Birth of a boat

Betonov · 07-25-11, 07:05 AM

For your education, a short thread about the modeling phase of boat design and construction.

In 4 years being in the industry, I have never made one component of a finished product nor have I ever even tightened a screw in a finished boat. I am a modeler. I build models and molds, from which the final product is made. I am more in research and development than actual construction. I will tell the story of the boat as it comes from the computer to reality. The finnal assembly is boring, like telling how 20 kids puting together very expensive LEGO pieces.

FIRST it begins with sketches, computer tests, 3D models and finally into CAD/CAM programs. It's all computer and programming mumbo jumbo so don't ask me much about it.

SECOND A mock up model is built. The mock up is used to show any design weaknes's, like to narrow corridors, too steep stairs or even if the sundeck might be uncomfortable. It's also a showcase for investor to see a rough design of the product. When everything is OK the programers start programing the CAM/CADs.

THIRD the base. A base in a support for the modeling paste. We have an asortement of steel understructures prepared. On it we construct a wooden support and on that wooden support we glue the styrophoam or EPS, cut to shapes that will allow for easy milling. It's a messy operation.

(this was the model for the actual boat, used by the UK team in the 2008 olympics in Beijing, The white stuff is the EPS)

EPS block prepared to be cut. The lines are drawn via a printed plan we receive. Cutting is done by hand with a hot wire (sorry, no picture)

Here we see a model of a hull being built. Like building LEGO's

FOURTH the first milling. The rough model is then sent into the milling machine. A five axel CNC milling machine thats slowly mills away the EPS to the shape, the final product will have.

the prevous hull still being milled

to be continued...

Betonov · 07-25-11, 07:22 AM

FIFTH the modeling paste. The milled rough model is then coated with resin and the long and grueling process of aplying the modeling paste. The paste is a chemical miracle, two components after being mixed by a machine and aplied by hand via a laying nozzle.

the machine: http://www.dekumed.de/indexeng.html

A deck model being laid. At the beggining of the shift and after 12 hours

the model paste applied

SIXTH again to the CNC. The modeling paste is then milled just like the EPS before. Only with a lot more love and accuracy.

The hull being milled

SEVENTH putty and sand paper. The most boring aspect of design begins. One needs to locate holes, dents or imperfections of the model and fill them with putty and then sand it down to perfection. A milimeter big dent takes 10 takes to make a perfect surface. Some final adjustments can be made at this stage.

EIGHTH making of the glass. After the model is perfect, it is sprayed with a special kind of surface putty. That putty is then sanded with increasingly fine sandpaper until it is as smooth as glass. Any imperfections here and it will show in the final product. A mistake here will mean a disaster.

This is it for the modeling phase of design. Next the mold is made with fiberglass reinforced palstic and that mold is used to create final components. I have made hull models of 50m long yachts to just half a meter models of hatches. It's a diverse job

Jimbuna · 07-25-11, 07:25 AM

That's quite interesting actually

Garion · 07-25-11, 08:23 AM

Thats really cool.

I build model boats among other things and it's always fasinating to see how the BIG STUFF is designed and constructed

Cheers

Garion

Herr-Berbunch · 07-25-11, 08:43 AM

This is really interesting, so many questions!

Like: How many designs are thought of, and how many actually make it beyond your involvement and become floating reality?

How many differing models (from hatches to hulls) do you make during a set period (one month, or one year...)?

Have the guys you work with seen your face?

Betonov · 07-25-11, 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Herr-Berbunch

Like: How many designs are thought of, and how many actually make it beyond your involvement and become floating reality?

Any design that gets past the initial theroetical phase goes trough the model shop to the prototype

Here's a list of all the boats that the company designed (or help design) and anything from 2008 onwards I was involved

http://www.seaway.si/clients.php

PLUS: since 5 axle CNC machines as big as ours are extremly expensive to buy and operate, many worldwide companies hire us. We also did a lot of non-nautical projects. A system that works quite well. I did anything from front mask of buses to wind powerplant blades. And the biggest project I've ever worked on: models for turbine blades for the Three Gorges power plant China (yes, THE three gorges)

Growler · 07-25-11, 10:55 AM

This is a cool post, Betonov - I always wanted to see this method of boat-building. One question, though. Why is that guy standing on the EPS block picture making rude gestures?

Betonov · 07-25-11, 11:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Growler

This is a cool post, Betonov - I always wanted to see this method of boat-building. One question, though. Why is that guy standing on the EPS block picture making rude gestures?

He's Bosnian

they like to joke around in their own way

Sailor Steve · 07-25-11, 02:54 PM

Awesome job to have!

Betonov · 07-25-11, 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

Awesome job to have!

You sure you want to say that again ??

Here's me cleaning the barrels after they've been emptied (they contained the modeling paste)

Sailor Steve · 07-25-11, 03:00 PM

No job is ever all light and roses. I've had to do things like that in regular jobs, but I never got to design a boat.

Betonov · 07-25-11, 03:14 PM

Like I said in another thread, it comes with a certain prestige. Have you ever tried to pick up women with the line: I build luxury yachts

It almost worked, but the problem was they turned around and saw my face

Jimbuna · 07-25-11, 03:19 PM

papa_smurf · 07-25-11, 03:20 PM

Sounds a fun job. My grandfather was a draughtsman at Harland&Wolff, and that was back in the day using pencil and paper.

Penguin · 07-25-11, 03:20 PM

Indeed, very interesting, thanks for posting!

I've also got some questions:

- Why do you build your models from Elektroprivreda Srbije?

- What is the modeling paste made of? - if that's no company secret

- In the CAD pic, what does CP mean? Is this the drag of the boot in the water? I'm a little confused, as I know Cw for the drag, which doesn't go under 0.

07-25-11, 07:05 AM	#1
Betonov Navy Seal Join Date: May 2009 Location: Slovenia Posts: 8,647 Downloads: 26 Uploads: 0	Birth of a boat For your education, a short thread about the modeling phase of boat design and construction. In 4 years being in the industry, I have never made one component of a finished product nor have I ever even tightened a screw in a finished boat. I am a modeler. I build models and molds, from which the final product is made. I am more in research and development than actual construction. I will tell the story of the boat as it comes from the computer to reality. The finnal assembly is boring, like telling how 20 kids puting together very expensive LEGO pieces. FIRST it begins with sketches, computer tests, 3D models and finally into CAD/CAM programs. It's all computer and programming mumbo jumbo so don't ask me much about it. SECOND A mock up model is built. The mock up is used to show any design weaknes's, like to narrow corridors, too steep stairs or even if the sundeck might be uncomfortable. It's also a showcase for investor to see a rough design of the product. When everything is OK the programers start programing the CAM/CADs. THIRD the base. A base in a support for the modeling paste. We have an asortement of steel understructures prepared. On it we construct a wooden support and on that wooden support we glue the styrophoam or EPS, cut to shapes that will allow for easy milling. It's a messy operation. (this was the model for the actual boat, used by the UK team in the 2008 olympics in Beijing, The white stuff is the EPS) EPS block prepared to be cut. The lines are drawn via a printed plan we receive. Cutting is done by hand with a hot wire (sorry, no picture) Here we see a model of a hull being built. Like building LEGO's FOURTH the first milling. The rough model is then sent into the milling machine. A five axel CNC milling machine thats slowly mills away the EPS to the shape, the final product will have. the prevous hull still being milled to be continued...

07-25-11, 07:25 AM	#3
Jimbuna Chief of the Boat Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: 250 metres below the surface Posts: 190,473 Downloads: 63 Uploads: 13	That's quite interesting actually __________________ Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because they have to say something. Oh my God, not again!!

07-25-11, 08:43 AM	#5
Herr-Berbunch Kaiser Bill's batman Join Date: May 2010 Location: AN72 Posts: 13,203 Downloads: 76 Uploads: 0	This is really interesting, so many questions! Like: How many designs are thought of, and how many actually make it beyond your involvement and become floating reality? How many differing models (from hatches to hulls) do you make during a set period (one month, or one year...)? Have the guys you work with seen your face? __________________

07-25-11, 10:55 AM	#7
Growler A long way from the sea Join Date: May 2005 Location: Iowa Posts: 1,913 Downloads: 21 Uploads: 0	This is a cool post, Betonov - I always wanted to see this method of boat-building. One question, though. Why is that guy standing on the EPS block picture making rude gestures? __________________ At Fiddler’s Green, where seamen true When here they’ve done their duty The bowl of grog shall still renew And pledge to love and beauty.

07-25-11, 02:54 PM	#9
Sailor Steve Eternal Patrol Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: High in the mountains of Utah Posts: 50,369 Downloads: 745 Uploads: 249	Awesome job to have! __________________ “Never do anything you can't take back.” —Rocky Russo

07-25-11, 07:22 AM	#2
Betonov Navy Seal Join Date: May 2009 Location: Slovenia Posts: 8,647 Downloads: 26 Uploads: 0	FIFTH the modeling paste. The milled rough model is then coated with resin and the long and grueling process of aplying the modeling paste. The paste is a chemical miracle, two components after being mixed by a machine and aplied by hand via a laying nozzle. the machine: http://www.dekumed.de/indexeng.html A deck model being laid. At the beggining of the shift and after 12 hours the model paste applied SIXTH again to the CNC. The modeling paste is then milled just like the EPS before. Only with a lot more love and accuracy. The hull being milled SEVENTH putty and sand paper. The most boring aspect of design begins. One needs to locate holes, dents or imperfections of the model and fill them with putty and then sand it down to perfection. A milimeter big dent takes 10 takes to make a perfect surface. Some final adjustments can be made at this stage. EIGHTH making of the glass. After the model is perfect, it is sprayed with a special kind of surface putty. That putty is then sanded with increasingly fine sandpaper until it is as smooth as glass. Any imperfections here and it will show in the final product. A mistake here will mean a disaster. This is it for the modeling phase of design. Next the mold is made with fiberglass reinforced palstic and that mold is used to create final components. I have made hull models of 50m long yachts to just half a meter models of hatches. It's a diverse job

07-25-11, 08:23 AM	#4
Garion Commander Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Scotland Posts: 452 Downloads: 34 Uploads: 0	Thats really cool. I build model boats among other things and it's always fasinating to see how the BIG STUFF is designed and constructed Cheers Garion

07-25-11, 03:00 PM	#11
Sailor Steve Eternal Patrol Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: High in the mountains of Utah Posts: 50,369 Downloads: 745 Uploads: 249	No job is ever all light and roses. I've had to do things like that in regular jobs, but I never got to design a boat. __________________ “Never do anything you can't take back.” —Rocky Russo

07-25-11, 03:14 PM	#12
Betonov Navy Seal Join Date: May 2009 Location: Slovenia Posts: 8,647 Downloads: 26 Uploads: 0	Like I said in another thread, it comes with a certain prestige. Have you ever tried to pick up women with the line: I build luxury yachts It almost worked, but the problem was they turned around and saw my face

07-25-11, 03:19 PM	#13
Jimbuna Chief of the Boat Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: 250 metres below the surface Posts: 190,473 Downloads: 63 Uploads: 13	__________________ Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because they have to say something. Oh my God, not again!!

07-25-11, 03:20 PM	#14
papa_smurf Ocean Warrior Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: High Peak, Derbyshire Posts: 2,851 Downloads: 33 Uploads: 0	Sounds a fun job. My grandfather was a draughtsman at Harland&Wolff, and that was back in the day using pencil and paper. __________________

07-25-11, 03:20 PM	#15
Penguin Ocean Warrior Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Rheinische Republik Posts: 3,322 Downloads: 92 Uploads: 0	Indeed, very interesting, thanks for posting! I've also got some questions: - Why do you build your models from Elektroprivreda Srbije? - What is the modeling paste made of? - if that's no company secret - In the CAD pic, what does CP mean? Is this the drag of the boot in the water? I'm a little confused, as I know Cw for the drag, which doesn't go under 0.