it seems to be frozen at about 50% for all of my crew (except for the highest officers and for members who received the aforementioned medals)

4) Is renown, medal awarding, etc. affected by the actual type of ship you sink, or simply the total tonnage for the patrol? For example, if I sink 10,000 tons (approximately) of coastal merchant vessels, is it going to result in the same amount of reknown, medal awarding, promotions, etc. as if I'd sunk a single target that had the same weight?

What about warship tonnage? Does it carry more merit than cargo vessels? In other words, does 5,000 tons of warships carry any more merit than 5,000 tons of merchants/cargo ships?

I've already determined that shooting down airplanes seems to reward very little renown (which means I spend almost no time at my anti-aircraft, but oh well), but I'm not sure about the rest of it.

Anyhow, those are some questions I had, and I probably have more, but can't think of them right now.

P.S.

This is the first time I've played this late into the war. Umm...the days of simply surfacing next to unescorted C2s and plinking them with HE from the 88 are over. LOL! At first, when they just had a single gun, it wasn't really a problem. I just shot it off the ship with HE then went about the normal business of sinking it. Now, they have machineguns, two cannons, etc.

I can't even do the old "sink the escorts and then have target-practice with the deck gun" strategy anymore. When a whole convoy of armed merchants starts shooting at you, what individual ships lack in firepower and accuracy is quickly made up by the sheer numbers of weapons being fired at you (nevermind the airplanes that usually show up if you are anywhere in the vicinity of the island, even at night they show up, which wasn't happening at the start of the war)

This is definitely getting more entertaining as it becomes more difficult. It feels less like a turkey-shoot and there are more "soil your undies" moments. I'm playing this career where one death equals end of career (no re-loading saved games), and there have been some VERY close scrapes with death.

I got sidetracked. Main reason for my post was to ask some questions and add more later. Community seems very helpful. Thanks, in advance, for any help you provide.

irish1958 · 03-15-09, 07:17 PM

Welcome aboard!
1)I don't think so.
2)Not in the game, but yes in real life.
3)Can't be done; in the NYGM mod, it will increase with success, but in vanilla SHIII and most other mods, no
The level of "morale" is set lower for enlisted men than officers. Theoretically, it will improve with rest in the quarters up to their maximum, which for enlisted men is 60%
4)yes. and also the level of realism. Sinking warships isn't worth much nor are airplanes. Sinking a neutral ship is a big deduction.

A Very Super Market · 03-15-09, 07:22 PM

Welcome to Subsim!

Okay, your first question:
No, they don't. Your torpedoes' main difference is their propulsion systems, not damage. Depending on where you hit the ship, you may get a large explosion or not. Fuel tanks and Engine Room= BOOM.

I don't think hydrophones are affected by your depth. I think they are affected by speed, but not depth. AI hydrophones are affected by sea state. I think

Morale doesn't really matter. Health won't change unless you get attacked, and it is either.
Full-Fine
Half-Wounded
None-Dead
Endurance is simply a meter that shows how tired your crew is. But I think you know that

Renown is given by ship, not tonnage. Warships tend to give more renown per weight than merchants

I think you are playing stock SH3, no? If so, then whenever you switch to a supermod.... prepare to cry whenever you play. If you think surviving late-war is hard in stock, GWX and especially NYGM will make it living hell.

Otto Heinzmeir · 03-15-09, 07:38 PM

The range of your hydrophones isn't affected by depth. The range is greater if you manually do the scans yourself. It will be 30 kilometers manually, though at extreme range the contacts are very faint so you need to rotate slower. The actual AI crew will only find contacts up to about 20 kilometers, which is more realistic to real life. For whatever reason sometimes the AI hydro crew will give 'no sound contact' when you ask for a report, yet you can do a manual scan and hear screws at a fairly close range.

I like to do my scans manually and occasionally you will hear a school of dolphins this way.

At least I here them in my modded game, not sure about stock.

hulkamania · 03-15-09, 07:51 PM

I just thought of another question:

I have noticed that, when I'm attacking a convoy and at an extremely shallow depth, it seems that escort sonars don't really pick me up unless they literally run over me. Does the AI sonar cover a "cone" shaped area below the specific ship emitting the sonar? If so, it would make sense that if you are very shallow, and not particularly close to an escort, it can't pick you up. If not, then it seems I have been inadvertantly exploiting a bug.

Basically, by "very shallow", I'm talking so shallow that if you stuck a toothpick on the top of my submarine, it would poke out of the water (this is with the periscope down, of course). I can literally have an escort sitting 100 meters from me, pinging away, and he can't pick me up.

Of course, this is with my engines completely stopped so he can't hear me at all, and it frequently seems that when this works, I am right between the convoy and the escort (which I'm guessing would also limit the effectiveness of the hydrophone on the escort, due to the background noise, assuming the game is that detailed).

I've even been able to run at very slow submerged speeds like this, and they don't seem to be able to pick me up with their hydrophones or sonars. The hydrophone thing makes sense, due to the noise from the propellors of the nearby convoy ships, but I don't know that much about WWII-era sonars, so I don't know what sort of coverage areas the sonars have.

EDIT:

Oh yeah, a random "whine" from me:

I never seem to be in the right place at the right time for task forces. Every time I've picked one up on my hydrophone, it is either nearly past me or already has passed (of course, I partially cause this by using time compression and not stopping to scan with the hydrophone enough). All of the task forces I've encountered, so far, were running so fast that I couldn't catch them. In one case, I was surfaced and running at flank on smooth-as-glass water conditions and the speed they were running at was still so great as to completely outrun me without even realizing I was in pursuit (it was dark and early-war, so I guess there were no issues with radar or whatever, and they probably weren't going to pick me up on their hydrophones, since I was behind them).

In fact, the only way I could tell it was a task-force was the noise the propellors were making (warship propellors tend to be pretty distinct from merchant/cargo propellors, from what I've experienced - they always seem to sound like they are turning faster, or something - hard for me to explain)

hulkamania · 03-15-09, 08:13 PM

And another question:

The game descriptions of the various u-boats I can "purchase" with my reknown are somewhat...lacking? I mean, when I got like 30,000 reknown I upgrade from a IIVb to a IIVc, simply because I didn't have anything else to spend it on. Of course, that wasn't much of an upgrade (I would have done it anyway, but the in-game description of the boats literally only showed a difference in how much they weighed and slight variations in speed and dive rates).

Where I'm going with this: Does anyone have a link to the specifications of the other boats besides the type II and type VII series? I haven't messed with transferring flotillas, because I have no idea what the advantage would be going to another type of u-boat (or if there even is an advantage).

Also, if I transfer to another flotilla, does the crew I've been carrying to this point (late-1943) come with me, or do I have to start over with a new crew when I transfer flotillas?

irish1958 · 03-16-09, 08:08 AM

You want to stay away from task forces; lots of destroyers and they don't like you. Plus they are faster than you, especially in rough seas.
After 1943 all U-boats are the same; they all get sunk by airplanes. Before 1943, the VIIC could dive faster; valuable if an airplane is after you. The IX boats have a lot longer range, so are valuable for long patrols.
Playing the major mods will be more realistic in the AI of the Allied forces.
If you transfer to another flotilla, your crew does not go with you; if you use SH3 CMDR, however, they can.
Using renown allows you to get other goodies, such as radar, ASDIC, radar receivers, snorkel, etc.

03-15-09, 06:57 PM	#1
hulkamania Swabbie Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 8 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Questions I should have asked earlier I played this game when it first came out, then stopped for awhile, then recently reinstalled and started playing again. I started a career at the earliest possible point with 1st Flotilla (in a IIa) and have now made it to late 1943 without dying once (although, I've had to abandon a couple of patrols and return to base, due to extreme damage). Anyhow, I have a couple of questions, and probably more I can't remember to ask (so I'll add them to this thread later). Here they are: 1) Do the various torpedos have different sizes of warheads? The in-game descriptions aren't very clear about this. I calculate all my firing solutions and very rarely miss, regardless of speed settings, weather, etc. Having said that, I would prefer to be carrying a full load-out of torpedos that make the largest possible explosion, but I don't even know if they have varying warhead sizes amongst all the different types available at this point in my career. 2) Is the effectiveness of your hydrophone affected by your depth? I realize it actually has to be submerged to pick up sound, but is there a difference between using it at periscope depth vs. some greater depth? 3) How in God's name do I increase the morale of crewmembers? The only thing I've seen do it is awarding of particular medals. Other than that, it seems to be frozen at about 50% for all of my crew (except for the highest officers and for members who received the aforementioned medals) 4) Is renown, medal awarding, etc. affected by the actual type of ship you sink, or simply the total tonnage for the patrol? For example, if I sink 10,000 tons (approximately) of coastal merchant vessels, is it going to result in the same amount of reknown, medal awarding, promotions, etc. as if I'd sunk a single target that had the same weight? What about warship tonnage? Does it carry more merit than cargo vessels? In other words, does 5,000 tons of warships carry any more merit than 5,000 tons of merchants/cargo ships? I've already determined that shooting down airplanes seems to reward very little renown (which means I spend almost no time at my anti-aircraft, but oh well), but I'm not sure about the rest of it. Anyhow, those are some questions I had, and I probably have more, but can't think of them right now. P.S. This is the first time I've played this late into the war. Umm...the days of simply surfacing next to unescorted C2s and plinking them with HE from the 88 are over. LOL! At first, when they just had a single gun, it wasn't really a problem. I just shot it off the ship with HE then went about the normal business of sinking it. Now, they have machineguns, two cannons, etc. I can't even do the old "sink the escorts and then have target-practice with the deck gun" strategy anymore. When a whole convoy of armed merchants starts shooting at you, what individual ships lack in firepower and accuracy is quickly made up by the sheer numbers of weapons being fired at you (nevermind the airplanes that usually show up if you are anywhere in the vicinity of the island, even at night they show up, which wasn't happening at the start of the war) This is definitely getting more entertaining as it becomes more difficult. It feels less like a turkey-shoot and there are more "soil your undies" moments. I'm playing this career where one death equals end of career (no re-loading saved games), and there have been some VERY close scrapes with death. I got sidetracked. Main reason for my post was to ask some questions and add more later. Community seems very helpful. Thanks, in advance, for any help you provide.

03-15-09, 07:17 PM	#2
irish1958 Ocean Warrior Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Carmel, Indiana Posts: 3,250 Downloads: 320 Uploads: 11	Welcome aboard! 1)I don't think so. 2)Not in the game, but yes in real life. 3)Can't be done; in the NYGM mod, it will increase with success, but in vanilla SHIII and most other mods, no The level of "morale" is set lower for enlisted men than officers. Theoretically, it will improve with rest in the quarters up to their maximum, which for enlisted men is 60% 4)yes. and also the level of realism. Sinking warships isn't worth much nor are airplanes. Sinking a neutral ship is a big deduction. __________________ Irish1958

03-15-09, 07:22 PM	#3
A Very Super Market The Old Man Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Deep in the Wild Canadian suburbs. Posts: 1,468 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Welcome to Subsim! Okay, your first question: No, they don't. Your torpedoes' main difference is their propulsion systems, not damage. Depending on where you hit the ship, you may get a large explosion or not. Fuel tanks and Engine Room= BOOM. I don't think hydrophones are affected by your depth. I think they are affected by speed, but not depth. AI hydrophones are affected by sea state. I think Morale doesn't really matter. Health won't change unless you get attacked, and it is either. Full-Fine Half-Wounded None-Dead Endurance is simply a meter that shows how tired your crew is. But I think you know that Renown is given by ship, not tonnage. Warships tend to give more renown per weight than merchants I think you are playing stock SH3, no? If so, then whenever you switch to a supermod.... prepare to cry whenever you play. If you think surviving late-war is hard in stock, GWX and especially NYGM will make it living hell. __________________ The entire German garrison of Vanviken, right here in your thread!

03-16-09, 08:08 AM	#7
irish1958 Ocean Warrior Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Carmel, Indiana Posts: 3,250 Downloads: 320 Uploads: 11	You want to stay away from task forces; lots of destroyers and they don't like you. Plus they are faster than you, especially in rough seas. After 1943 all U-boats are the same; they all get sunk by airplanes. Before 1943, the VIIC could dive faster; valuable if an airplane is after you. The IX boats have a lot longer range, so are valuable for long patrols. Playing the major mods will be more realistic in the AI of the Allied forces. If you transfer to another flotilla, your crew does not go with you; if you use SH3 CMDR, however, they can. Using renown allows you to get other goodies, such as radar, ASDIC, radar receivers, snorkel, etc. __________________ Irish1958

03-15-09, 07:38 PM	#4
Otto Heinzmeir Weps Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Wilhelmshaven Local Pub Posts: 361 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	The range of your hydrophones isn't affected by depth. The range is greater if you manually do the scans yourself. It will be 30 kilometers manually, though at extreme range the contacts are very faint so you need to rotate slower. The actual AI crew will only find contacts up to about 20 kilometers, which is more realistic to real life. For whatever reason sometimes the AI hydro crew will give 'no sound contact' when you ask for a report, yet you can do a manual scan and hear screws at a fairly close range. I like to do my scans manually and occasionally you will hear a school of dolphins this way. At least I here them in my modded game, not sure about stock.

03-15-09, 07:51 PM	#5
hulkamania Swabbie Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 8 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	I just thought of another question: I have noticed that, when I'm attacking a convoy and at an extremely shallow depth, it seems that escort sonars don't really pick me up unless they literally run over me. Does the AI sonar cover a "cone" shaped area below the specific ship emitting the sonar? If so, it would make sense that if you are very shallow, and not particularly close to an escort, it can't pick you up. If not, then it seems I have been inadvertantly exploiting a bug. Basically, by "very shallow", I'm talking so shallow that if you stuck a toothpick on the top of my submarine, it would poke out of the water (this is with the periscope down, of course). I can literally have an escort sitting 100 meters from me, pinging away, and he can't pick me up. Of course, this is with my engines completely stopped so he can't hear me at all, and it frequently seems that when this works, I am right between the convoy and the escort (which I'm guessing would also limit the effectiveness of the hydrophone on the escort, due to the background noise, assuming the game is that detailed). I've even been able to run at very slow submerged speeds like this, and they don't seem to be able to pick me up with their hydrophones or sonars. The hydrophone thing makes sense, due to the noise from the propellors of the nearby convoy ships, but I don't know that much about WWII-era sonars, so I don't know what sort of coverage areas the sonars have. EDIT: Oh yeah, a random "whine" from me: I never seem to be in the right place at the right time for task forces. Every time I've picked one up on my hydrophone, it is either nearly past me or already has passed (of course, I partially cause this by using time compression and not stopping to scan with the hydrophone enough). All of the task forces I've encountered, so far, were running so fast that I couldn't catch them. In one case, I was surfaced and running at flank on smooth-as-glass water conditions and the speed they were running at was still so great as to completely outrun me without even realizing I was in pursuit (it was dark and early-war, so I guess there were no issues with radar or whatever, and they probably weren't going to pick me up on their hydrophones, since I was behind them). In fact, the only way I could tell it was a task-force was the noise the propellors were making (warship propellors tend to be pretty distinct from merchant/cargo propellors, from what I've experienced - they always seem to sound like they are turning faster, or something - hard for me to explain)

03-15-09, 08:13 PM	#6
hulkamania Swabbie Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 8 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	And another question: The game descriptions of the various u-boats I can "purchase" with my reknown are somewhat...lacking? I mean, when I got like 30,000 reknown I upgrade from a IIVb to a IIVc, simply because I didn't have anything else to spend it on. Of course, that wasn't much of an upgrade (I would have done it anyway, but the in-game description of the boats literally only showed a difference in how much they weighed and slight variations in speed and dive rates). Where I'm going with this: Does anyone have a link to the specifications of the other boats besides the type II and type VII series? I haven't messed with transferring flotillas, because I have no idea what the advantage would be going to another type of u-boat (or if there even is an advantage). Also, if I transfer to another flotilla, does the crew I've been carrying to this point (late-1943) come with me, or do I have to start over with a new crew when I transfer flotillas?