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07-31-05, 10:05 AM | #1 | |
Naval Royalty
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Re: Sources for good missions
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08-01-05, 03:40 AM | #2 |
Commander
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My opinion, is that you have 2 very different kind of game :
solo mission where the story and the realism have a great importance to ensure immersion of the player in a mission or a campagne. MP mission where the more important thing is 1) the balance of side 2) replayability 3) good choice of objectives 4) and mission duration. Realism is not a priority here. Quite different objectives for these 2 kind of scenarios. I try to make my MP mission playable also in solo, and this is not always really easy (scripting each plateform). Finally, I don't take the realism (I mean geopolitical realism) in consideration when making a MP mission, just because its limit a LOT the possibilities to make a good and exiting MP mission But I actually work on a KILO campaign, and this campaign won't be playable in MP (because of mission duration). This campaign will be as close as possible from the actual geostrategic worldmap. |
08-02-05, 02:04 AM | #3 |
Sea Lord
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Good summary - I would like to see this post under the 'Working examples' thread,
which is an excellent starting point for we 'Learners'. Good enough I think for a 'Sticky' ? Done! |
08-08-05, 12:10 PM | #4 | |
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TG
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08-08-05, 12:13 PM | #5 | |
中国水兵
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Re: Sources for good missions
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TG
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08-09-05, 12:51 PM | #6 | ||
Commander
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I can say, as usual MP player, I never had people saying, during the mission, they don't like it because it's "geopolitically" unrealistic. The goal is to make it interesting and to give a nice fight, well balanced, with action and the much work possible (nothing worth than to wait 1h30 before something happen ...) If you look at my missions, you will see no one of them is more than 2 hours of games, usually, they are about 1H before one of the sides gets its objectives. But during these 1H or 45mn, there is always 15 to 30 mn of positionning / data collection before engagment. If you always try to have geopolitical realism, mission have DEEP chance to be bad balanced, just because if you do this, one side will be MUCH more strong than the other (US to name it) I prefer interesting game instead to kill the interest in the name of 'realism'. Because 'realistic' mission is way too long and way to unbalanced in real life ... And that's why I said I concentrate on realism ONLY on solo mission, form reasons mentionned above. Replayability is a probably one of the main factor to consider => dynamic group (to have something different each time) coupled to dynamic locations can make a mission replayable lots of time with different conditions. It's very important for me as I often play my maps with friends. And I still don't have lots of map made ... talking about this, I'd like very much to have random wheater and sea states on editor ... TimmyG00, I don't know how much often you play on MP match, but as regular player, I can tell you the more important is the quality of the engagment, and not the name of the boats ... |
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08-09-05, 04:50 PM | #7 | |||||
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I agree that Single Player missions are more conducive to realism, in that the player can spend much more time on them. However, if you create the mission properly, you can simulate realistic engagements on a shorter (MP) time scale.
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The bottom line is that you CAN have a respectable degree of realism in a multiplayer match. You simply must have the right stuff TG
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08-09-05, 05:40 PM | #8 | |
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Re: Sources for good missions
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08-09-05, 05:51 PM | #9 | |
Naval Royalty
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The study would be my CIC... I'd have to rename the dining room the "wardroom"... I agree with you, though. Much of what makes a scenario compelling is that it's a big "what if" based on historical, projected, or current circumstances. Multiplayer or not, something about it has to capture me. Otherwise... I might as well be playing Doom. I think there's two kinds of people that play DW, though. At least, from what I've seen. One is has some kind of real-life experience with naval issues, and wants to use it as a way to play through things they think about. The other kind probably hasn't had any real life experience, and is looking for a pickup game with their friends, and captures what they read in Tom Clancy novels or whatever. I'm not sure both camps can ever really be totally satisfied. |
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08-09-05, 08:32 PM | #10 | |||
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TG
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08-09-05, 10:08 PM | #11 |
Sea Lord
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I have to say I agree with both OKO and Timmyg00. :hmm: Oh yes.
Discussion here seems to frequently take a 'mine is better than yours ' direction quite unnecessarily. It is possible both to enjoy playing realistic scenarios and those where realism is not a priority. I thought that it was only horses that wore blinkers. An example - Take shooting - Possible to walk the fields or take the clays and yes jump a 4 x 4 and 'torch' at night. Varying degrees of reality all enjoyable. I agree with OKO's ' important things ' but would have inserted the words ' the only ' before priority. I am struggling to learn scenario design currently and hope to borrow from features implemented by both protaganists and the excellent surprise and adrenalin boosting features of the Fish scenarios. What this thread has demonstrated is that I will have to attach labels to my scenario descriptions ( Health Warnings) egs. :- ' A realistic encounter.' ' A neo-realistic scenario with surprise elements.' ' A fun paint-ball action scenario' We mus'nt forget that our 'serious' sims future will depend largely on attracting and involving a broader spectrum of 'gamers.' Embrace this or risk a loss widely experienced in the flight sim. market. Fun and realism are not mutualy exclusive. |
08-09-05, 11:51 PM | #12 | ||
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All I see is a legitimate discussion on whether realism can be a part of short duration ( ~2 hour) multiplayer scenarios. OKO thinks it cannot, and I disagree. Pretty simple. Nobody said anything about any one type of mission being more fun than another; enjoyment is completely subject to personal taste. Don't bring a bucket of water when there's no fire :P TG
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08-10-05, 01:03 AM | #13 |
Sea Lord
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I see no bucket.
I see no fire. Just good humour for those who can appreciate it . OKO '' ...... can tell you the more important is the quality of the engagment, and not the name of the boats ...'' Seaqueen '' What DW really needs is a 72hr MP mega-scenario for ASW. Feel the burn baby! '' :hmm: |
08-10-05, 12:16 PM | #14 |
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OK, whatever. Let's just get back on topic and dispense with the irrelevancies.
TG
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08-10-05, 01:41 PM | #15 |
Sea Lord
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Yep
Would it help players if designers did effectively 'label' the type of challenge posed to the player ? 'Realistic' mission task operation descriptions are focused and one is not anticipating the out of character appearance of units not normaly found in operational waters. The 'unrealistic' fantasy scenarios have a more unstrutured range of options. I was serious about labelling/health warnings which would take the form of for example - in the description - '' A fun 2 v 2 MP sub combat scenario around seamounts with some 'foreign AI surprises'' :hmm: |
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