Detection at TC

Stingray67 · 08-13-08, 04:41 AM

Hi all.

My alter ego is currently West of Grenada in the Caribbean at 126 m listening to inaccurate DCing. It is June 1943 so I guess I should be happy it is not worse. :-)

Two questions have popped up, not necessarily because if this though.

First: Is it more likely to be detected submerged if you are on TC. There has been a number of occasions where I have slipped the net and the escort(s) are on the way back to the convoy where I have been detected when trying to speed things p a bit (never more than TC 16 or 32 though)
They escort has definitely lost me and ma heading back to herd the flock, but at TC it turns around and start looking for me quite accurately. I don't understand the inner workings of SH3 to see whether my thseis holds water or not, but it would be interesting to hear any input. I run SH3 1.4b+GWX 2.1+SH3 Commander 3.13.

Second: Is there any way to alter the ship classification presented to you when you spot a target through the UZO or periscope. Even on full manual you get "Destroyer", "Tanker", "Cargo" etc. I guess this is hardwired into the game but even this broad classification makes identification a bit easy...especially when you are at the limits of your visual range (10,000 m?)

Happy sailing to you all.

Kielhauler1961 · 08-13-08, 05:09 AM

Hi Stingray67.

There was big discussion about this over on the Ubi forum recently. I suggested from my experiences that using TC in close proximity to the enemy seems to make you more detectable. Few agreed with me and we all eventually settled for the option that it just makes your crew respond more slowly to events. I'm not convinced however. Trying, while tired, to quickly get away from a Tribal the other day at x8, he suddenly came racing towards me at full speed from a distance of 6000 metres!

I am sure that using high TC makes the boat more visible to the enemy, but I can't explain why. Don't use it until the nearest warship is hull-down on the horizon.

As for your second question, check the "no weapon's officer assistance" and "use manual targetting" boxes in the realism options menu. You are now completely left to your own devices and when you drift the crosshairs over a target, all you will get is "ship"!!! You then have to identify it using the recognition manual. You will also be required to work out angle on bow, speed etc.. Good luck.

meduza · 08-13-08, 05:43 AM

I don't think that the TC makes you more detectable, it just gives you less time to react.

For removing the ships' ID, check this, at the bottom of the page. Backup the file before making any changes.

Captain Nemo · 08-13-08, 05:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kielhauler1961

I am sure that using high TC makes the boat more visible to the enemy, but I can't explain why. Don't use it until the nearest warship is hull-down on the horizon.

The other day I was submerged at silent speed and was being hunted by a Black Swan class sloop. He was around 1,250 metres away when I decided to speed things up a little because he was dropping depth charges way off target. I increased to 64X TC. Doing this did not make the Black Swan aware of my true position and I escaped without incident. So I'm not sure that TC makes much difference, if any.

Nemo

Stingray67 · 08-13-08, 09:08 AM

Kielhauler1961:

Thanks for the reply. It is always nice to see that other people have the same gut feeling as you do. We all want confirmation, don't we? :-)

As for checking the boxes, I have. I am going full manual but I am still presented with "general" ID classifications. I don't want those either.

I will try to do it accordning to the link Meduza gave me. Thanks for that BTW.

I'll just get to port (or get killed first).

danlisa · 08-13-08, 09:35 AM

Actually the opposite is true.

TC makes you harder to detect in terms of game coding. Although this may not be noticeable within the game.

Lets use Aircraft as an example:

At 1xTC patrolling aircraft follow a precise course with active sensors covering every degree of their sensor arc. The AC also travel ALL of their allotted course. So AC travel to A > B > C > D > E

At +512xTC aircraft still follow a precise course BUT 'jump' certain distances at predefined intervals while doing this their sensors still cover the same detection arc BUT they are less likely to 'spot' you. So in this instance AC travel A > C > E, skipping point B & D, very handy if you are at point B/D.

The same is true of all 'AI' within the game.

So to the OP's question, it may seem that you are detected easier/sooner while submerged but the game does not work that way coding wise. It is just a trick of the mind as time is passing faster leaving you less time to react to or correct your actions.

Clear as Mud? I thought so.

Stingray67 · 08-13-08, 09:43 AM

Crystal clear all the way. I understand. Thanks for enlightening me to the way this monster actually works.

BUT! There have been several instances where an escort is going away after tiring of looking for me or pounding me with ashcans. They go hellbent for leather to join their convoy or resume their original course. If I leave it at that...no problem. He goes away and I am happy.

In those instances when I have, at this moment, gone to TC16 up to 64 the escort have doubled back, started accurate searches for me and sometimes atttacked me. First time I think I was killed. :-(

All due respect to they way the coding works per your description. I don't see the explanation for what I have experienced. I guess it could be some random search pattern paying off for him, but this is way too much repetition for me to think it is serendipity.

08-13-08, 04:41 AM	#1
Stingray67 Seaman Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 34 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	Detection at TC Hi all. My alter ego is currently West of Grenada in the Caribbean at 126 m listening to inaccurate DCing. It is June 1943 so I guess I should be happy it is not worse. :-) Two questions have popped up, not necessarily because if this though. First: Is it more likely to be detected submerged if you are on TC. There has been a number of occasions where I have slipped the net and the escort(s) are on the way back to the convoy where I have been detected when trying to speed things p a bit (never more than TC 16 or 32 though) They escort has definitely lost me and ma heading back to herd the flock, but at TC it turns around and start looking for me quite accurately. I don't understand the inner workings of SH3 to see whether my thseis holds water or not, but it would be interesting to hear any input. I run SH3 1.4b+GWX 2.1+SH3 Commander 3.13. Second: Is there any way to alter the ship classification presented to you when you spot a target through the UZO or periscope. Even on full manual you get "Destroyer", "Tanker", "Cargo" etc. I guess this is hardwired into the game but even this broad classification makes identification a bit easy...especially when you are at the limits of your visual range (10,000 m?) Happy sailing to you all. __________________ If you think education is expensive, try ignorance!

08-13-08, 09:08 AM	#5
Stingray67 Seaman Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 34 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	Kielhauler1961: Thanks for the reply. It is always nice to see that other people have the same gut feeling as you do. We all want confirmation, don't we? :-) As for checking the boxes, I have. I am going full manual but I am still presented with "general" ID classifications. I don't want those either. I will try to do it accordning to the link Meduza gave me. Thanks for that BTW. I'll just get to port (or get killed first). __________________ If you think education is expensive, try ignorance!

08-13-08, 09:35 AM	#6
danlisa Navy Seal Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Cornwall, UK Posts: 5,499 Downloads: 45 Uploads: 1	Actually the opposite is true. TC makes you harder to detect in terms of game coding. Although this may not be noticeable within the game. Lets use Aircraft as an example: At 1xTC patrolling aircraft follow a precise course with active sensors covering every degree of their sensor arc. The AC also travel ALL of their allotted course. So AC travel to A > B > C > D > E At +512xTC aircraft still follow a precise course BUT 'jump' certain distances at predefined intervals while doing this their sensors still cover the same detection arc BUT they are less likely to 'spot' you. So in this instance AC travel A > C > E, skipping point B & D, very handy if you are at point B/D. The same is true of all 'AI' within the game. So to the OP's question, it may seem that you are detected easier/sooner while submerged but the game does not work that way coding wise. It is just a trick of the mind as time is passing faster leaving you less time to react to or correct your actions. Clear as Mud? I thought so. __________________

08-13-08, 09:43 AM	#7
Stingray67 Seaman Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 34 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	Crystal clear all the way. I understand. Thanks for enlightening me to the way this monster actually works. BUT! There have been several instances where an escort is going away after tiring of looking for me or pounding me with ashcans. They go hellbent for leather to join their convoy or resume their original course. If I leave it at that...no problem. He goes away and I am happy. In those instances when I have, at this moment, gone to TC16 up to 64 the escort have doubled back, started accurate searches for me and sometimes atttacked me. First time I think I was killed. :-( All due respect to they way the coding works per your description. I don't see the explanation for what I have experienced. I guess it could be some random search pattern paying off for him, but this is way too much repetition for me to think it is serendipity. __________________ If you think education is expensive, try ignorance!

08-13-08, 05:09 AM	#2
Kielhauler1961 中国水兵 Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: East of the Firth of Forth Posts: 273 Downloads: 1 Uploads: 0	Hi Stingray67. There was big discussion about this over on the Ubi forum recently. I suggested from my experiences that using TC in close proximity to the enemy seems to make you more detectable. Few agreed with me and we all eventually settled for the option that it just makes your crew respond more slowly to events. I'm not convinced however. Trying, while tired, to quickly get away from a Tribal the other day at x8, he suddenly came racing towards me at full speed from a distance of 6000 metres! I am sure that using high TC makes the boat more visible to the enemy, but I can't explain why. Don't use it until the nearest warship is hull-down on the horizon. As for your second question, check the "no weapon's officer assistance" and "use manual targetting" boxes in the realism options menu. You are now completely left to your own devices and when you drift the crosshairs over a target, all you will get is "ship"!!! You then have to identify it using the recognition manual. You will also be required to work out angle on bow, speed etc.. Good luck.

08-13-08, 05:43 AM	#3
meduza Ace of the Deep Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: on patrol Posts: 1,035 Downloads: 40 Uploads: 0	I don't think that the TC makes you more detectable, it just gives you less time to react. For removing the ships' ID, check this, at the bottom of the page. Backup the file before making any changes.