AOB Questions - please help me :(

[ORioN17]

Hello

I have been playing SH3 (never on realistic settings) and now SH4 (have gone for it and have TM1.6 and full realism on) off and on for a while now, I've been hanging around these forums reading all the helpfull info from time to time. Well i am addicted to SH4 now, and with all the mods created by everyone you have improved SH4 10 times over, well done to everyone who has done them all.

Anyways to the point, what I am struggling with really really badly is how to calculate the angle on bow, I currently guess it but its giving me a very low hit rate. I have searched the forums for info and keep finding different ways etc, but I was hoping someone on these forums can give me the definate answer "Orion you do it like this, the easy way". I have watched the videos Wernersobe made and they have helped me allot so thank you for them, but I am still struggling on how you calculate the AOB correctly, Ive also seen people use a AOB type protractor mod, could someone point me in the right direction to get hold of it if thats what I need?

Well all help would be appreciated, I really want to get better at this game and feel confident with all the realism switch on.

Thanks in advance

Orion.

[Crawlerz]

guy, after 1.3 it's very easy to at last calculate the AOB w/o resorting to "gesstimates". to get the AOB, do this... say visually track, identify and lock ur target. calculate range (with the dial) and send it to TDC. then wait. (with lowered periscope.) later (about the time u think u'll take the shot,) goto periscope, and lock ur target again. calculate range (again). and it u did it well THEN u can ask ur officer to give u a good estimate to the target's speed pressing the "chronometer" button on the speed TDC dial. the officer has not only given u the target's speed, but also its heading. NOW u goto buisness! click the AOB dial and on the opposite side of the screen (see the target position dail as well as the angles of ur torpedo and its hit according to ship?) the upper dial on the left. it shows the ship's heading in relation to the AOB. now turn the right AOB dial untill the target's heading is what the officer said it was in the upper left dail! understand? http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=118923 this'll explain it better.

[Rockin Robbins]

Now I'm going to call this the WernerSobe method because I first saw it clearly explained in his videos, but it existed before that. *ducks*

I don't like the estimate after 2 sightings method because if you measure a range wrong, the AOB ends up wrong. You'll never know it until the torpedo misses. And if the target changes heading, again you won't know it. I believe nothing takes the place of a plot.

The plot starts by calling up the stopwatch and your pencil, marking a starting position for your target and punching the stopwatch button. Time 3 minutes to start and mark the ending position of the boat. Measuring the distance between the two with the compass will let you calculate the speed. For a 3 minute timing, you take the measurement in miles, multiply by ten (just drop the decimal) and double it. A measurement of .3 miles means the target is going six knots. Leave the stopwatch running until six minutes to double check that speed. This time you don't have to double the number, you'll measure .6 miles, meaning 6 knots.

But the plot gives you much more important information too. Connect those plot points and extend the line in the direction of target movement. This is the target's course. Now at a glance, you can tell if the target changes course! With help on you can use the ruler tool to measure the exact course of the target. This is invaluable to plotting an intercept course. And you can immediately tell if the target changes speed or course. This will eliminate many wasted torpedoes.

Now you want the exact AOB? Take your protractor tool and first click on the course line ahead of the target, then click on the target itself. Lastly click on your boat. You can see the angle measured right inside the angle there by the target. That is his AOB. Make sure to enter that starboard or port depending on which side of the target you are looking at. This is the most accurate way to measure AOB for the purpose of achieving torpedo accuracy. (Actually, you are not measuring legal angle on the bow at all but we don't care about that. This will sink the enemy.)

You can use this course information. On the TDC (left side, not the input portion on the right side of the periscope) you can see the AOB measurement ring on the inside. But the outside ring is the course of the target! By adjusting the AOB to achieve a perfect course of the target, you get the absolute most accurate AOB for the TDC that is attainable. Where does that course come from? The plot.

Start the Position Keeper right after you have a speed, range and AOB in the TDC. If the target doesn't change course or speed and your inputs are accurate, you can check the PK against the actual position of the target to see if you have made any errors. You started your plot way before it was time to shoot. When he comes into shooting range you should be so synchronized that you can lower the scope for the last five minutes and shoot with the scope down. The next sound you hear will be BOOOOOOOM!

Once you get comfortable with plotting and hunger for more, there is a program on Subsim called MoBo, the Electronic Maneuvering Board and Dead Reckoning Plotter. It will do all the measuring for you, leaving you just to slide yourself, targets and nodes around on the plotting board. It automatically plots course, speed, angle on the bow and it makes coffee! Actually I made up the part about the coffee. Maybe that will be in the next version.

So use that chart table. It isn't taking up all that space in the control room to give you somewhere to eat.

[Doolan]

And how does that differ from what the crew does automatically? It's also based on measuring two sightings, so if you get the distance wrong the problem persists.

The way I use to make extra sure is having a second opinion. I take the first measurement of the distance, mark it on the map, wait three minutes, do the three-minute rule, then ask the crew. I use an average of both angles / speeds and fire a couple of torps to make really sure.

It only goes the way of the pear when the target changes course (not unlikely in TMaru 1.6 where one out of ten DDs can see at night from miles away) or when torpedoes go dud on me (I hit a kongo with two duds yesterday)

[NefariousKoel]

The best way I found to practice your AoB estimates is to leave map contact updates on and look at the attack map (2nd button from left on Nav tab).

When your scope is up and you've just input all the goodies, check that screen and a white line will show where your estimated target should be and the line shows it's estimated heading. Go back and adjust the AoB until you're happy with the results.

After doing this for awhile you'll get a feel for estimating the AoB quite accurately the first time you try and then you won't even need to check the attack map, you'll be so damn good at it.

[Rockin Robbins]

Originally Posted by NefariousKoel

The best way I found to practice your AoB estimates is to leave map contact updates on and look at the attack map (2nd button from left on Nav tab).

When your scope is up and you've just input all the goodies, check that screen and a white line will show where your estimated target should be and the line shows it's estimated heading. Go back and adjust the AoB until you're happy with the results.

After doing this for awhile you'll get a feel for estimating the AoB quite accurately the first time you try and then you won't even need to check the attack map, you'll be so damn good at it.

That's a good point. I'm used to the Trigger Maru mod where a lot of that unrealistic stuff is removed. There are no ship silhouettes, lines for target heading or torpedo tracks. The attack screen is still usable, but I'd recommend not using TM until you are pretty good without it.

@Doolan As I explained, the utility of the plot is to be able to spot immediately any changes in target course or speed, and to detect errors in the crew's estimate of speed and course. You'll find the plot is always a more accurate tool than using the two sights and ask the crew method. Yes, a spread will compensate for the slop factor, and yes you should use a spread even if you're perfect like I'm not. lol As you implied, success is the result of planning for and mitigating the effect of the inevitable errors that happen in combat.

Interestingly, in real WWII subs the input was usually based on a gut-level eyeball assessment of the AOB. Skippers trained with model ships on turntables, comparing their visual estimates with actual numbers and got quite good at it. Wonder if someone could make a trainer for us? In SH3 there is a mod for the recognition book that lets you rotate the silhouette to reproduce what you see in the scope and tells you the AOB. That would be real cool here!