GWX's "uber" AI demystified

[Kitzbuell]

Originally Posted by fredbass

I'm sure many players still aren't aware that lowering your speed at silent running to 2k will make a big difference and therefore probably haven't added the Dec. 23 fix either, for one reason or another. I've found that once that is accomplished, there is nothing exceptionally tough about avoiding damage, as long as I have some depth to work with and the war is still in a fairly early point in time.

And remember what Ducimus has showed you. It can be an advantage to run at a shallower depth to keep your acute angle towards a ship at a minimum, if possible.

Ducimus:

Great explanation of many facets/techniques I was aware of and one I had totally wrong {I could have sworn that when I first purchased SH3 years ago that I read somewhere that your sub's movements (both hydrophone and asdic) would be temporarily masked.}.

[To FredBass:

What exactly was the "Dec. 23 fix"?]

[Jimbuna]

IIRC the Dec 23rd fix/patch was used on the first release of GWX (hard to keep track)
If you are using GWX v1.03 it is already included

[Kitzbuell]

Originally Posted by jimbuna

Ships in GWX no longer sink only based on damage, but also flooding. To obtain credit you need to stay within approximate area of the vessel.
Bad weather is treated by the game engine as damage.

I suspected as much after trying to stick with a crippled "Revenge" only to be chased by DD's until it put so much distance between us that by the time I was able to relocate the convoy it had disappeared from the surface and my crew received no credit for their hard work or the pounding they survived by the DC attack that went on for hours following our strike. :hmm:

[Stary Wuj]

In real life was much easier, YEAR 1939, very bad weather, my speed 2 kts,
they exactly know where I'm (my depths 40-150m.) - IN HEAVY STORM!

This is not realism.

Best Regards

Stary Wuj

[Kpt. Lehmann]

Originally Posted by Stary Wuj

In real life was much easier, YEAR 1939, very bad weather, my speed 2 kts,
they exactly know where I'm (my depths 40-150m.) - IN HEAVY STORM!

This is not realism.

Best Regards

Stary Wuj

The AI responses in SH3 and GWX are not perfect... and there is no way to make them perfect for all circumstances.

However, even in 1939 the ASW forces should be relatively tough... not too easy. 57 U-boats were available for service during 1939, and in the few months of fighting in 1939, nine U-boats were lost. This is about a 16% loss rate. Quite significant I think.

The enemy in GWX does not automatically detect you. Something had to happen to alert them to your presence.

[Stary Wuj]

Kpt. Lehmann --> just courious - All DD's in GWX are "expert" from the start ?
You see, I really like GWX, but there is no way (for example) to attack convoy at night on the surface (like in real life).
I was spotted by DD (Year 1940) from 1,5 km. distance on periscope depth in
rough sea state, can You see periscope from 1,5 km. in bad weather conditions ?



Only 2 examples, but no doubt, something wrong with GWX AI..........

Best Regards

Stary Wuj

[Kpt. Lehmann]

Originally Posted by Stary Wuj

Kpt. Lehmann --> just courious - All DD's in GWX are "expert" from the start ?
You see, I really like GWX, but there is no way (for example) to attack convoy at night on the surface (like in real life).
I was spotted by DD (Year 1940) from 1,5 km. distance on periscope depth in
rough sea state, can You see periscope from 1,5 km. in bad weather conditions ?



Only 2 examples, but no doubt, something wrong with GWX AI..........

Best Regards

Stary Wuj

Enemy crew proficiency is commensurate with the progression of the war. They are not all elite at the beginning of the war.

Check out this thread. http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=116322

[Saldiray]

Hi. I've been playing SH3 1.4b with GWX 1.0 mod installed, for a while. On my last patrol i was detected by the lone escort of a convoy, on the hydrophones i could easily hear the escort speeding up for the attack run, but i was still being pinged so i decided to raise my scope to see where the other escort was but there were none! i checked on the hydrophones as well and it was the only warship in the area. And the lone escort continued to ping me till he was on top of me. I thought there should be a 200 mt def zone in front of the escort where he couldn't ping me anymore. What's wrong with it then? Is this some kind of side effect of GWX 1.0? OK, i see that escorts have UberAI, but lack of 200mt def zone isn't related to AI, i think.

[TarJak]

Originally Posted by Saldiray

Hi. I've been playing SH3 1.4b with GWX 1.0 mod installed, for a while. On my last patrol i was detected by the lone escort of a convoy, on the hydrophones i could easily hear the escort speeding up for the attack run, but i was still being pinged so i decided to raise my scope to see where the other escort was but there were none! i checked on the hydrophones as well and it was the only warship in the area. And the lone escort continued to ping me till he was on top of me. I thought there should be a 200 mt def zone in front of the escort where he couldn't ping me anymore. What's wrong with it then? Is this some kind of side effect of GWX 1.0? OK, i see that escorts have UberAI, but lack of 200mt def zone isn't related to AI, i think.

Did you read the first post of this thread? I can't see any reference to a 200m def zone and in my experience there never has been one. what gave you the impression that there was one?

[Saldiray]

According to http://uboat.net/allies/technical/asdic.htm web page, the asdic contact was usually lost at 300 yards. This is the time the u-boat should try to evade any deptch charge attack. And if there wasn't a def zone of the asdic why would the escords need a weapon like "hedgehog"? As far as i know hedhehogs were fired just before the contact was lost on asdic.

[TarJak]

OK you are talking about the difference between real life and the game. There are a lot of things in SHIII which are not quite the way they were in RL.

I suggest reading the first post of this thread for a description on how ASDIC/SONAR works in SHIII and in particular with GWX. It actually discusses some of the reasons for the differences between RL and game.

This thread has some other useful information: http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=105198

[Saldiray]

I've read the first page, but in stock SH3 i remember the escorts quit pinging before starting their attack run. But in GWX, if the escorts could ping me till they're on top of me how could i ever evade them?

PS: Thanks for the link, it's nice to see that i'm not the only one.

[Jimbuna]

There's one thing you can always depend on here.....whilst GWX exists you'll never be "the only one"

Good luck

[ref]

Originally Posted by Saldiray

I've read the first page, but in stock SH3 i remember the escorts quit pinging before starting their attack run. But in GWX, if the escorts could ping me till they're on top of me how could i ever evade them?

PS: Thanks for the link, it's nice to see that i'm not the only one.

The fact that the escorts are using they active sensors doesn't necesary mean that they have a fix on you, just that they're searching.

Ref

[Shelton]

Very informative article - thanks Ducimus!