[REL] Real Fleet Boat - Page 95

ryanwigginton · 02-10-08, 01:04 AM

Before you lock this thread I would just like to add, that this stubborn Yorkshire man is infact my SubSim hero. All the best Beery.

swdw · 02-10-08, 03:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beery

Quote:

Originally Posted by vanjast

This info is kept in the Guns.sim file. Beery was quiet stubborn about this even with mounting evidence to the contrary...

No evidence ever appeared that showed any submarine deck gun being fired at a rate faster than 22 seconds per round in actual combat conditions - that is the fastest reload rate anyone could produce (after the challenge was out there for at least 12 months) for any deck gun in actual combat.

The only thing I was 'stubborn' about when it came to RFB was that any part of the simulation had to be based on ACTUAL combat reports if such reports were available. In the case of gun reload rates those reports are available and not a single one shows a reload rate faster than 22 seconds per round. Anything faster is fantasy, and fantasy is not simulation.

This is the last time I will speak on this subject in this thread. I'm tired of defending a realistic rate of fire against those who insist on turning a simulation into a fantasy.

Beery is right- the old comment from Bill Nichols was handled in the other thread. There was an anomaly that caused the gun reload times on my system to be 4x longer than the settings in the sim file. Not knowing this was an anomaly I adjusted the gun files and had reload times of 24 sec for the 4 inch guns and 28 for the 5 " guns. However, when RFB was released, it was 6 & 7 seconds on other people's machines. People thought I'd drastically shortened the reload times when I was actually extending them for the 4 and 5 inch guns. So everyone though I was deliberately shortening the reloads because of what they saw on their machines.

On the next RFB release. the reload times will be put back to a longer reload, and will just have a hofix for people suffering from the 4x multiplier.

Nuff said- I agree with Beery on this subject.

vanjast · 02-10-08, 04:25 AM

I suppose with a weak crew reload time will be slightly longer, as these articles say the numbers are different with an experienced crew..
Conditions wise there are videos of the crew using the gun, when up to their knees in water, and firing at a fairly fast rate. Yes! I know that these are Uboats

http://www.uboataces.com/tactics-deckgun.shtml

http://uboat.net/technical/guns.htm

If these numbers were not true (or way off the mark) I'm sure there would have been objections and corrections. One can still do this.
I'd settle for an average reload time of 10 secs for all conditions.

Anyway.. for those who want to change the reload times.. I'll produce a few files with adjustments..
Testing and playing - here's an Uber-Crew reload rate example...

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v2...nt=DeckGun.flv

Have problems uploading to my webby so used 'the bucket' instead..

Sailor Steve · 02-10-08, 12:43 PM

I've said it before and I'll continue to say it: Beery's numbers, on average, are accurate. Yes, you can load and fire these guns in 4-5 seconds, in a calm, level sea. As soon as the waves start to rise you can still load the gun that fast, but aiming takes longer. As the weather worsens loading times do go down, as it's hard to keep your balance and pass objects along.

The game models exactly none of this, which no-one ever seems to take into account. While you're busy 'correcting' the firing rates, why don't you figure out a way to make it truly accurate? Or is realism not the real goal?

And yes, I've seen the videos. Do you think they were filming actual operations, in a condition to put the camera personnel in danger, or were they just filming to show they could do it? Were they actually aiming at a real target, or just firing at nothing? Cameras show exactly what the filmmaker wants you to see.

Beery did a huge amount of research, and a fine job.

vanjast · 02-11-08, 04:37 PM

I (and many others) really appreciate the work that gone into the mods (Real Uboat/Fleet boat) and I prefer this mod to the others. I know it's not easy, having done the Real Nav mod which took about 6 months 'of sundays' to finalise. Even then it wasn't 'perfect' due the the game 'Moddability'.

One does get tired of the rambling, but all I ask, is consideration that it surely cannot be 'set in stone' that it 'must be like this'. Of course it doesn't have to be, but you know...

Dogzero1 · 02-11-08, 07:45 PM

Thanks for this MOD. The RFB mod is my favourite having spent the last two weeks solid trying everything available. I have settled with this mod.

Thanks for the hard work modders.

zinger98 · 06-21-10, 08:10 PM

Is there a reason with RFB 2.07 that I never have a deck gun?

fitzcarraldo · 08-06-10, 11:59 AM

I use SH4 1.5 plus TMO 2.0 plus RSRDC, and SH4 1.5 plus FOTRS (in other installation); in both I have some problems (CTD in ports, for example. My machine runs SH4 very good at 60 FPS, no memory or graphic card problems...I tired with the CTDs...

). Now, I want to try, for the first time, the RFB.

Some questions:

Compatibility with RSRDC? I read about some problems in this forum...

Environmental mod? I read RFB has some environment mod included. True? If not: the Pacific Environment 4.0 is OK, or the Real Environment (Carotio´s, both mods).

Many thanks!

Fitzcarraldo

sergei · 08-06-10, 12:09 PM

zinger98 and fitzcarraldo.

You would do better to post your questions in the RFB 2.0 thread (current release)
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=159709

This thread is from years ago, when Beery was still developing it, before Luke and his team took over.

fitzcarraldo · 08-06-10, 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sergei

zinger98 and fitzcarraldo.

You would do better to post your questions in the RFB 2.0 thread (current release)
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=159709

This thread is from years ago, when Beery was still developing it, before Luke and his team took over.

OK. I make the questions in that thread!

Thanks.

Fitzcarraldo

WalterJConklin · 10-18-10, 09:40 AM

Hello,

I had originally posted the following message in a seperate thread, but someone recommended I post my message here.

I have SH 4 with patch 1.4 installed, and am running the Real Fleet Mod that is compatible with 1.4. I am commanding the S-18 during the navigation class in submarine school. The sub doesn't even respond when I hit the p key. I have to manually move the depth gauge to get the sub to dive or select crash dive. I would appreciate your help with getting the sub to dive.

Thanks,
Walter

Fish40 · 10-19-10, 08:14 AM

A couple of suggestions for ya. First, you should really post your RFB questions in the current RFB thread entitled "RFB 2.0". A new team has taken over the development of this Mod since Beery, and all questions should be directed there. Second, I strongly urge you, if possible to purchase SH4 Gold, which contains the U Boat missions and updates the game to v1.5, or to purchase the seperate 1.5 download for $10.00. This is the latest version of the game, and all the major mods are based on 1.5. Just some friendly advice

WalterJConklin · 10-19-10, 10:07 AM

Hi, Thank you for taking the time to respond to my post. I will post my message in the thread you recommended. Before purchasing an add-on, I want to get SH4 to work properly in the sense tha my sub and I can respond to the tasks specified in the Submarine School classes. My research has led me to learn that other people have reported problems getting the S-18 to dive with the RFB mod.

As an aside, several years ago, I purchased SH4, but I lost interest in the game because I could not get the deck gun to work properly during the artilerary training class. A few days ago, I developed a renewed interest in SH4. I hope to be able to graduate from submarine school eventually.

Sincerely,
Walter

Fish40 · 10-19-10, 10:23 AM

Hi Walter. I use RFB, and I love it! Combined with the RSRD mod wich introduces historical shipping lanes and traffic, I won't play the game without them. Again, I urge you to update to 1.5 either by purchasing the seperate download, or getting the Gold edition (that's what I did) so everything is in one package.

I'm not familiar with the S boat dive problem, but it may be something that was addressed with the 1.5 patch, as were other bugs.

02-10-08, 01:04 AM	#1411
ryanwigginton Weps Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Nottinghamshire Posts: 368 Downloads: 68 Uploads: 0	Before you lock this thread I would just like to add, that this stubborn Yorkshire man is infact my SubSim hero. All the best Beery. __________________ Windows 8 Pro 64-bit, Intel Core i7-2760QM @ 2.40GHz, 8GB RAM, AMD Radeon HD 6990M

02-10-08, 04:25 AM	#1413
vanjast Sea Lord Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Somewhere else now Posts: 1,734 Downloads: 825 Uploads: 4	I suppose with a weak crew reload time will be slightly longer, as these articles say the numbers are different with an experienced crew.. Conditions wise there are videos of the crew using the gun, when up to their knees in water, and firing at a fairly fast rate. Yes! I know that these are Uboats http://www.uboataces.com/tactics-deckgun.shtml http://uboat.net/technical/guns.htm If these numbers were not true (or way off the mark) I'm sure there would have been objections and corrections. One can still do this. I'd settle for an average reload time of 10 secs for all conditions. Anyway.. for those who want to change the reload times.. I'll produce a few files with adjustments.. Testing and playing - here's an Uber-Crew reload rate example... http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v2...nt=DeckGun.flv Have problems uploading to my webby so used 'the bucket' instead.. Last edited by vanjast; 02-10-08 at 06:02 AM.

02-10-08, 12:43 PM	#1414
Sailor Steve Eternal Patrol Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: High in the mountains of Utah Posts: 50,369 Downloads: 745 Uploads: 249	I've said it before and I'll continue to say it: Beery's numbers, on average, are accurate. Yes, you can load and fire these guns in 4-5 seconds, in a calm, level sea. As soon as the waves start to rise you can still load the gun that fast, but aiming takes longer. As the weather worsens loading times do go down, as it's hard to keep your balance and pass objects along. The game models exactly none of this, which no-one ever seems to take into account. While you're busy 'correcting' the firing rates, why don't you figure out a way to make it truly accurate? Or is realism not the real goal? And yes, I've seen the videos. Do you think they were filming actual operations, in a condition to put the camera personnel in danger, or were they just filming to show they could do it? Were they actually aiming at a real target, or just firing at nothing? Cameras show exactly what the filmmaker wants you to see. Beery did a huge amount of research, and a fine job. __________________ “Never do anything you can't take back.” —Rocky Russo

02-11-08, 07:45 PM	#1416
Dogzero1 Bosun Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: West Yorkshire Posts: 62 Downloads: 54 Uploads: 0	Thanks for this MOD. The RFB mod is my favourite having spent the last two weeks solid trying everything available. I have settled with this mod. Thanks for the hard work modders. __________________

06-21-10, 08:10 PM	#1417
zinger98 Swabbie Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 8 Downloads: 42 Uploads: 0	Hmmm... Is there a reason with RFB 2.07 that I never have a deck gun?

02-11-08, 04:37 PM	#1415
vanjast Sea Lord Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Somewhere else now Posts: 1,734 Downloads: 825 Uploads: 4	I (and many others) really appreciate the work that gone into the mods (Real Uboat/Fleet boat) and I prefer this mod to the others. I know it's not easy, having done the Real Nav mod which took about 6 months 'of sundays' to finalise. Even then it wasn't 'perfect' due the the game 'Moddability'. One does get tired of the rambling, but all I ask, is consideration that it surely cannot be 'set in stone' that it 'must be like this'. Of course it doesn't have to be, but you know...

08-06-10, 11:59 AM	#1418
fitzcarraldo Argentinian Skipper Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Somewhere between Buenos Aires and the Bungo Suido Posts: 5,318 Downloads: 3345 Uploads: 0	I use SH4 1.5 plus TMO 2.0 plus RSRDC, and SH4 1.5 plus FOTRS (in other installation); in both I have some problems (CTD in ports, for example. My machine runs SH4 very good at 60 FPS, no memory or graphic card problems...I tired with the CTDs...). Now, I want to try, for the first time, the RFB. Some questions: Compatibility with RSRDC? I read about some problems in this forum... Environmental mod? I read RFB has some environment mod included. True? If not: the Pacific Environment 4.0 is OK, or the Real Environment (Carotio´s, both mods). Many thanks! Fitzcarraldo __________________ *My subject is War, and the pity of War. The Poetry is in the pity - Wilfred Owen.*

08-06-10, 12:09 PM	#1419
sergei Sea Lord Join Date: May 2008 Location: London UK Posts: 1,788 Downloads: 405 Uploads: 29	zinger98 and fitzcarraldo. You would do better to post your questions in the RFB 2.0 thread (current release) http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=159709 This thread is from years ago, when Beery was still developing it, before Luke and his team took over.

10-18-10, 09:40 AM	#1421
WalterJConklin Mate Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 52 Downloads: 58 Uploads: 0	RFB 1.4 Hello, I had originally posted the following message in a seperate thread, but someone recommended I post my message here. I have SH 4 with patch 1.4 installed, and am running the Real Fleet Mod that is compatible with 1.4. I am commanding the S-18 during the navigation class in submarine school. The sub doesn't even respond when I hit the p key. I have to manually move the depth gauge to get the sub to dive or select crash dive. I would appreciate your help with getting the sub to dive. Thanks, Walter

10-19-10, 08:14 AM	#1422
Fish40 The Old Man Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Yonkers, NY U.S.A. Posts: 1,507 Downloads: 154 Uploads: 0	A couple of suggestions for ya. First, you should really post your RFB questions in the current RFB thread entitled "RFB 2.0". A new team has taken over the development of this Mod since Beery, and all questions should be directed there. Second, I strongly urge you, if possible to purchase SH4 Gold, which contains the U Boat missions and updates the game to v1.5, or to purchase the seperate 1.5 download for $10.00. This is the latest version of the game, and all the major mods are based on 1.5. Just some friendly advice

10-19-10, 10:07 AM	#1423
WalterJConklin Mate Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 52 Downloads: 58 Uploads: 0	Hi, Thank you for taking the time to respond to my post. I will post my message in the thread you recommended. Before purchasing an add-on, I want to get SH4 to work properly in the sense tha my sub and I can respond to the tasks specified in the Submarine School classes. My research has led me to learn that other people have reported problems getting the S-18 to dive with the RFB mod. As an aside, several years ago, I purchased SH4, but I lost interest in the game because I could not get the deck gun to work properly during the artilerary training class. A few days ago, I developed a renewed interest in SH4. I hope to be able to graduate from submarine school eventually. Sincerely, Walter

10-19-10, 10:23 AM	#1424
Fish40 The Old Man Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Yonkers, NY U.S.A. Posts: 1,507 Downloads: 154 Uploads: 0	Hi Walter. I use RFB, and I love it! Combined with the RSRD mod wich introduces historical shipping lanes and traffic, I won't play the game without them. Again, I urge you to update to 1.5 either by purchasing the seperate download, or getting the Gold edition (that's what I did) so everything is in one package. I'm not familiar with the S boat dive problem, but it may be something that was addressed with the 1.5 patch, as were other bugs.