What are these?

johnhealon · 05-24-08, 11:48 PM

what can u tell me about these? i got them from someone in my family.

mcf1 · 05-25-08, 12:36 AM

Are they original?

johnhealon · 05-25-08, 12:49 AM

yea they were given to my family by an american soldier after WWII. i also have an iron cross second class from my great great grandfather, nazi armband, and an afrika corps hat patch. oh and a german book from the war called Unsere Kriegsmarine, bunch of pictures and other things in it.

Phobus · 05-25-08, 05:08 AM

Hi,
The cross with the red white and black ribbon is the ‘Kriegsverdienstkreuz 2 klasse mit Schwerten’. ‘The War Merit Cross 2nd class with swords’. Instituted in October 1939 as a reward for military merit, contrary to the Iron Cross which was purely an award for bravery. There were gold and silver variations with or without swords. (G. Rosignoli, Ribbons of Orders, Decorations and Medals, Blandford 1976). If it is an original then it may have some value as it is less well known than the iron cross. Have it valued. Don’t dispose of it ‘till you do!

The epaulette with the three ‘pips’ is the rank insignia of a Captain in the British army.

The two badges with the green bars; I’m going to suggest that they might (!) be the rank insignia ‘as used on new forms of camouflage and special combat clothing that did not display the wearers rank by means of shoulder straps. These …were introduced by an order dated 22 August 1941 which covered [all] Army ranks ..worn on the upper left arm. “(B.L.Davis, Badges & insignia of the Third Reich 1933-1945, (1992), Blandford press)”.

As I said Might be! The SS ones looked similar to these but had a ‘black’ ground the single bar denoting an SS-Unterscharfuhrer and the double a SS-Scharfuhrer. It is possible that yours were standard army badges with a ‘brown’ ground instead of green which would be difficult to see. They would therefore indicate an Unteroffizer and Unterfeldwebel respectively.

The single ‘pip/star’ is similar to the ‘pips’ used by the Germans on their uniforms indicating rank.

I can’t offer any clues about the remaining badge but at a guess I’d say it is an infantry proficiency badge of some sort.

Kaleun Cook · 05-25-08, 06:21 AM

Maybe this helps: The one with the helmet and the crossed guns says "wehrfähig", meaning something like 'able to serve in the army', so it might be some general badge for drafted ppl, although it seems a bit senseless to me to produce badges for all of those. GL making them to money.

johnhealon · 05-25-08, 11:09 AM

i also have these, and so the british rank epaulette is it supposed to have things that look like iron crosses on it?

05-24-08, 11:48 PM	#1
johnhealon Swabbie Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Sicily, not Italy Posts: 10 Downloads: 23 Uploads: 0	What are these? what can u tell me about these? i got them from someone in my family.

05-25-08, 12:36 AM	#2
mcf1 Seasoned Skipper Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Greece, Volos Posts: 710 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	Are they original?

05-25-08, 12:49 AM	#3
johnhealon Swabbie Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Sicily, not Italy Posts: 10 Downloads: 23 Uploads: 0	yea they were given to my family by an american soldier after WWII. i also have an iron cross second class from my great great grandfather, nazi armband, and an afrika corps hat patch. oh and a german book from the war called Unsere Kriegsmarine, bunch of pictures and other things in it.

05-25-08, 05:08 AM	#4
Phobus Gunner Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Poole. Dorset UK Posts: 93 Downloads: 13 Uploads: 0	Hi, The cross with the red white and black ribbon is the ‘Kriegsverdienstkreuz 2 klasse mit Schwerten’. ‘The War Merit Cross 2nd class with swords’. Instituted in October 1939 as a reward for military merit, contrary to the Iron Cross which was purely an award for bravery. There were gold and silver variations with or without swords. (G. Rosignoli, Ribbons of Orders, Decorations and Medals, Blandford 1976). If it is an original then it may have some value as it is less well known than the iron cross. Have it valued. Don’t dispose of it ‘till you do! The epaulette with the three ‘pips’ is the rank insignia of a Captain in the British army. The two badges with the green bars; I’m going to suggest that they might (!) be the rank insignia ‘as used on new forms of camouflage and special combat clothing that did not display the wearers rank by means of shoulder straps. These …were introduced by an order dated 22 August 1941 which covered [all] Army ranks ..worn on the upper left arm. “(B.L.Davis, Badges & insignia of the Third Reich 1933-1945, (1992), Blandford press)”. As I said Might be! The SS ones looked similar to these but had a ‘black’ ground the single bar denoting an SS-Unterscharfuhrer and the double a SS-Scharfuhrer. It is possible that yours were standard army badges with a ‘brown’ ground instead of green which would be difficult to see. They would therefore indicate an Unteroffizer and Unterfeldwebel respectively. The single ‘pip/star’ is similar to the ‘pips’ used by the Germans on their uniforms indicating rank. I can’t offer any clues about the remaining badge but at a guess I’d say it is an infantry proficiency badge of some sort.

05-25-08, 06:21 AM	#5
Kaleun Cook Chief Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: ger Posts: 313 Downloads: 25 Uploads: 0	Maybe this helps: The one with the helmet and the crossed guns says "wehrfähig", meaning something like 'able to serve in the army', so it might be some general badge for drafted ppl, although it seems a bit senseless to me to produce badges for all of those. GL making them to money.

05-25-08, 11:09 AM	#6
johnhealon Swabbie Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Sicily, not Italy Posts: 10 Downloads: 23 Uploads: 0	i also have these, and so the british rank epaulette is it supposed to have things that look like iron crosses on it?