MOst REALISTIC MP settings. Your oppinion pls

[Furia]

Lasts MP games we could see how different oppinion we do have about wich are the appropiate MP settings for a match.
This also made us waste like 15 minutes asking the Host to change this and this.
So this make me to propose here what based on my experience should be the most balanced and realistic settings for this matches.
Basically this is oriented for a match where players are manning one platform per player, that is single station.

Before going into details let me tell you I am a hardcore player, I hate arcade and I love realism to the max.
I have been playing Naval sism since the first Spectrum Silent hunter back in the 80's
I always aim for maximum realism like in Silent Hunter where I always use Manual TDC or 688i Hunter Killer where all was no Auto Crew or Sub Command.
Said this, on my experience I have come to realize that playing DW without NO Autocrew in MP matches, not only does not bring realism but it complicates the game in a way it brings no benefit.
Actual DW Auto crew alone would never give you enough information and in proper time to kill a humam opponent. Maybe with some dumb AI you can but surely against skilled humman you cannot, if you have to wait your Autocrew give you enough data on him you will be dead by then and this is a fact.
I believe Autocrew helps in some cases to keep information and processing flowing while you are cheking other stations.
I basically just play the FFG and on this complex platform this is basically a need. SO while I am manually on the TA defining contacts, I need the EW auto crew to warn me if there is a new threat painting me with a FC radar.
Or if I am shooting a SM-2 against an Air targte, I need the Sonar crew to keep track of the new accoustic data and to tell me if I have a hot buoy os such channel.
This is what happens on a real Ship. The Captain is coordinating all the effort but not micromanaging all stations at the same time.
I manually manage each and every station when I need to refine information, release a weapon or gather extra data but while I am on the acustic station filtereing frecuencies and so, I want my AutoTMA keep ploting of the contacts and my EW crew warn me if a warship just illuminated me.
On my oppinion having the Autocrew in some stations is not a cheat or is going to help me to gather better data on the enemy since actual Autocrew is by far low on perfomance than any average level player, but to keep me warned about new information that appear while I am in other station.
This is particulary important on the FFG where you have more stations than other platforms and where you have to be aware not only of submarine contacts but air contats, surface contacts and EW information and so. Where the Accoustic information could come from 3 different stations and so.
Subs are a bit different on this because while submerged and al slow speed, the Captain basically focus on the Sonar station Having basically all information he needs on this single station.
I know some will surely disagree with me because they usually only drive subs or because they believe that "hardcore" is using the "advanced" player settings that means no Auto Crew. I respect this but this is my oppinion as a hardcore player and a dedicated FFG driver.
Resuming it Autocrew on my oppinion is need in some stations not for doing your work but to keep track of things while you are away on other station. Autocrew does not provide enough accurate and in time data to fight succesfully a capable human opponent but helps to keep track of things while you are in other stations.
For this I propose to use this settings for MP games where one player mans one platform. For multistation games where severl players man one platform I propose NO AUTCREW in any way since players have the time to focus on their station.
This are my proposed settings.




I have thought about this very carefully before posting this here so please thought about it just one minute before it is wrong because it is not "advanced mode"
Anyway I will surely welcome any oppinions. As I said I basically drive FFG lalthough I have extensive experience on subs in 688i, DW and other sims but for this MP experience on DW I prefer basically to speak for the FFG.

[JamesT73J]

You know, I was just thinking as I read the title "What's good for sub players isn't good for the FFG."

I have the same perspective, I played SC with no autocrew (and play the DW subsea platforms the same way) but the Perry is a different animal. It has far more systems that need monitoring, and as such I think auto settings should completey be at the discretion of the player.

Most people like to play as real as they can, so I don't think it hurts anybody; I certainly would not like to see anything enforced.

[goldorak]

To be honest, the only station that should be on autocrew is tma, on the frigate and on the sub.
Any other autocrew just lowers the realism.
The frigate is made to be played in multistation, I just wonder why so many people are reticent to play multistation on sub/frigate ?
Its more fun and no need to keep any autocrew on.

[Furia]

I would not mind to play the FFG in Multistation provided that:
1. We can gather enough players willing to play FFG Multistation for that MP match (You will be surprised there are not many)
2.Players speak same language and are connected with Voice (Ts, Ventrilo, RW..)
3rd. Players have adequate level of knowledge on the FFG stations and Operations
4rth It is decided that one on the players will be the "captain" and he will take the final decissions instead having arguments about what everybody oppinion of tactics.
For this reason I prefer to play Multistation only on Virtual Fleets where you have all this requirements fullfilled.
Otherwise I play the FFG alone
it is no realistic that while I am working on a TA solution there are showing 26 Bombers on my radar making 600 knots towards me and I get no clue of it because I am just on the TA station. That is not realism,

[DivingWind]

Just a thought.You rarely use FFG TMA for tracking ships because surface radar automaticaly tracks them.And for subs you can't track a sub with FFG,it tracks you .Obviously there is no time for that,you use active ping to find him fast and attack him even faster! So FFG TMA can be ider on AC or manual control.

[Fandango]

Originally Posted by goldorak

To be honest, the only station that should be on autocrew is tma, on the frigate and on the sub.
Any other autocrew just lowers the realism.
The frigate is made to be played in multistation, I just wonder why so many people are reticent to play multistation on sub/frigate ?
Its more fun and no need to keep any autocrew on.

I agree with Goldorak here. Multistation is the way to go...both FGG AND sub. But I would give the player the chance to choose himself the TMA autocrew setting. I've recently played a multistation with Mahuja on a Seawolf with me manning the TMA (manually) and the weapon station...

[Furia]

Originally Posted by DivingWind

Just a thought.You rarely use FFG TMA for tracking ships because surface radar automaticaly tracks them.And for subs you can't track a sub with FFG,it tracks you .Obviously there is no time for that,you use active ping to find him fast and attack him even faster! So FFG TMA can be ider on AC or manual control.

Well on the FFG if you want to survive, it is not always that healthy to have your Radar emiting all the way. It is an option but for instance on my case I do not use it quite often, specially if there are subs with SSM missiles around.
Same goes for the active sonar. unless the sub is within the 7 NM range of your Mk-50 torp, it is not healthy to go active

And about tracking things with the TMA, if a sub is fast (ie evading torpedoes or moving to a specific possition) you can track it, same goes for surface units or data gatheres from your helo sonobuoys launched far away from your ship.
The FFG offers just many options and you just do not drived it like a surfaced submarine.

[DivingWind]

Ofcourse you use towed array or radar to track ships when situation requiers.But in online games mostly there is like dogfight battles.

[OneShot]

Personally since I hardly drive anything besides the P-3 and the Helo, I would vote for the following settings for those two stations :
P-3 :

• AC Countermesaures - ON
• AC Radar - ON

Helo :

• AC Countermeasures - ON
• AC Radar - ON

Every other AC OFF.

Reason for this, the AC suck at the most important stations on the Airborne plattforms, means the Accoustics and the TACCO/ATO station. Those need to be handled by a player with judgement because the AI mindlessly marks all contacts on the buoys even if they are of no interest and its settings as far as TACCO/ATO go, well - they can be improved. But by all means, thats my way of playing, and I certainly dont want to force that on anyone. On the flipside, those ACs I listed are those I consider important. When I actually use the Radar, I dont want to spend my time marking contacts on the screen, the AI is more capable there. And as far as CM AC goes, well - the AI does a fairly good job there too, and I have other things on my mind in that situation. Since there is no TMA on either plattform thats not on my list, but my opinion on the aTMA is, that if somebody wants it, let him use it - whenever I drive a boat its one thing I dont want to mess with.

On the other settings I vote for Aircraft Quicklaunch enabled. If the FFG starts with the Helo still onboard it might take ages before its off use.

And as far as Deadplattforms go, well as long as their is the Status screen readily available there is no point in disabling them. The only thing I don't get then is a nice picture of the plattform I just killed, but I still get the info. And dont give me the stuff about finding out what happend yourself. In real life you can actually decide from your Accoustics input or lots of other sensors if you killed the target to a certain degree. You don't have that capability in the game. For example you can very well distinguish between an Active decoy and a moving sub in real life in the game thats a lot harder if not to say impossible, depending on which sensors you have nearby. So either put in all the capabilities you have in real life, then I can live without the Status Screen/Dead plattform showing or do me a favour and leave that option on.

[LuftWolf]

Furia, don't forget that in the LWAMI Mod you have the option of the MK54 to which replaces the Mk46 (same text in the loadout screen however, couldn't change that) which will give you 17km@50kts.

Auto TMA for the subs is not playing Dangerous Waters, its playing Crimson Waters.

I won't play a game with auto TMA for submarines. It essentially takes 2/3 of the tactics used in submarine warfare completely out of the picture. The simulator become a game of mark sonar, wait 5 minutes, set WEPs, and fire. It sucks.

But for learning the simulator and practicing tactics aTMA is very useful and I highly recommend it for beginners where the extra burden of TMA will often break their back. But for MP dives, no no no no no way.

That having been said, aTMA for the FFG is fine by me, the autonomous torpedo decoys known as OHP FFG's need all the help they can get.

[XabbaRus]

Actually I disagree that autoTMA takes the tactics out of it, when the autoTMA is like in SC.

Alas DW autoTMA is the super TMA guy so in that respect yes.

I think in contact high waters autoTMA is useful.

I think it is one of those options where it should be up to the player to use or not.

IN MP I try to use manual TMA for the challenge,,,single player I use auto esp as I like to leave the machine.

Auto TMA in FFG I think is a must regardless.

Ultimately I say most should be up to player choice except, "show truth" disabled, and weapon quick launch.

[Furia]

Originally Posted by LuftWolf

the autonomous torpedo decoys known as OHP FFG's

Hey that is fun :rotfl:

Nice info about the Mk-54, didn't knew that

[Neptunus Rex]

I've never played MP before, (but I'm sure that change in the future.)

Though I can understand the gamer purest in wanting to do it all themselves (obstensively to win), in the real world it's quit different.

For one, the CO does not direct the Fire Control/Tracking Party (at least on submarines. I don't know how skimmer pukes work. ), the XO runs that so the CO can concentrate on two things: tactical picture, and fighting the ship!

Though I'm sure there are those of you who enjoy running all the stations yourselves, but why? :hmm:

Auto crew will provide enough info for you, as CO, to obtain a good enough picture to determine a course of action. And if neccessary, step in for more detailed info, such as classifying a contact in sonor.

This is princibly the main reason I never went head to head with anyone on Sub Command on the head to head sites. (No autocrew allowed) You can get too wrapped up with one of the other stations and miss something on another one that could be VERY important.

If your interest is being the purest, by all means, have at it. But don't force those of us who don't feel the need to "be everywhere" to do so just to play MP.

I say no restrictions other that "No Show Truth". Let the players choose their own style of play.

I have not played DW yet, (I have found the wife's hiding spot. ) but it would be nice if the game engine supported multiple windows. (Jamie, are you listening? )That way you could keep the tactical display up when you're in Sonar or ESM.

My 2 cents.

[LuftWolf]

Though I'm sure there are those of you who enjoy running all the stations yourselves, but why?

The reasons are simple why I have my preferences for autocrew:

Active Intercept and Radar autocrews On because the stations simply involve marking contacts and the Active Intercept is a station one would have to be at constantly.

Sonar and WEPS off because I can do a much better job than the autocrew.

And auto TMA off because it is "show truth" with a five minute delay and small percentage error.

[LuftWolf]

In terms of the multiscreen support, you can do that if you have more than one computer by linking them over a LAN or the internet and running in multiplayer multistation mode.