[WIP] IRAI (Intelligent Random AI)

[gap]

Originally Posted by TheDarkWraith

That's already in IRAI. In order for a ship to fire DCs they have to have a contact > 4m in depth and their speed has to be > 2knots. I had these values higher and then people complained ships never threw DCs. You can't win.

Maybe increasing a bit min speed and DC's detonating depth, and decreasing a little bit DC's range?

Thinking out loud, another workaround would be assigning new damage zones to destroyer bows, and setting their armor higher than the maximum armour that DC's can penetrate or, if possible, reducing DC's armor penetration to the minimum needed for them to still damage the soft submarine hull at their maximum range...

[Fifi]

To me, escort AI is enough strong and not really a game problem anymore (except for launching DC)
But i have a little request about merchant AI:
- it would be very welcome if they could escape sub opposite direction full speed, as it was probably in RL when a U-Boot attacked, cause actually they tend to slow down for a while before heading other direction (mainly in convoy state)...and they never accelerate! They remains very nice targets
Logical behavior should be ahead full in any direction and zig-zagging
They tend to be back original heading direction too fast also.
It's sometimes a real killing party when non escorted:



EDIT: forgot to say i'm also using Sober deck gun mod...when to much wind, gun becomes almost useless (and it's good thing) but when sea is calm...like above...

[dcb]

Originally Posted by Fifi

But i have a little request about merchant AI:
- it would be very welcome if they could escape sub opposite direction full speed, as it was probably in RL when a U-Boot attacked, cause actually they tend to slow down for a while before heading other direction (mainly in convoy state)...and they never accelerate! They remains very nice targets

That's what I noticed too, and it's a major game breaker IMO. When I attack a convoy (with latest IRAI installed, always), instead of running away at full speed, merchant ships slow down and become sitting ducks, while all the escorts are busy chasing me.
IRL, the convoy would have run away at full speed, while a limited number of destroyers (never the full complement) would have attempted to keep the Uboat down until the convoy was beyond reach.

[johan_d]

and the area should become hot, destroyers, task forces etc should home in to the location if they are in the vincinity, like lets say 200 km ?
maybe they can patrol after the attack the area (a big area) ?

[Fregattenkapitän]

Very nice mod,

This mod actually lets you think twice before attacking a destroyer.
In the stock game attacking a destroyer is no big problem, and even when you are spotted by one of them they are not a big threath.
Your really need avoid any destroyer's you see
even in convoy or the HK groups. I was testing this mod when i was attacking a HK group of 4 destroyers from the Tribal class.

I really got pinned, they dropped a tons of depth charge's
and they even called in for help, 5 destroyer came to the help.
With a total of 9 destroyer pinning me down, i had no chance of surviving.




IRAI is a very decent mode for realisme.

[TheDarkWraith]

things will get really interesting once I finish the carriers spawning aircraft patch for the game.

Here's how the game works in regards to carriers and airbases (land):

A timer is checked to see if it's time to spawn airgroup units. If it's time:
game goes through every unit in the game and compares the distance from them to the carrier/airbase to a fixed value. If the distance is within the fixed value the game will spawn an airgroup unit. The airgroup unit is given random starting position and random waypoints.

My patch changes the code in the above so that if the unit is a carrier and the carrier has the unit as a contact then an airgroup unit is spawned. It's starting position is the carrier. It's given a waypoint of the contact's current position and another waypoint as the carrier's current position. This means the unit will head directly to the contact and once done return to the carrier position (when it spawned the aircraft). The unit is free to engage other contacts if it detects them (a la IRAI) before arriving at unit's position or when returning to the carrier.

I could make it really complex and update the airgroup unit's carrier's waypoint with the carrier's current position so that the unit will always return to the carrier's current position but decided it wasn't worth the time and code. Instead I set the altitude to a ridiculously high value so you'll never see it disappear from the game

I've been working on this patch for over 4 months and the end is near

[gap]

Originally Posted by TheDarkWraith

things will get really interesting once I finish the carriers spawning aircraft patch for the game.

Cool

On a slightly unrelated note: is loadout type of aircraft affecting their AI routines? I need to know it for my tests on the new B-25 that I am still working on

[TheDarkWraith]

Originally Posted by gap

Cool

On a slightly unrelated note: is loadout type of aircraft affecting their AI routines? I need to know it for my tests on the new B-25 that I am still working on

From what I've seen in the code (so far and what I have decoded) no. What determines a unit's AI routines is the type of unit (i.e. 102, 300, 200, etc.) and of course the AI code (IRAI). The AI code will determine whether it does bomb runs, torpedo run, etc.

[gap]

Originally Posted by TheDarkWraith

From what I've seen in the code (so far and what I have decoded) no.

so, what is the use of this "type" entry in planes cfg file?

Originally Posted by TheDarkWraith

What determines a unit's AI routines is the type of unit (i.e. 102, 300, 200, etc.) and of course the AI code (IRAI). The AI code will determine whether it does bomb runs, torpedo run, etc.

I have a problem with the B-25 bomber: in single mission she only fires a few shots of her front guns before dropping her bombs, (or during her first attack run, I don't remember exactly right now). Then, no matter how much rounds are left, she won't fire them again (even though guns keep tracking the target) and she keeps circling around my U-boat forever.

I have tried increasing gun's training/elevation range, and improving plane's handling, but with no apparent result. UnitType is set to 301.

[TheDarkWraith]

Originally Posted by gap

so, what is the use of this "type" entry in planes cfg file?




I have a problem with the B-25 bomber: in single mission she only fires a few shots of her front guns before dropping her bombs, (or during her first attack run, I don't remember exactly right now). Then, no matter how much rounds are left, she won't fire them again (even though guns keep tracking the target) and she keeps circling around my U-boat forever.

I have tried increasing gun's training/elevation range, and improving plane's handling, but with no apparent result. UnitType is set to 301.

You'd have to send me the unit and the test mission you are using so I can see what's going on using the debugger.

[gap]

Originally Posted by TheDarkWraith

You'd have to send me the unit and the test mission you are using so I can see what's going on using the debugger.

Here:

http://www.mediafire.com/?b9qhrzwdsz8cj5w

only one of the frontal guns and the dorsal turret got a gun controller, but at the moment I am more concerned about the frontal gun (just ignore the turret). Launch any of the single missions included.

I have also noticed that the bomber got problems dropping its torpedo. No matter how low I set the minimum height, in many cases the plane starts circling, loosing altitude and falling down in the water before she can fire her fish. In other cases, the B-25 manages to achieve a good firing position, but the torpedo moves backward () as it inherited a reversed momentum from the plane, and when it finally touches the water, it falls down to the seabed and explodes.

[TheDarkWraith]

Originally Posted by gap

I have also noticed that the bomber got problems dropping its torpedo. No matter how low I set the minimum height, in many cases the plane starts circling, loosing altitude and falling down in the water before she can fire her fish. In other cases, the B-25 manages to achieve a good firing position, but the torpedo moves backward () as it inherited a reversed momentum from the plane, and when it finally touches the water, it falls down to the seabed and explodes.

Try setting the maximum speed of the unit to a larger value in it's .cfg file.

The torpedo problem is a sign of hitting a collision sphere or box on the unit. Lower the torpedo's hardpoint (do a drastic lowering) and see if it doesn't cure the problem. There is a minimum distance (arming distance - 300m) the torpedo must travel before it's able to detonate. If the torpedo 'hits' something before this 300m then it acts like a dud (which is what you are seeing).

[vanjast]

Originally Posted by gap

I have a problem with the B-25 bomber: in single mission she only fires a few shots of her front guns before dropping her bombs, (or during her first attack run, I don't remember exactly right now). Then, no matter how much rounds are left, she won't fire them again (even though guns keep tracking the target) and she keeps circling around my U-boat forever.

Maybe it's modeled 'correctly' where the plane circles out of gun range while calling a destroyer in (that's if this tactic is really modeled).
If you dive, maybe it might attack again - try this.

IIRC.. it was rare for a bomber to attack a U-boat more than once, unless they were sure they had done some good damage - an aircraft is very vulnerable.. especially in the middle of the ocean. All attacks, if possible, were based on tracking and surprise - after the first attack is was generally suicidal to attack again.

[gap]

Originally Posted by TheDarkWraith

Try setting the maximum speed of the unit to a larger value in it's .cfg file.

The torpedo problem is a sign of hitting a collision sphere or box on the unit. Lower the torpedo's hardpoint (do a drastic lowering) and see if it doesn't cure the problem. There is a minimum distance (arming distance - 300m) the torpedo must travel before it's able to detonate. If the torpedo 'hits' something before this 300m then it acts like a dud (which is what you are seeing).

Okay, I will do as you are suggesting I will let you know

On your end, please keep me informed on anything wrong you may find about the gun issue.

Originally Posted by vanjast

Maybe it's modeled 'correctly' where the plane circles out of gun range while calling a destroyer in (that's if this tactic is really modeled).
If you dive, maybe it might attack again - try this.

No, as per IRAI settings, planes keep diving on their target until the last gun round. Or forever, if for some reason they can't fire their weapons.

Originally Posted by vanjast

IIRC.. it was rare for a bomber to attack a U-boat more than once, unless they were sure they had done some good damage - an aircraft is very vulnerable.. especially in the middle of the ocean. All attacks, if possible, were based on tracking and surprise - after the first attack is was generally suicidal to attack again.

I agree. A while back I suggested TDW to make planes to end their attack once they drop their bombs. Unfortunately, there are many limitations to what can be done with aircraft AI.

[TheDarkWraith]

Originally Posted by gap

I agree. A while back I suggested TDW to make planes to end their attack once they drop their bombs. Unfortunately, there are many limitations to what can be done with aircraft AI.

That is how IRAI used to be. People complained so I changed it. Here's the problem: say said plane attacks another unit and drops it bombs. That unit submerges and hides. Plane continues on waypoints. Plane encounters another enemy unit. If IRAI is setup so that planes don't attack anymore if they have no bombs or torpedoes then said plane continues on with it's waypoints. Here in is where people complained airplanes never attack. What is the plane has no bombs or torpedoes from the start? Then it never attacks anything.