Nasty surprise. Immersion killer

Lost At Sea · 01-03-06, 09:06 AM

First post in 2006 so 'Happy New Year' to all of you out there.

Been playing this sim since the very first day. Full realism and latest RUB and for the very first time i faced a real immersion killer. So this will be my first rant on this forum, and hopefull the last.

Never bored before with raiding harbours but on this mission i decided to sneak into Scapa and try my luck.
Survived the Western approach and eventually found 3 DDs anchored, not great but better than nothing. All were at engines full stop (i supposed), no smoke, 0 speed and no sound. Got nice and close to 2 of them (500 m) and fired my torps.

They instantly went full ahead, smoking like hell as if they had been attacking me for an hour. Missed both of them of course. Discusted I surfaced to end it all fast.
Is the same happening with capital ships in Scapa?.... I haven't tried the single mission.

cheers anyway

The Avon Lady · 01-03-06, 10:15 AM

Did you fire T1s at them during daytime, leaving a distinct bubble trail on the surface for them to easily spot? If so, see what would happen if you'd fire T3s or wait till dark to fire T1s.

Other than that, there is an old and known gripe that ships in SH3 can go from zero to their max speed way too fast. Oversight by developers.

Redwine · 01-03-06, 10:36 AM

It is logical if a stopped ship detect a periscope, or a sub proppeller sound or a torp proppeller sound at hydrophones, they quickly start to scape.

That sounds unreal...... is if they can do it in very few seconds.

Considering a 15m/s torp speed it takes about 33 second to the torp to hit the target at 500m.

May be they was not "anchored", may be they was stopped "listen" for you, due to a early warning, some hydrophone detection, or some radar detection of your periscope, then they losse the contact and stops the engines to listen for you, and may be they was not anchored .......... may be posible ?

Lost At Sea · 01-03-06, 12:20 PM

I did fire T1s but it was like 2:00 AM on a cloudy night. The DDs really seemed to be anchored one in front of the other, equal distance of each other and bows pointing in the same direction, as if all placed on a straight line.
Oh well, I'm dead anyway. Will just have to remember that next time :hmm:

cheers

wetwarev7 · 01-03-06, 01:40 PM

I wonder if they can "hear" a torp being fired?

how long after you fired it did they wake up?

Lost At Sea · 01-03-06, 02:48 PM

Fired my torps, lowered scope and went to hydrophone station to do a sound check and immediately i heard their screws

Rushed back to periscope, raised it and saw them rushing away...

I'm still all upset about it. I think I'll skip dinner and go to bed early.

Godalmighty83 · 01-03-06, 03:44 PM

1, the DD's can read your mind, they knew about the torps the instant you fired them.

2, the DD's are fitted with what seem to be some type of warp engine. i swear i saw one that was capable of out accelerating a mclaren f1.

Crash Dive · 01-03-06, 04:53 PM

Yes the DD felt a tremor in the force when you fire at them. It was a secret weapon used by the British in WW2. Cpt . Skywalker claims yet another victim.

Hartmann · 01-03-06, 07:34 PM

The best tactic is use two torpedos, one set to 0 knts and the other to 10 knts or more.

the first wake the monster and the second send it to the bottom

:rotfl: :rotfl:

Ps- In the torpedo practice in the academy , there are a little merchant stopped and only runs when you fire a torpedo.

Is very good situation for practice

bill clarke · 01-03-06, 10:48 PM

You guys are silly, but I like you !!!!!!!!! :rotfl: :rotfl:

Redwine · 01-04-06, 08:06 AM

It is not a joke Lost at Sea..... in the long topic about DDs pinpoint attacks, was stablished that the Speed Factor value into Sim.cfg is a limit for the DDs sensors, over this speed they are deaf.

Then some times one or more of them, reduce speed to completelly stops to listen for you better, and command and direct the others over you.

May be that was your case, may be they was listen for you, and ready to run, and may be they can take a torpdo sound as an alert.

Who knows ? :hmm:

don1reed · 01-04-06, 09:01 AM

hmmm, Matrix DD's...

drEaPer · 01-04-06, 09:44 AM

I know what you talking about. Got me frustrated too, fortunately I save often.
They are not anchored, they are listening.
Combine that with the extreme speed changes possible in SH3 and you have a death trap. Only thing you can do is guess and shoot at a lead angle.

finchOU · 01-04-06, 05:30 PM

yeah...some amount of delay would have to take place before a ship would or could get underway....especially if they are not alerted to your presence and waiting to respone....I'm acually very suprised (I really shouldnt be) that this was not modelled correctly.....they are modelled like robots on crack...not ships manned my Humans with natural reactions.......Humans have to take time to process info and react......even the delay of a hydrophone operator on a DD should be modelled.....hell our sound man cant listen 360 degrees at once.

if the ship is anchored...or seemingingly anchored....should take minutes to move.....a ship just sitting there should not move for at least 45-60 seconds after detection....I cant believe this has not been patched!

Bluewings · 01-04-06, 06:07 PM

I agree with you finchOU ...

Cheers .

01-03-06, 09:06 AM	#1
Lost At Sea Soundman Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 144 Downloads: 100 Uploads: 0	Nasty surprise. Immersion killer First post in 2006 so 'Happy New Year' to all of you out there. Been playing this sim since the very first day. Full realism and latest RUB and for the very first time i faced a real immersion killer. So this will be my first rant on this forum, and hopefull the last. Never bored before with raiding harbours but on this mission i decided to sneak into Scapa and try my luck. Survived the Western approach and eventually found 3 DDs anchored, not great but better than nothing. All were at engines full stop (i supposed), no smoke, 0 speed and no sound. Got nice and close to 2 of them (500 m) and fired my torps. They instantly went full ahead, smoking like hell as if they had been attacking me for an hour. Missed both of them of course. Discusted I surfaced to end it all fast. Is the same happening with capital ships in Scapa?.... I haven't tried the single mission. cheers anyway

01-03-06, 10:15 AM	#2
The Avon Lady Über Mom Join Date: May 2005 Location: Jerusalem, Israel Posts: 6,147 Downloads: 5 Uploads: 0	Did you fire T1s at them during daytime, leaving a distinct bubble trail on the surface for them to easily spot? If so, see what would happen if you'd fire T3s or wait till dark to fire T1s. Other than that, there is an old and known gripe that ships in SH3 can go from zero to their max speed way too fast. Oversight by developers. __________________ "Victory will come to us from the wombs of our women." - Houari Boumedienne, President of Algeria, Speech before the UN, 1974

01-03-06, 10:36 AM	#3
Redwine Sea Lord Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: San Martin de los Andes, Neuquen, , Argentina. Posts: 1,962 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	It is logical if a stopped ship detect a periscope, or a sub proppeller sound or a torp proppeller sound at hydrophones, they quickly start to scape. That sounds unreal...... is if they can do it in very few seconds. Considering a 15m/s torp speed it takes about 33 second to the torp to hit the target at 500m. May be they was not "anchored", may be they was stopped "listen" for you, due to a early warning, some hydrophone detection, or some radar detection of your periscope, then they losse the contact and stops the engines to listen for you, and may be they was not anchored .......... may be posible ? __________________ . "SH III and SH IV Mods" "Manual TDC Tutorial" "SH2 Downloads Selection"

01-03-06, 01:40 PM	#5
wetwarev7 Grey Wolf Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Deep Waters Posts: 871 Downloads: 31 Uploads: 0	I wonder if they can "hear" a torp being fired? how long after you fired it did they wake up? __________________ Guess I should change my sig since SH5 has an offline mode now

01-03-06, 03:44 PM	#7
Godalmighty83 Sonar Guy Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 398 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	1, the DD's can read your mind, they knew about the torps the instant you fired them. 2, the DD's are fitted with what seem to be some type of warp engine. i swear i saw one that was capable of out accelerating a mclaren f1. __________________ Were there monkeys? Some terrifying space monkeys maybe got loose?

01-03-06, 12:20 PM	#4
Lost At Sea Soundman Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 144 Downloads: 100 Uploads: 0	I did fire T1s but it was like 2:00 AM on a cloudy night. The DDs really seemed to be anchored one in front of the other, equal distance of each other and bows pointing in the same direction, as if all placed on a straight line. Oh well, I'm dead anyway. Will just have to remember that next time :hmm: cheers

01-03-06, 02:48 PM	#6
Lost At Sea Soundman Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 144 Downloads: 100 Uploads: 0	Fired my torps, lowered scope and went to hydrophone station to do a sound check and immediately i heard their screws Rushed back to periscope, raised it and saw them rushing away... I'm still all upset about it. I think I'll skip dinner and go to bed early.

01-03-06, 04:53 PM	#8
Crash Dive Electrician's Mate Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: San Diego, Ca. Posts: 136 Downloads: 9 Uploads: 0	Yes the DD felt a tremor in the force when you fire at them. It was a secret weapon used by the British in WW2. Cpt . Skywalker claims yet another victim. __________________ \"The sixth electric fish went to her midships to break the ship\'s back and set her afire.\" O\'Kane

01-03-06, 07:34 PM	#9
Hartmann Sea Lord Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Grid CH 26, Spain ,Barcelona Posts: 1,857 Downloads: 204 Uploads: 0	The best tactic is use two torpedos, one set to 0 knts and the other to 10 knts or more. the first wake the monster and the second send it to the bottom :rotfl: :rotfl: Ps- In the torpedo practice in the academy , there are a little merchant stopped and only runs when you fire a torpedo. Is very good situation for practice __________________ But this ship can't sink!... She is made of iron, sir. I assure you, she can. and she will. It is a mathematical certainty. Strength and honor

01-03-06, 10:48 PM	#10
bill clarke Captain Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Wagga Wagga, NSW Australia Posts: 519 Downloads: 40 Uploads: 0	You guys are silly, but I like you !!!!!!!!! :rotfl: :rotfl:

01-04-06, 08:06 AM	#11
Redwine Sea Lord Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: San Martin de los Andes, Neuquen, , Argentina. Posts: 1,962 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	It is not a joke Lost at Sea..... in the long topic about DDs pinpoint attacks, was stablished that the Speed Factor value into Sim.cfg is a limit for the DDs sensors, over this speed they are deaf. Then some times one or more of them, reduce speed to completelly stops to listen for you better, and command and direct the others over you. May be that was your case, may be they was listen for you, and ready to run, and may be they can take a torpdo sound as an alert. Who knows ? :hmm: __________________ . "SH III and SH IV Mods" "Manual TDC Tutorial" "SH2 Downloads Selection"

01-04-06, 09:01 AM	#12
don1reed Ace of the Deep Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Valhalla: Silent Generation Posts: 1,149 Downloads: 910 Uploads: 0	hmmm, Matrix DD's... __________________ [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act. ~ George Orwell

01-04-06, 09:44 AM	#13
drEaPer Navy Dude Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Germany Posts: 176 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	I know what you talking about. Got me frustrated too, fortunately I save often. They are not anchored, they are listening. Combine that with the extreme speed changes possible in SH3 and you have a death trap. Only thing you can do is guess and shoot at a lead angle.

01-04-06, 05:30 PM	#14
finchOU Samurai Navy Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 571 Downloads: 77 Uploads: 0	yeah...some amount of delay would have to take place before a ship would or could get underway....especially if they are not alerted to your presence and waiting to respone....I'm acually very suprised (I really shouldnt be) that this was not modelled correctly.....they are modelled like robots on crack...not ships manned my Humans with natural reactions.......Humans have to take time to process info and react......even the delay of a hydrophone operator on a DD should be modelled.....hell our sound man cant listen 360 degrees at once. if the ship is anchored...or seemingingly anchored....should take minutes to move.....a ship just sitting there should not move for at least 45-60 seconds after detection....I cant believe this has not been patched!

01-04-06, 06:07 PM	#15
Bluewings Torpedoman Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: UK Posts: 115 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	I agree with you finchOU ... Cheers . __________________ I say what I mean and I do what I say