Geesh...Religion..

[Armistead]

As you know my mother-in-law passed. Her grandfather started the Jehovah Witness movement/church here, so obvious she was indoctrinated with that from birth and stuck to it, although I would call her witness lite. My wife has two sisters, both hated growing up that way, as did my wife really, but my wife got involved in the methodist church in her teens...So a father that really doesn't care about religion, simply, says he can't understand it, one sister a fundy baptist, one an atheist, my wife just would say a person of faith.

Anyway, the mother of course on her death had planned a JW funeral at the Kingdom Hall. My wifes two sisters decided to go against that, because they would turn her funeral into a JW salvation meeting. The father simply wants to honor the wife's wishes. It was finally decided the service would be held at the funeral home chapel with the JW pastor speaking, along with other family members. One nephew married a female Methodist minister, she was going to do a few prayers and speak for the family. They also did a video using some nice loving secular music. Well the JW elders showed up at the house to discuss the service, first they demanded that all music had to be JW music. Then they found out about the female minister and said they couldn't allow that or simply would not be involved if she spoke. If the family used another male pastor, they would have to approve his speech.
This sent the atheist daughter into a fit.....

Anyway, they tried to come to a truce, find a way to have a service with the JW leading it. This is what the mother wanted, the father wanted to fulfill her wishes, my wife trying to calm things with her two sisters. The female minister agreed to speak only as a family member, no prayers, etc...The atheist daughter made the video and said she was playing it with her secular music, the JW elders not giving at all. I had no say, but IMO, give her the funeral she asked for in her faith, everybody accept it and be happy and that's that.

Well, it ended, the JW saying all their way or no way, so the father finally told them to go and he would let his family do it.....The sad thing, is in his heart he feels he let her down.

The other night, such a wonderful death, now a funeral all stressed out over religion.....

[Skybird]

From your telling your father did the only right thing to do, me thinks. Funerals are for the living, not for the dead. When the living start politics about funerals, they show they are about power, and nothing else. Show them the door then, else they rape anyone else who maybe already struggles anyway with trying to find his personal way to accept the loss and cope with the sadness.

Even an anti-religious guy like me would not go to other people's funerals and tell them what to do and what not.

[Armistead]

Well, tough call for me, if a person has a certain faith and ask to have a funeral in that faith, you deal with it and move on. I've basically agnostic, but I've been to funerals of many faiths, most goes in and out my ear....

Anyway, I'm glad the father gave and let the sisters do it.....The JW's were just too demanding to leave the family out of the service.

[u crank]

Originally Posted by Armistead

The other night, such a wonderful death, now a funeral all stressed out over religion.....

That's really a shame. I don't mean to offend any one but I think a dead person's wishes should be carried out regardless of how we, the mourners feel. It's the least we can do to honor them. In this case the politics of religion get in the way of that. I can't stand those types. As I said, it's a shame.

Hope you are doing okay Armistead.

[Wolferz]

Sounds like some folks down your way need to put a little love in their hearts. God doesn't quibble about such things nor should those who profess to be his servants.

Again, condolences on the loss.

[Oberon]

JW's can be a particular group at times, some nice people in the group, but as a collective, well I guess that's the politics of the organisation of the group coming through. Rest assured though, that your Mother is out of all the earthly worries and politics, and she'll know what took place and why things happened as they did. As Skybird put it, funerals are for the living, not the dead.
My Grandfather was a spiritually curious person, he met with various groups, even scientologists but at the end of the day he was more of an agnostic than a devout believer in any one religion. His funeral had the whole preacher spiel, going on about this and that, I don't know precisely why it was a religious funeral, it was organised by my father and uncle, so I defer to them, but all through the ceremony, I could just see him leaning on the coffin, glasses perched on his forehead, pint glass mug of beer in one hand just shaking his head and chuckling at all the flowery descriptions that the vicar was giving, and that made me smile....and that, I think, is how he would have wanted it to be.

Sorry, if I rambled on a bit there, at the end of the day though, I would like to believe that when we die we gain an understanding of people that we could never have in this life, and we hold no grudges or misunderstandings against those we leave behind, even if they can't do the things we wanted them to do for what we left behind, which is at the end of the day, an empty shell. That's what I like to believe anyway, makes it a little easier to get by.

[mapuc]

condolences on the loss, my friend

I'm an artiest, nevertheless I would without no doubt fulfill the person I love last will on how he or she want his or her funeral.

If the person I love want, let say, a Celtic druid funeral, I will do everything I can to make it so.

I'm very well known to JW. Have relatives and friends that are deeply involved in their church, I almost know how they think.

Markus

[u crank]

Originally Posted by Oberon

...at the end of the day though, I would like to believe that when we die we gain an understanding of people that we could never have in this life, and we hold no grudges or misunderstandings against those we leave behind, even if they can't do the things we wanted them to do for what we left behind, which is at the end of the day, an empty shell. That's what I like to believe anyway, makes it a little easier to get by.

Very well said, Sir.

[Father Goose]

Originally Posted by u crank

That's really a shame. I don't mean to offend any one but I think a dead person's wishes should be carried out regardless of how we, the mourners feel. It's the least we can do to honor them.

I agree.
Fortunately Armistead you have a background in the Civil War...as you were on the brink of one. Although I would not agree with the father's decision in and of itself, it was the best decision for the family...and that his wife would have been pleased.

[nikimcbee]

Let's us the wisdom of Solomon. I think you should go on vacation that weekend and totally steer clear of the family minefield.

If you're totally trapped in it, I wouldn't let the JW push you around, but that is just me.

I re-read your original post, and I wish you the best of luck. Sorry about your loss. Too many faiths involved for me.

[CaptainHaplo]

Having presided over a few of these and thus having had to deal with the "politics" of differing family desires, let me offer a suggestion if possible..

It is something very common around here. 2 services. One at either the church or funeral home chapel, the other graveside. If everyone is ok with 2 services - then the JW's can have one and the family can have one. The deceased's wishes are honored, and the family has a service that they can celebrate the life and memory of the deceased as well.

One other option is multiple services "indoors" as well.

[Buddahaid]

I dearly hope this turns out well and I'm sorry for your loss. That's all I'll say as the rest would be unprintable.

[Sailor Steve]

It sounds to me like everybody is being selfish and demanding and everybody is wrong. I think Haplo has come up with the best compromise.

[Aktungbby]

Originally Posted by CaptainHaplo

Having presided over a few of these and thus having had to deal with the "politics" of differing family desires, let me offer a suggestion if possible..

It is something very common around here. 2 services. One at either the church or funeral home chapel, the other graveside. If everyone is ok with 2 services - then the JW's can have one and the family can have one. The deceased's wishes are honored, and the family has a service that they can celebrate the life and memory of the deceased as wellOne other option is multiple services "indoors" as well.

Ditto that: with Jewish, Catholic, Methodist, and one aunt that just donated her corpus non delecti to science, in my family; and 93 year old mom about to pass over, go with the formal expressed wishes of the deceased first(JW) and a multi-deistic graveside service for the family(well catered of of course!) We do fabu Irish wakes and I'm tempted to throw one for myself so I can enjoy my own party. As with Skybird: funerals are for the living; so do both and cover all bases! As with my PM: blessings and condolences.

[Buddahaid]

A most rational approach from cooler heads than mine.

It's so high ya can't get over it, but it's not so wide ya can't get around it.