Geert Wilders getting charged for "hate-speech"

Skybird · 01-21-09, 11:24 AM

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7842344.stm

I use to not start threads on religion, and use to no longer start threads on Islam since a long time now, but this is an exception, and it makes me furious. Wilders, whose Fitna-movie last year caused an uproar in advance and then showed to be relatively unspectacular and not overly original or new, is being charged for hate-speech. It is not the first time such charges are being started against critics of Islam in Holland. It nevertheless is of interest, because if you cannot criticise a given religion anymore without the relgion in question being able to shut your mouth by calling any critical attidue to itself a hate-crime, then not only freedom of opinion and freedom of speech is under attack, but the basic secular order of western states itself.

It also illustrates why I am totally and competely against the anti-discrimination laws in their current form implemented by the EU, which allow the same mechanism to be used to let people have their will when they demand others to comply with their demands. If you refuse to comply with such demands, for example giving an appartement that is for rent to somebody who wants it, this somebody can charge you over you discriminating him.

In European appeasement policy towards Islam, it gets illustrated that europe knows no other advise in the face of it than to fall back and deny itself, it's historically grown identity, it'S cultural values, the legal rights our ancestors have fought and suffered for so bitterly for so long ages. It illustrates that the lessons of the first half of the last century have been already forgotten, and that basic human rights and freedoms as well as cultural identity of european people in their European home countries now are worthless objects of negotiations with an aggresively expanding totalitarian ideology of conquest, if that helps cowardice to keep in power and remain cowardish, and to evade taking a stand and defend it and fighting a conflict of self-defence about it.

Thank God Hitler already took place 70 years ago. With the European people and politicians of today, the Nazis would have a much easier match, being almost invincible in the face of such weakness, cowardice that is drunk of itself and declares itself to be "tolerance", and inability to defend itself - even unwillingness to to defend itself.

On the other hand, if the one evil got overcome, just so that our people today do submit to another evil almost without any resistance at all, and all what has been gained by earlier generations in good and worthy qualities is beign given up headlessly, carelessly, for nobody can imagine anymore or knows by experience what it means to live without such freedoms anymore - what good has it all been for, then?

I am not sure and thus may recall it wrong, but I seem to remember that the Dutch already had laws forbidding any criticism of religion before the EU initiave came with it's anti-discrimination laws - that critics today already attack for not leading far enough: they want to turn them to such ways that the burden of evidence is being shifted completely to the accused, so that anybody being accused of discrimination is considered as guilty as long as his inocence is not proven, which is a complete reversing of a basic juristical principle of western law traditions. They want a new cultural climate of unlimited opportunities for diffamation. Political ideology is running amok here - and any reason and accountability already has been kicked out of the window.

This event in Holland is an alarm call - that most likely will go by unheard. It also is a great victory for Islam: European laws forbid resisting Islam and criticising it: things could not run any better for Islam.

An Islam critic gets accused of "hate-speech" for violating the wanted collective self-deception. At the same time Muslim posters in european streets calling for the death of Americans or critics of Islam, the destruction of European freedoms or the annihilation of Israel are protected and are acceptable, and hate-preachers in mosques and Muslim communities remain untouched.

One could only cry about how deep our fall is - and how unlimited our stupidity. But one thing is sure, if one sees it with honest eyes: we deserve what we sow.

SteamWake · 01-21-09, 11:27 AM

Welcome to the PC world.

longam · 01-21-09, 02:37 PM

I always like to reply in one sentence or less.

Fish · 01-21-09, 05:50 PM

He compared mein kampf with the koran and Islam with naziisme.

Lets wait for the judge to decide.

Rockstar · 01-21-09, 06:11 PM

whoever made that comparison isn't very far off the mark

http://www.militantislammonitor.org/article/id/2543

Hitler had his struggle, Islam has theirs. One calls it Mein Kampf the other jihad. I know they each have similar goals.

Tchocky · 01-21-09, 06:18 PM

Stupid charge to make.
The guy himself comes across as the usual airhorn-type. Don't give him the free publicity of a trial. And a probable acquittal.

Skybird · 01-21-09, 06:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fish

He compared mein kampf with the koran and Islam with naziisme.

So do I - on the basis of the obvious levels of aggressive expansionism, totalitarianism and superiority delusion to be found in both ideologies. And neither Wilders nor me are the first to point at these parallels. Let's charge me too, then!? Under the new EU laws, certainly.

Ah, I forgot, I already received death threats by letters some longer time ago, when I was enaged in a civil rights movement against a local mosque expansion. Maybe that rates as the same like "being charged" - for some stoneage apemen it surely does. It surely can't be a hate crime to issue death threats. Police back then told me if I press on with insisting on an investigation, I might get trouble with the BKA checking into my assumed anti-constitutional activities. Hallelujah.

P.S. I do not know Wilders any further than in context with that movie (which really was relatively lame, considering the fuss in advance around it). I do not judge or assess his other activities, since I do not know them.

Sea Demon · 01-22-09, 01:00 AM

I guess in the near future, we may just get another wave of European migrants yearning to breathe free headed our way. That is if we can maintain our free Constitutional Republic that is....

Wolfehunter · 01-28-09, 09:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mikhayl

I'm sure you can get a cheap one way flight to Canada about right now.

Canada has the same problems. Don't come here not much better.

AG124 · 01-28-09, 10:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wolfehunter

Canada has the same problems. Don't come here not much better.

Indeed, at least to a lesser extent. Here's one example that was ongoing for awhile...

http://www.cbc.ca/news/story/2007/12...-macleans.html

However, (for now at least) the complaint was eventually rejected by all human rights tribunals before which the complaint was brought; the tribunals decided (rightly, I believe) that there was an insufficient level of "contempt" and "hatred" expressed in the original article; only an academic opinion. I only hope that at least this level of sanity prevails in the future for our nation.

http://www.cbc.ca/arts/media/story/2...ns-rights.html

BTW - I believe if one searched with various combinations of "Muslims" "Lawsuit" and "MacLean's" on CBC, one will find various news articles and debates on the issue. I do not have the time myself, however.

01-21-09, 11:24 AM	#1
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 42,674 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	Geert Wilders getting charged for "hate-speech" http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7842344.stm I use to not start threads on religion, and use to no longer start threads on Islam since a long time now, but this is an exception, and it makes me furious. Wilders, whose Fitna-movie last year caused an uproar in advance and then showed to be relatively unspectacular and not overly original or new, is being charged for hate-speech. It is not the first time such charges are being started against critics of Islam in Holland. It nevertheless is of interest, because if you cannot criticise a given religion anymore without the relgion in question being able to shut your mouth by calling any critical attidue to itself a hate-crime, then not only freedom of opinion and freedom of speech is under attack, but the basic secular order of western states itself. It also illustrates why I am totally and competely against the anti-discrimination laws in their current form implemented by the EU, which allow the same mechanism to be used to let people have their will when they demand others to comply with their demands. If you refuse to comply with such demands, for example giving an appartement that is for rent to somebody who wants it, this somebody can charge you over you discriminating him. In European appeasement policy towards Islam, it gets illustrated that europe knows no other advise in the face of it than to fall back and deny itself, it's historically grown identity, it'S cultural values, the legal rights our ancestors have fought and suffered for so bitterly for so long ages. It illustrates that the lessons of the first half of the last century have been already forgotten, and that basic human rights and freedoms as well as cultural identity of european people in their European home countries now are worthless objects of negotiations with an aggresively expanding totalitarian ideology of conquest, if that helps cowardice to keep in power and remain cowardish, and to evade taking a stand and defend it and fighting a conflict of self-defence about it. Thank God Hitler already took place 70 years ago. With the European people and politicians of today, the Nazis would have a much easier match, being almost invincible in the face of such weakness, cowardice that is drunk of itself and declares itself to be "tolerance", and inability to defend itself - even unwillingness to to defend itself. On the other hand, if the one evil got overcome, just so that our people today do submit to another evil almost without any resistance at all, and all what has been gained by earlier generations in good and worthy qualities is beign given up headlessly, carelessly, for nobody can imagine anymore or knows by experience what it means to live without such freedoms anymore - what good has it all been for, then? I am not sure and thus may recall it wrong, but I seem to remember that the Dutch already had laws forbidding any criticism of religion before the EU initiave came with it's anti-discrimination laws - that critics today already attack for not leading far enough: they want to turn them to such ways that the burden of evidence is being shifted completely to the accused, so that anybody being accused of discrimination is considered as guilty as long as his inocence is not proven, which is a complete reversing of a basic juristical principle of western law traditions. They want a new cultural climate of unlimited opportunities for diffamation. Political ideology is running amok here - and any reason and accountability already has been kicked out of the window. This event in Holland is an alarm call - that most likely will go by unheard. It also is a great victory for Islam: European laws forbid resisting Islam and criticising it: things could not run any better for Islam. An Islam critic gets accused of "hate-speech" for violating the wanted collective self-deception. At the same time Muslim posters in european streets calling for the death of Americans or critics of Islam, the destruction of European freedoms or the annihilation of Israel are protected and are acceptable, and hate-preachers in mosques and Muslim communities remain untouched. One could only cry about how deep our fall is - and how unlimited our stupidity. But one thing is sure, if one sees it with honest eyes: we deserve what we sow. __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert.

01-21-09, 06:18 PM	#6
Tchocky Navy Seal Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 5,874 Downloads: 6 Uploads: 0	Stupid charge to make. The guy himself comes across as the usual airhorn-type. Don't give him the free publicity of a trial. And a probable acquittal. __________________ [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

01-21-09, 11:27 AM	#2
SteamWake Rear Admiral Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 13,224 Downloads: 5 Uploads: 0	Welcome to the PC world.

01-21-09, 02:37 PM	#3
longam Admiral Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 2,014 Downloads: 26 Uploads: 0	I always like to reply in one sentence or less.

01-21-09, 05:50 PM	#4
Fish Eternal Patrol Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Netherlands Posts: 1,923 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	He compared mein kampf with the koran and Islam with naziisme. Lets wait for the judge to decide.

01-21-09, 06:11 PM	#5
Rockstar In the Brig Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Zendia Bar & Grill Posts: 12,614 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	whoever made that comparison isn't very far off the mark http://www.militantislammonitor.org/article/id/2543 Hitler had his struggle, Islam has theirs. One calls it Mein Kampf the other jihad. I know they each have similar goals.

01-22-09, 01:00 AM	#8
Sea Demon Ocean Warrior Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: USA Posts: 2,552 Downloads: 33 Uploads: 0	I guess in the near future, we may just get another wave of European migrants yearning to breathe free headed our way. That is if we can maintain our free Constitutional Republic that is....