Magnetic exploder questions

[Osmium Steele]

Is the improved magnetic influence pistol, post December 1942, modelled in game or do we have to suffer through to the end of the war?

If yes, is it the combination magnetic and contact exploder?

I've been trying to find any research into specifically why heavy wave action caused premature detonation of german magnetic pistols, and have been spectacularly unsuccessful.

It was eventually determined that the magnetic influence of the fjords caused the failures during the norwegian campaign, but I have found no info related to wave action.

The problems with american magnetic exploders seem to have been independant of sea state.

Anybody out there have a link to such information?

[maillemaker]

I don't know if the TII's fuse is updated, but the TIII becomes available and supposedly has an improved fuse.

[TorpX]

I've been trying to find any research into specifically why heavy wave action caused premature detonation of german magnetic pistols, and have been spectacularly unsuccessful.

It was eventually determined that the magnetic influence of the fjords caused the failures during the norwegian campaign, but I have found no info related to wave action.

I don't have detailed info about the German pistols, but everything I've read about torpedos indicates that none of the magnetic exploders were reliable. The British, Germans and U.S. all tried to use them and ultimately gave up on them. If anybody has sources with information to the contrary, I'd like to see them. It seems like people expect to get easy and reliable sinkings with a single torpedo. This is not realistic, IMO.

The problems with american magnetic exploders seem to have been independant of sea state.

There are two problems with MI exploders; failure to detonate and premature detonation. Rough seas increased the latter. In any case, they were unreliable and taken out of service.

[Osmium Steele]

Originally Posted by TorpX

I don't have detailed info about the German pistols, but everything I've read about torpedos indicates that none of the magnetic exploders were reliable. The British, Germans and U.S. all tried to use them and ultimately gave up on them.

Yes and no. The allies halted their use. The germans, with a 2 year head start on the research, developed a much more reliable combination magnetic/impact exploder which entered service in Dec '42.

ref. http://www.uboat.net/history/torpedo_crisis.htm

Originally Posted by TorpX

It seems like people expect to get easy and reliable sinkings with a single torpedo. This is not realistic, IMO.

Again ref: the above article:

"Later into the war, in an analysis of torpedo performance in the period January-June 1942 (Paukenschlag and the apex of U-boat activity in American waters - the richest single harvest of the whole war), it was estimated that only 40% of the ships had been sunk by a single torpedo during that period, while the rest had either required two or more, or had escaped after one or multiple hits. In light of the more than two million tons of shipping actually sunk (a third were tankers), it is easy to imagine what could have been the outcome had the U-boats been armed with the weapon they really needed."

40% seems about right, in a purely anecdotal sense, from my experience.
Small/coastal merchants, passenger/cargo, some medium cargo etc. I take regularly with a sinlge fish. Sometimes combined with a few rounds from the deck gun. With the improved exploder, and acoustic torpedo post Dec '42, I'd expect a higher success rate per fish.

At that point, of course, the problem becomes obtaining a reliable solution with the increase in technological innovation and quality of Allied ASW.

[maillemaker]

What was it about the fjords that caused a magnetic field disruption?

Steve

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by maillemaker

What was it about the fjords that caused a magnetic field disruption?

Steve

The magnetic detonator anomoly:

The magnetic detonator however proved to be immune to simple fixes. It was supposed to detonate when it passed underneath a ship’s keel, as it was triggered by a sudden change in magnetic fields. This did not work as intended as the British had found a way to reduce a ship’s magnetic field by degaussing. Additionally, the earth’s magnetic fields also varied at different geographical locations and were influenced by iron ore deposits beneath the sea bed. Only when the completely redesigned Pi2 detonator had been introduced in December 1942, the problems of magnetic detonator continued to plague the U-boat Force.
But even if the detonators had been working flawlessly, problems with depth keeping meant that torpedoes were running two to three meters too deep. The depth keeping device worked by using an atmospheric chamber which controlled running depth. The Torpedo Directorate conducted new tests and could not discover any flaws. This occurred because the test torpedoes were launched from normal atmospheric conditions. But since atmospheric pressure inside a U-boat varied greatly, especially after prolonged submerged activity, air would leak into the torpedo chamber, effectively recalibrating the depth sensor.

[maillemaker]

So is Norway heavy in iron ore or something?

Steve

[Jimbuna]

Norway just happened to be the area where most prize targets were on offer and missed/lost....it was more down to atmospheric pressure conditions.

[TorpX]

Perhaps it's not the last word on German torpedos, but this is what Frederick J. Milford had to say on the subject:

Exactly this problem affected the magnetic exploders developed by the Royal Navy, the German navy and the US Navy. The Royal Navy quickly abandoned magnetic influence devices and relied on contact exploders. The German navy provided a sensitivity adjustment that would, in principle, compensate for changes in latitude. This was unsatisfactory and it too was abandoned fairly quickly12. The BuOrd/Naval Torpedo Station Newport response was first denial that there was a problem, then a complicated set of instructions for setting the exploders for different latitudes.

Does anyone know for sure if Germany was still using magnetic pistols late in the war?

[Sailor Steve]

Yes, they came up with a new, more reliable version in December 1942, and after that had few problems.

[Jimbuna]

Not sure if Steve would agree with me but the Americans had possibly more trouble with their detonators and despite numerous complaints eventually resorted to firing them at a cliff face then sending divers down to recover them for examination.

I know they lost a lot more potential heavy warship tonnage (Japanese) than the Germans ever did (Royal Navy).