Do somebody note this on AAA ? ..........

[Redwine]

I am tweaking my AAA....

I note when my 37mm AAA Flak is operated by AI, the shells explodes near to the incomming plane.

But when i operated it manually, the flaks explodes always at maximun range.

I remember in SH2, was posible to increse the bullet diameter so it explodes when pass near the target, as it has a proximity fuse.

Some body know if it is posible here ?

I am making many chnages, i note the AAA has a big induced error of 15 degrees in traverse and in elevation.

It is exagerated, i reduce them to few degrees 3 and 2.

Plus i add a little bit more power to 20mm shells, but there is a problem, this sim is not as SH2, it modellated 20mm shells for all ships in same file, then if i increse the power for my 20mm AAA, the power of the 20mm Torpedo boats is increased too......

Then the Torpedo boats become so dangerous, and can produce lot damage on you, flooding and internal damages.

How many damage is souposed a 20mm shells can cause to a sub hull ?

Thanks in advance, any suggestion or info is welcome.

[Gammel]

How many damage is souposed a 20mm shells can cause to a sub hull ?

a very common rule is, as far as i know:
20 mm bullet =>penetrates=> 10 mm of steel

but their´re many variables




Redwine, did you found out how to make the AA guns less accurate?
i tried to add a highter error factor for traverstal and elevation, but had not much of success.

For me the AA guns are still too accurate.
If you increase the power of the shells even more, planes would fall out of the sky´s even easier.
I agree the bullets are too weak, but the guns are much too accurate.


i´ve reduces the firing rate of all 20 mm´s, so my shielded twin has now a recoil time of 0.25 => 240 rpm =>120 rpm/barrel[/quote]

[Redwine]

Well at first lot of thanks for interest and help.

Originally Posted by Gammel

a very common rule is, as far as i know:
20 mm bullet =>penetrates=> 10 mm of steel

but their´re many variables

That means a double hull of 1 inch can not be penetrated by 20mm bullets ? :hmm:

Even with no bullet power increase, the torpedo boats cause damage.



About the accuracy.....

I note the an improvement when reduce traverse and elevation error from 15 degress to 0,5 in 37mm Flak cannon in Type IXB.

I made the same on 20mm AAA, reducing error from 15 degrees to 3 in all 20mm, and at 2 in Quadra 20mm and Type XXI twins 20mm.

Plus i increase the power on the shells, 20mm and 37mm, and..... even with all this improvement they are not able to shot dowm an incoming B-24, my crew is able to shot down it in the outgoing pass few times, and most of times in the outgoing pass after the second plane run.

Any way i am making test now, not finished and definitive, but i think so, 8 guns 20mm, or 6 guns 20mm plus a 37mm flak and the planes survaive two attacks a t very low altitude is good for me.

The matter is, i am making this for when i use the AAA in manual mode, i note i wasnt able to stop a modern plane when they are incomming, my crew was , but i am not, i can only stops a Swordfish attack, then i want a little bit more fun for me in manual mode, may be it increase the AI crew capability a little bit, but i am ready to acept.

Of course small planes a more vulnerable on this kind of AAA power, but samll plnes perform attacks on early times when many subs has only a pair of single 20mm.

Of course if a poor Sworfish biplane attempt to attack a later times sub with a lot of AAA, it is suicide, but if a Spitfire or Hurricane attack a Type VII B or Type II it has lot of probabilities.

I note the succesful of subs against the planes is due to bad AI, the B-24 attack the sub, very well and very dangerous, and after the attack, when empty of bombs or depth charges, they perform many more passes over the sub attackin it with its .50 machineguns, then is when they are shot down.

As menioned before, i note an improvement in the dispersion of the 37mm Flak when reduce the error from 15 degrees down to 0,5.

You can see the expkosions so near the planes, but any way it is so hard for my AI crew to shot down in example an incoming B-24.

In the inverse way, sure increasing the error you will increase the dispersion of the flaks and bullets.

Almost i think so ...... :hmm:

Share anything you discover please......

[Gammel]

what i found out so far is values above 15 for traverstal and elevation tolerance makes no difference for the gun accuracy.
i even tried crazy values like 500, but the guns are still pretty accurate.

i´d like to give your modified files a try, maybe you´d like to upload your mod somewhere when it´s done.

Good luck with modding and many greetings!

[Redwine]

Of course.....

http://rapidshare.de/files/11189458/..._beta.zip.html

Step 1 remember you to make a back-up.

Step 2 give you some new textures, with more alive colours, in cannon muzzle effects, tracer bullets. any kind of explosion effects and flashes and glares.
Only change textures and not game files.

Step 3 gives you new well visible deck gun tarcer shells.

Step 4 gives you more poweful AAA 20mm bullets and 37mm flak, and more precise 20mm machineguns, Type IXB 37mm flak, and AI 88mm and 105mm deck gun with reduced error.

Step 5 gives you more powerful deck gun shels for 88mm and 105mm.

Not finished, may may have errors.

[Hartmann]

Yes i noticied too that the flack gun the shell only explodes whith time delaying when is fired by the AI crew.

I love the 37 mm AA flak gun

in my IX-B at some distance looks like a second deck gun but smaller. :|\

could be interesting a more powerfull 37 mm shell :hmm:
in my last patrol it was very useful to scape surfaced against a british fast boat.
(I was nailed down by 9 scorts in gibraltar with foggy weather)

they oppened fire against me, no hull damage, only minor leakings and damage, and one of my crew wounded

The 20 mm shells i think that only can damage minor systems in a submarine, or break the outher hull and damage a internal conduction or pipe.

[CWorth]

Originally Posted by Cdre Gibs

Finally some1 else has found the DEACCURACY Tweak I have been useing on ALL Guns

This is the 1 that I have been using for ages to DEACCURTISE the DG with. Ok to explain it better.

The Traverse and Elavaion Tolarance is used to gyro stabilise the Gun. This is done by giving the gun a SET Degree of MOVEMENT that you determine BEFORE the movement of the subs hull is imposed on the Gun. So therefor IF you have given the tolarance to the guns of say 10° this means that the gun has 10° of inderpendent movement BEFORE the subs movement effects the gun. Hence to DEACCURTISE the gun you REDUCE the movement. On the DG I have been using 0.75° for both Elevation and Traverse, for all other Flack Guns I have been using 0.5°. Now what happens is that the DG can only track the target for 0.75° of inderpendent movment before the subs heaving is imposed on the gun, BUT this is the good part, this will SLOW down the Fire rate as the AI will NOT fire the Gun untill its ON target. It also means that they have more accurate MISS shots to btw what I mean by that is that you will get over an unders as before but now closer to the taget. With this imposed I have redone all weps and shells to reflect true values on Range, Damage and refire rates. This is the reason I always said that Beery was wrong, You CAN fix the DG!

Now go at it an enjoy

PS: Ohh btw this will also effect the player when he uses the gun's, but for best results let the AI man the guns an shoot only, after all Captains didn't go running around a sub maning every thing them selves. You have a crew, let them do their job and you do yours.

What should I tweak to get this same effect that you describe?

Do I tweak the Gun_Sub.sim file?

[Redwine]

@ Hartmann :

Yes i love the 37mm Flak too, good to hunt small boats.
The flak shells explodes at correct range only when they are shooted by AI crew, when i shoot them, they explodes at max range only.

@ Cdre Gibs :

Good !

Now i can understand why when i set those values at zero they dont shoot at all.

Well, i souposed it was an induced error, but they are the limits for gyro gimballs.

The curious is when i reduce this gyro gimballs limit for 37mm Flak it seems to be more precise.
Flaks explodes much more near the plane.

[Redwine]

Originally Posted by Cdre Gibs

Yes it will, but it dont hit the plane untill its now a lot closer, does it !

Same happens here, i can shot down some one, but only when it is too latter

Originally Posted by Cdre Gibs

The Airburst is only eye candy btw, it dont do didly to the plane. You watch say the 5" DP Guns shoot at AC, the airbust is even bigger but unless its a direct hit, the plane is fine (in other word's the airburst has no splinters)

Not for eyecandy only......

It can be tweaked, radius and effort can be tweaked for flaks shells so the explosion blast can reach the plane from some meters far.

I tested it and works fine.

[Redwine]

Originally Posted by Cdre Gibs

Well dont get to carried away, 37mm Flack airburst dont have a high amount of splinters and therefor the damage effect should be rather small even though the effected area is around 20-30m³. Given the size of the area you see with the small amount of splintering, very little damage should be done at the outer edge working back into an almost kill near the epicentre (for all small AC).

PS: I also have enabled my 37mm and 20mm Flak to both shoot AP and AA ammo

I think so..... min effort is corresponding to max radius, and max effort to min radius, you can adjust all 4 values.

Up to min radius you will have the max damage, it will be reduced up to min damage at max radius.

Any way it is so good only when the 37mm Flak is used by AI crew, when you use it, the flak shells do not have delay setting and always explodes at maximun ammo range about 6500m.
So bad.
Will be great to have an auto delay/range adjust.

As i mentioned many times, do not attempt to set historical values, instead attempt tp obtain a good behaviour.

[Redwine]

Originally Posted by Cdre Gibs

Well I have given all weps an ammo their correct characteristics and I'm luven it

* Ranges, velocity, refire rates, ect ect.

Upload the file please !!

[Redwine]

Originally Posted by Cdre Gibs

I'd luv to, but at the moment I'm ironing out the bugs for the 16" Iowa Class Guns !!! So mine is sorta non compatable.

What is that bug ?