Point of new Silent Hunter

silentrunner · 12-31-07, 12:35 AM

A large topic among sub sim gamers is that of the creation of a new Silent Hunter. But while SH4 was a good game it did not match up to the capabilities of SH3' what went wrong? I think that SH3 had an overall better engine tobegin with, amd with mods like GWX it is almost a totally different game from vanilla SH3. If Ubisoft created another game with the capabilities of GWx and SH3 they would most likely make alot of money. They would also risk creating another SH4 a game that tried to match up to the capabilities as SH3 but just didn't have as good of an overall design. I would like to get your thaughts about wether a new SH game should be made or if they should just keep upgrading SH3. Keep in mind that as the game is further upgraded more people are buying it so there sales are still going up.

kenijaru · 12-31-07, 02:05 AM

great supermods will be released for SH4 too.... eventually

and when that happens it'll probably surpass SH3.

CCIP · 12-31-07, 02:24 AM

Define "better" in this case.

I fail to see the point, especially since SHIV's engine is the same engine, only with improvements. SHIV, in my view, is a much better game and a much better engine out of the box than SHIII, and fixed many things that were amiss in SHIII.

There are only two reasons to prefer SHIII over SHIV: 1) the fact that SHIV's mod development cycle is still in an early stage while SHIII is close to peak; 2) it is not an Atlantic sim, and some just like the Atlantic.

Elsewhere, while SHIV may have produced a few new pet peeves for experienced SHIII players (like the crew not being as responsive when clicked on for example), objectively speaking it IS the development that was needed for the SHIII engine. Its only real fault is that it was released a few months early.

As for "upgrading SHIII" - two words - "dream on". We're lucky SHIV is getting treated with that U-boat expansion, even. Otehrwise you're more likely to see Ubi make a new Atlantic sim at this point than patch SHIII - if you want the money side of this, they'd much rather spend money on development of a new $60 game than on upgrading an old (from their point of view - long-obsolete) game that costs no more than $10 a pop now.

Adriatico · 12-31-07, 02:57 AM

The optimal project could be much simplier than previously thought...If develpers team could reach a common ground with GWX team - it would take a couple of months to "inject" SHIV graphic engine (even improved one) into present accumulated achievements of WolfPack... Anyway, GWX 2.0 lacks only a modern graphics improvements expected in some 2008 simulation release... as they were permanently limited by the ancient graphic engine.Such a SHV would not be "three years project"... and I would be the first one to pay such a DVD title... and many, many more gamers. Even without significant marketing investments...

rik007 · 12-31-07, 03:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CCIP

Define "better" in this case.

I fail to see the point, especially since SHIV's engine is the same engine, only with improvements. SHIV, in my view, is a much better game and a much better engine out of the box than SHIII, and fixed many things that were amiss in SHIII.

There are only two reasons to prefer SHIII over SHIV: 1) the fact that SHIV's mod development cycle is still in an early stage while SHIII is close to peak; 2) it is not an Atlantic sim, and some just like the Atlantic.

Elsewhere, while SHIV may have produced a few new pet peeves for experienced SHIII players (like the crew not being as responsive when clicked on for example), objectively speaking it IS the development that was needed for the SHIII engine. Its only real fault is that it was released a few months early.

As for "upgrading SHIII" - two words - "dream on". We're lucky SHIV is getting treated with that U-boat expansion, even. Otehrwise you're more likely to see Ubi make a new Atlantic sim at this point than patch SHIII - if you want the money side of this, they'd much rather spend money on development of a new $60 game than on upgrading an old (from their point of view - long-obsolete) game that costs no more than $10 a pop now.

I think there will come a SH-V version but it is not the right moment to start planning it. Ubi first will launch the add-on and after that it will be a logical step to start planning SH-V which should be in the Atlantic. The Atlantic theatre is much popular than the Pacific and offers the potential for Ubi moreover as within a few years the community will start complianing about the outdated graphics.

Gezoes · 12-31-07, 04:05 AM

Well, one way or the other... I bet we will see the, superior, SHIV graphics in the Atlantic. Until that time though... SH3 it is. I doubt there will be a SH5 in the near future, after SH4 more or less bombed with the fans. That divide has nothing to do with graphics however. It's sound and gameplay.

SH4 is a non-immersive sim, complete with things like a horrible interface and little things like switching the F-keys around. I hate when devs change something that was nearly PERFECT. If that can be overhauled, SH4 is the platform to build on.

Until that time, give me the second skin that is SH3 any day

Von Manteuffel · 12-31-07, 08:21 AM

IMHO the economics are against any forseeable new WWII submarine release, apart from patches and the promised "U-Boats in SH4" update. As has been said, SH3 off the shelf is now a remaindered item, available for very little and sold to clear existing stock. We should also remember that, in the minds of Ubisoft, the modding-community is "doing very nicely thank you" with developing SH3 - to the point where, I suspect - they see absolutely no need to invest any more time, or money in it.

In certain respects, SH4 was a step forward and, really, can be regarded as a development of SH3 - just as Medieval Total War was a development of Rome Total War. Apart from tweaks and a one-hit upgrade which will generate some interest / sales; Ubisoft may well regard subsims as "job done."

Pooters and graphics capabilities are improving and developing at an incredible rate, but I submit there has to be a better reason to spend profits on existing products than the fact that newer, faster and better graphics-cards and screens are available.

My money would be on any future submarine sim. - and there has to be a question-mark over the global level of interest / profit in submarine sims at all - but if it does happen, I think it will either be part of a massive new World War naval simulation, or, as with the Call of Duty franchise, be very modern, involving nuclear subs as well as diesel-electric boats

kiwi_2005 · 01-01-08, 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by silentrunner

A large topic among sub sim gamers is that of the creation of a new Silent Hunter. But while SH4 was a good game it did not match up to the capabilities of SH3' what went wrong? I think that SH3 had an overall better engine tobegin with, amd with mods like GWX it is almost a totally different game from vanilla SH3. If Ubisoft created another game with the capabilities of GWx and SH3 they would most likely make alot of money. They would also risk creating another SH4 a game that tried to match up to the capabilities as SH3 but just didn't have as good of an overall design. I would like to get your thaughts about wether a new SH game should be made or if they should just keep upgrading SH3. Keep in mind that as the game is further upgraded more people are buying it so there sales are still going up.

:rotfl::rotfl:

So who paid you to say that about SH4.

Maybe try the mods for SH4 and your think way differently. Would you still be playing SH3 without mods today?

My thoughts we dont need a new SH for the moment we got SH3 with GWX 2 or are you sick of that already, and we got SH4 with some great mods that make the game how its meant to be. Plus the Uboat Addon coming out soon. Hell stop worrying and go sink some ships!

TomcatMVD · 01-01-08, 10:10 AM

I'd bet my dollars on a nuclear subsim, maybe URSS vs US.
That's the way it always goes... look at battlefield, Call of Duty, and so on...
That's my two cents on it

ReallyDedPoet · 01-01-08, 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kiwi_2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by silentrunner

A large topic among sub sim gamers is that of the creation of a new Silent Hunter. But while SH4 was a good game it did not match up to the capabilities of SH3' what went wrong? I think that SH3 had an overall better engine tobegin with, amd with mods like GWX it is almost a totally different game from vanilla SH3. If Ubisoft created another game with the capabilities of GWx and SH3 they would most likely make alot of money. They would also risk creating another SH4 a game that tried to match up to the capabilities as SH3 but just didn't have as good of an overall design. I would like to get your thaughts about wether a new SH game should be made or if they should just keep upgrading SH3. Keep in mind that as the game is further upgraded more people are buying it so there sales are still going up.

:rotfl::rotfl:

So who paid you to say that about SH4.

Maybe try the mods for SH4 and your think way differently. Would you still be playing SH3 without mods today?

My thoughts we dont need a new SH for the moment we got SH3 with GWX 2 or are you sick of that already, and we got SH4 with some great mods that make the game how its meant to be. Plus the Uboat Addon coming out soon. Hell stop worrying and go sink some ships!

Well said

RDP

Brer Rabbit · 01-01-08, 11:55 PM

As a relative NOOB to the world of Subsims and to computer gaming as a whole, I just wantd to add my $.02 into the discussion. As I said in earlier posts, I cut my teeth on Silent Service (Atari) and Silent Service II early PC, as well as 688I and Harpoon series. I purchsed SHII years ago, but gave up on it due to lack of time, and what I considered a steep learning curve. I am now retired, and if I can duck out of Momma's demands on my time, I enjoy more time on the Computer. I installed SHIII a few years ago, did not play it until recently. I really came to enjoy the challenge it offers. When SHIV came out I immediately ran out and purchased it. Then the problems began. First my GFX card wasn't up to the challenge, and my computer just met specs. I ran out and upgraded the GFX card ( Nividia Fx 6200, which of course barley meets the requirements. The I saw that I needed more memory -- out I ran for 2 GB of memory. SHIV runs, but not to its full potential.
To make this long story short as has been mentioned subsimmers are a fairly small group and an older group of gamers, and one of UBIs errors was to come out with simulation that challenged many of those of us with older computers, with out a means to get into the game short of investing a substantial on new computer, or upgrades. That in itself limited the marketibility as well as increasing the frustration of many players.
They might have done better by offering an upgradable SHIV based more on the SHII engine as far as computer requirements go and offering upgrades of the game for more capible computers with all the bells and whistles.

Enjoy both games but I play SHIII more, due to computer limits. Both are super simulations. One your on the winning side and the other your on the losing side with totally differnt challenges. Hope they and the fantastic modders keep up the good work.

Sorry for the long post

Brer Rabbit AKA Kaluen Broderhase

Riggsie15 · 01-02-08, 07:48 AM

In my opion SH3's grapics run better and emerse you in the game better.

SH4 featurs are better, i.e. different mission objections and a better map.

SH3 with GWX and SH4 features would be great. In addition the single game with expansions bringing in more sub fractions that overlape on each other; i.e. core game = U-boats, exp1 = USA subs, exp2 = British subs, exp3 = Jap subs; would result in the ultimate subsim!

IrischKapitan · 01-03-08, 08:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riggsie15

In my opion SH3's grapics run better and emerse you in the game better.

SH4 featurs are better, i.e. different mission objections and a better map.

SH3 with GWX and SH4 features would be great. In addition the single game with expansions bringing in more sub fractions that overlape on each other; i.e. core game = U-boats, exp1 = USA subs, exp2 = British subs, exp3 = Jap subs; would result in the ultimate subsim!

Ahhhh we can only dream

12-31-07, 12:35 AM	#1
silentrunner Watch Officer Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Mind your own business English Types Posts: 334 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Point of new Silent Hunter A large topic among sub sim gamers is that of the creation of a new Silent Hunter. But while SH4 was a good game it did not match up to the capabilities of SH3' what went wrong? I think that SH3 had an overall better engine tobegin with, amd with mods like GWX it is almost a totally different game from vanilla SH3. If Ubisoft created another game with the capabilities of GWx and SH3 they would most likely make alot of money. They would also risk creating another SH4 a game that tried to match up to the capabilities as SH3 but just didn't have as good of an overall design. I would like to get your thaughts about wether a new SH game should be made or if they should just keep upgrading SH3. Keep in mind that as the game is further upgraded more people are buying it so there sales are still going up. __________________

12-31-07, 02:24 AM	#3
CCIP Navy Seal Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Waterloo, Canada Posts: 8,700 Downloads: 29 Uploads: 2	Define "better" in this case. I fail to see the point, especially since SHIV's engine is the same engine, only with improvements. SHIV, in my view, is a much better game and a much better engine out of the box than SHIII, and fixed many things that were amiss in SHIII. There are only two reasons to prefer SHIII over SHIV: 1) the fact that SHIV's mod development cycle is still in an early stage while SHIII is close to peak; 2) it is not an Atlantic sim, and some just like the Atlantic. Elsewhere, while SHIV may have produced a few new pet peeves for experienced SHIII players (like the crew not being as responsive when clicked on for example), objectively speaking it IS the development that was needed for the SHIII engine. Its only real fault is that it was released a few months early. As for "upgrading SHIII" - two words - "dream on". We're lucky SHIV is getting treated with that U-boat expansion, even. Otehrwise you're more likely to see Ubi make a new Atlantic sim at this point than patch SHIII - if you want the money side of this, they'd much rather spend money on development of a new $60 game than on upgrading an old (from their point of view - long-obsolete) game that costs no more than $10 a pop now. __________________ There are only forty people in the world and five of them are hamburgers. -Don Van Vliet (aka Captain Beefheart)

12-31-07, 02:57 AM	#4
Adriatico Grey Wolf Join Date: May 2007 Location: Periscope depth Posts: 860 Downloads: 119 Uploads: 0	The optimal project could be much simplier than previously thought...If develpers team could reach a common ground with GWX team - it would take a couple of months to "inject" SHIV graphic engine (even improved one) into present accumulated achievements of WolfPack... Anyway, GWX 2.0 lacks only a modern graphics improvements expected in some 2008 simulation release... as they were permanently limited by the ancient graphic engine.Such a SHV would not be "three years project"... and I would be the first one to pay such a DVD title... and many, many more gamers. Even without significant marketing investments... __________________

12-31-07, 04:05 AM	#6
Gezoes XO Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 435 Downloads: 22 Uploads: 0	Well, one way or the other... I bet we will see the, superior, SHIV graphics in the Atlantic. Until that time though... SH3 it is. I doubt there will be a SH5 in the near future, after SH4 more or less bombed with the fans. That divide has nothing to do with graphics however. It's sound and gameplay. SH4 is a non-immersive sim, complete with things like a horrible interface and little things like switching the F-keys around. I hate when devs change something that was nearly PERFECT. If that can be overhauled, SH4 is the platform to build on. Until that time, give me the second skin that is SH3 any day __________________ If I wasn't a little mad, I'd go mad.

01-01-08, 11:55 PM	#11
Brer Rabbit Briar Patch Runner Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Tucson, AZ Posts: 95 Downloads: 89 Uploads: 0	SH Series As a relative NOOB to the world of Subsims and to computer gaming as a whole, I just wantd to add my $.02 into the discussion. As I said in earlier posts, I cut my teeth on Silent Service (Atari) and Silent Service II early PC, as well as 688I and Harpoon series. I purchsed SHII years ago, but gave up on it due to lack of time, and what I considered a steep learning curve. I am now retired, and if I can duck out of Momma's demands on my time, I enjoy more time on the Computer. I installed SHIII a few years ago, did not play it until recently. I really came to enjoy the challenge it offers. When SHIV came out I immediately ran out and purchased it. Then the problems began. First my GFX card wasn't up to the challenge, and my computer just met specs. I ran out and upgraded the GFX card ( Nividia Fx 6200, which of course barley meets the requirements. The I saw that I needed more memory -- out I ran for 2 GB of memory. SHIV runs, but not to its full potential. To make this long story short as has been mentioned subsimmers are a fairly small group and an older group of gamers, and one of UBIs errors was to come out with simulation that challenged many of those of us with older computers, with out a means to get into the game short of investing a substantial on new computer, or upgrades. That in itself limited the marketibility as well as increasing the frustration of many players. They might have done better by offering an upgradable SHIV based more on the SHII engine as far as computer requirements go and offering upgrades of the game for more capible computers with all the bells and whistles. Enjoy both games but I play SHIII more, due to computer limits. Both are super simulations. One your on the winning side and the other your on the losing side with totally differnt challenges. Hope they and the fantastic modders keep up the good work. Sorry for the long post Brer Rabbit AKA Kaluen Broderhase

12-31-07, 08:21 AM	#7
Von Manteuffel Commander Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: UK Posts: 473 Downloads: 411 Uploads: 0	IMHO the economics are against any forseeable new WWII submarine release, apart from patches and the promised "U-Boats in SH4" update. As has been said, SH3 off the shelf is now a remaindered item, available for very little and sold to clear existing stock. We should also remember that, in the minds of Ubisoft, the modding-community is "doing very nicely thank you" with developing SH3 - to the point where, I suspect - they see absolutely no need to invest any more time, or money in it. In certain respects, SH4 was a step forward and, really, can be regarded as a development of SH3 - just as Medieval Total War was a development of Rome Total War. Apart from tweaks and a one-hit upgrade which will generate some interest / sales; Ubisoft may well regard subsims as "job done." Pooters and graphics capabilities are improving and developing at an incredible rate, but I submit there has to be a better reason to spend profits on existing products than the fact that newer, faster and better graphics-cards and screens are available. My money would be on any future submarine sim. - and there has to be a question-mark over the global level of interest / profit in submarine sims at all - but if it does happen, I think it will either be part of a massive new World War naval simulation, or, as with the Call of Duty franchise, be very modern, involving nuclear subs as well as diesel-electric boats

01-01-08, 10:10 AM	#9
TomcatMVD Weps Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: MVD, UY Posts: 359 Downloads: 7 Uploads: 0	I'd bet my dollars on a nuclear subsim, maybe URSS vs US. That's the way it always goes... look at battlefield, Call of Duty, and so on... That's my two cents on it

01-02-08, 07:48 AM	#12
Riggsie15 Watch Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Toowoomba, QLD, Australia Posts: 23 Downloads: 39 Uploads: 0	Sh3 + Sh4 = Sh5 (?) In my opion SH3's grapics run better and emerse you in the game better. SH4 featurs are better, i.e. different mission objections and a better map. SH3 with GWX and SH4 features would be great. In addition the single game with expansions bringing in more sub fractions that overlape on each other; i.e. core game = U-boats, exp1 = USA subs, exp2 = British subs, exp3 = Jap subs; would result in the ultimate subsim! __________________ Current Status Game: Silent Hunter 3 (GWX 3 Gold, SH Command) Career: Rank: Boat: Patrols: Ships Sunk: Tonnage: