US Politics Thread 2016-2020

[Rockstar]

Originally Posted by Jimbuna

Scary stuff...if true.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...-election-loss

Surely the military hierarchy would run a million miles away before complying to any such order from an outgoing president.

Surely in this day and age people would by now realize anything having to do with Iran the plans and established doctrine have been considered many times over. This includes military strikes, economic sanctions, ginning up internal strife and revolution etc etc. They may not always make a headline but those those options are always considered.

The idea that one man can just out of the blue think to bomb another country because he wants too is ludicrous. That's from European history not ours.

If 'we' were to bomb Iran such action would have been long in the making and Trump would just be a scapegoat. Something to keep in mind too all those bases around the middle east are not just U.S. They are NATO. If the feces hits the rotating oscillator we are all gonna take a big bite out that crap sandwich.

[Mr Quatro]

Iran and NK are both hoping another fence sitter like Obama is taking over the WH so they can push their way around
and become the big men on campus in the nuclear warfare field.

Let Israel take out Iran and the USN back them up says Admiral Quatro

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by Rockstar

Surely in this day and age people would by now realize anything having to do with Iran the plans and established doctrine have been considered many times over. This includes military strikes, economic sanctions, ginning up internal strife and revolution etc etc. They may not always make a headline but those those options are always considered.

The idea that one man can just out of the blue think to bomb another country because he wants too is ludicrous. That's from European history not ours.

If 'we' were to bomb Iran such action would have been long in the making and Trump would just be a scapegoat. Something to keep in mind too all those bases around the middle east are not just U.S. They are NATO. If the feces hits the rotating oscillator we are all gonna take a big bite out that crap sandwich.

I'm happy to take that all into consideration but when was the last time the US had such an unpredictable commander-in-chief like they currently have?

[Rockstar]

Originally Posted by Jimbuna

I'm happy to take that all into consideration but when was the last time the US had such an unpredictable commander-in-chief like they currently have?

Way I see it there's a big difference between telling everyone how unpredictable he is and how unpredictable he actually is. When it comes to foreign and domestic policies he has been very predictable. In fact I would go so far as to say has fallen lock step with the things that really matter regarding major current foreign and domestic policy doctrines. Take a step back for a moment and look and you will find nothing of great importance has really changed at all. Nor does he have any special magical powers of unpredictability which would allow him to launch a one man strike against Iran. Its an impossibility.


edit: Not to say a strike is an impossibility. Just for a president in this country to act on a some kind of unpredictable whim is.

[mapuc]

Originally Posted by Jimbuna

Scary stuff...if true.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...-election-loss

Surely the military hierarchy would run a million miles away before complying to any such order from an outgoing president.

And this was what I mentioned in one of my comments after nov. 3. That he will leave the office with a country at war with Iran and/or NK.

Skybird responded and said something with burnt soiled.

Let's hope it stays inside speculation.

Markus

[Bilge_Rat]

Originally Posted by Jimbuna

Scary stuff...if true.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...-election-loss

Surely the military hierarchy would run a million miles away before complying to any such order from an outgoing president.

Trump is the President until january 20, 2021.

Bush sr. sent 28,000 marines into Somalia in dec. 1992, after he had been beaten by Clinton.

https://www.politico.com/story/2018/...4-1992-1037009

No one questioned his authority to do it.

[Jimbuna]

Was the US less divided then than it is now though?

[Rockstar]

Originally Posted by Bilge_Rat

Trump is the President until january 20, 2021.

Bush sr. sent 28,000 marines into Somalia in dec. 1992, after he had been beaten by Clinton.

https://www.politico.com/story/2018/...4-1992-1037009

No one questioned his authority to do it.

But Bush did not send troops in because he lost the election or to get back at Clinton. Neither was the planned intervention in Somalia something that was dreamt up over night. Bush had support of the U.N., his advisors, Department of State, key figures in congress and the military to relieve a major humanitarian crisis long in the making. Even Britain, Belgium, France, Canada, Pakistan and Jordan contributed to the cause.

I'll say it again its an impossibility for a sitting president to launch a strike because of some widely held belief he is subject to unpredictable whims. On the other hand as Somalia shows us, military intervention during transitions of power is nothing new either.

If we were to start bombing power plants in Iran its not going to be because of something that was just dreamt up overnight or some perceived election loss butthurt either. In fact what I find the scariest out of all of this is if it were to happen Trump WOULD make the perfect scapegoat and people around the world would readily lap it up and believe it. All that would mean to me is the President isn't really the one that makes the decisions and has no real power.

[Onkel Neal]

Originally Posted by Jimbuna

I'm happy to take that all into consideration but when was the last time the US had such an unpredictable commander-in-chief like they currently have?

Well, to be fair, since 1980 every single time a Republican is President they have been accused of being a war-mongering, dangerous maniac by Europe and the US lefties. .

Reagan: The Left and Europe wet their pants over everything he did. Worked out pretty well in the end.

Bush I: Managed to come through with his hide intact.

Bush II: Oh man, I was warned not to wear a Bush for President t-shirt in europe. Even had people get angry with me over there because I supported Bush Jr.

[Rockstar]

I don't think the anti-war, anti-U.S. peace loving, its not us, Europeans have yet to figure out how deep they are in the middle east. Its not just the U.S. ya we pay for a lot of it. But they are knee deep in the feces with us.


The word of the day is 'CJTF-OIR'

[Bilge_Rat]

Originally Posted by Rockstar

On the other hand as Somalia shows us, military intervention during transitions of power is nothing new either.

That was more my point, there is one POTUS at a time and he (or she) has the full powers of the office for the full 4 years.

One scenario which has been war gamed over the years is what would happen if an adversary tried to take advantage of the transition period to launch an attack.

For example, In another group I am a member of, way back in 2016, before the election, we had gamed out what would happen if the Russians had decided to launch a full scale invasion of Ukraine in late november 2016, after the election, but while Obama was still President.

It is clear that in a fast moving situation like that, you don't want to have any confusion about who is in charge and in command of the U.S. military.

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by Onkel Neal

Bush II: Oh man, I was warned not to wear a Bush for President t-shirt in europe. Even had people get angry with me over there because I supported Bush Jr.

Yes, I remember you telling me

[Hawk66]

Originally Posted by Onkel Neal

Well, to be fair, since 1980 every single time a Republican is President they have been accused of being a war-mongering, dangerous maniac by Europe and the US lefties. .

I would add also "lefties" for Europe here. I grew up in the 80s as a kid (in Germany). Reagan was hated by the "lefties but that was not the common approach toward him. The Conservatives/liberals supported him in general and that were the majority in the 80s in Germany, UK and other European countries (ok, I get stoned now by some folks here putting UK and European in one context )

[Mr Quatro]

The news I heard was that Trump merely asked what his options were about Iran enriching uranium 12 times more than allowed

What's wrong with that?

[Rockstar]

Originally Posted by Mr Quatro

The news I heard was that Trump merely asked what his options were about Iran enriching uranium 12 times more than allowed

What's wrong with that?

Its none of his business, decisions like these aren't made by Presidents I guess.