A Matter Of Tactics

cdrsubron7 · 08-05-10, 04:15 PM

I'm sailing in the USS Apogon out of Saipan and the date is October 22, 1944. I've made contact with the Northern Force coming from Japan to take part in the Battle of Leyte Gulf.

The Apogon is currently lying submerged dead ahead of the oncoming task force at about 6000 yds, as of yet undetected. The task force shapes up like this (going from my port to starboard), two light cruisers in the outside port column, the inner port column consists of an Ise-class BB/CV followed by a Taiyo-class CVE. The inner starboard consists of a Shokaku-class CV followed by a Ise-class BB/CV and an Agano-class CL. The outside starboard column consists of two Taiyo-class CVE.

There are 5 to 6 escorts scattered around the parimeter of the task force. Here is the problem I'm having, in front of the task force is a Matsu class DE and no matter what tactic I try I can't get past this escort without being detected. I've tried deep submergance running silently the same at PS and still I've been discovered.

I'm playing TMO 2.0/RSRDC.

So what would you guys suggest, how do I get around this boy without being detected? Or is it impossilbe?

Ducimus · 08-05-10, 04:48 PM

Something i scribbled into MS Paint some years ago:

Come in from ahead, and at an oblique angle. Gives you overlapping targets, and you stay out of the lead Tin Can's way. Only problem is your showing your broadsides to the flanking escort. So when the lead escort crosses your bow, move in before the flanking escort reach's you. Try not to get any closer then 2200 yards from escorts if possible.

Flanking escort will be the problem, If you can get inside him, you've bought yourself more time. Or you can fire before he reach's your position if you don't think you can make the speed to get to the inside. If your forced to do that, you won't have much time to fire, but you'll still have the opportunity to make the shot if your focused. Either way the lead escort doesn't become a problem until later.

Whatever you do, don't do this.

EDIT:

What you may have to do (considering theres 6 escorts) is come in at an angle to the convoy, and then run a parrell course to the escort screen to minimize your profile. If you can pull that off, what will happen is you'll get to the inside, will have to make a sharp 90 degree turn, and fire. You won't have much time, so you'll ahve to put extra turns on your screws, which will make you rather noisy. So, once you've made it inside, your basically unzipping your fly, and dropping your pants the instant you start making your hard turn to port or starboard, so be quick with your shot, and start heading for the cellar before the fish hit.

cdrsubron7 · 08-05-10, 05:26 PM

Thanks for the suggestions, Duci. I'll give this a try after I get home from work tonight.

Rockin Robbins · 08-08-10, 04:05 PM

I would add that you should make your target the longest of all the ships in the convoy. That will make you more likely to get hits. Don't waste your time shooting at multiple targets--take out the big one for sure! You're out there risking your life. Make some of them pay with theirs!

Armistead · 08-08-10, 10:13 PM

Tried and true, but flank escort is a pain. I actually will turn at an angle from him towards the lead escort and usually can shoot with bows and sterns at the convoy. Not realistic in reality, but works great in game....I always try to shoot multiples if not spotted. Gonna get driven down anyway and hate doing more end arounds.

Diopos · 08-09-10, 09:51 AM

Here is a thought concerning convoys. Needs verification from the moding crew or people who have "played around" with the mission editor.

A. Convoy speed is based on the speed of their slowest members.

B. If you take out the "slow movers" the convoy speed increases (based on the speed of remaining set of "slow movers").

C. If you are planning on multiple attacks on the convoy, you'd prefer a "slow" rather a "fast" moving convoy, as it will be more easy to reposition your sub for a subsequent attack.

D. Based on the above, the highest priority targets would be ships with high maximum speeds so as to ensure that the convoy speed won't increase.

E. From the above ''''''analysis'''''' exclude escorts.

Personally I shoot whtever seems a probable hit and get the hell outa there!

.

08-05-10, 04:15 PM	#1
cdrsubron7 Sink'em All Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Naperville, IL Posts: 2,150 Downloads: 305 Uploads: 1	A Matter Of Tactics I'm sailing in the USS Apogon out of Saipan and the date is October 22, 1944. I've made contact with the Northern Force coming from Japan to take part in the Battle of Leyte Gulf. The Apogon is currently lying submerged dead ahead of the oncoming task force at about 6000 yds, as of yet undetected. The task force shapes up like this (going from my port to starboard), two light cruisers in the outside port column, the inner port column consists of an Ise-class BB/CV followed by a Taiyo-class CVE. The inner starboard consists of a Shokaku-class CV followed by a Ise-class BB/CV and an Agano-class CL. The outside starboard column consists of two Taiyo-class CVE. There are 5 to 6 escorts scattered around the parimeter of the task force. Here is the problem I'm having, in front of the task force is a Matsu class DE and no matter what tactic I try I can't get past this escort without being detected. I've tried deep submergance running silently the same at PS and still I've been discovered. I'm playing TMO 2.0/RSRDC. So what would you guys suggest, how do I get around this boy without being detected? Or is it impossilbe? __________________ Head Deep and Keep'em Astern" - LtCDR Samuel D Dealy SHIV Guide \| Imperial Japanese Navy \| US Submarines

08-05-10, 05:26 PM	#3
cdrsubron7 Sink'em All Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Naperville, IL Posts: 2,150 Downloads: 305 Uploads: 1	Thanks for the suggestions, Duci. I'll give this a try after I get home from work tonight. __________________ Head Deep and Keep'em Astern" - LtCDR Samuel D Dealy SHIV Guide \| Imperial Japanese Navy \| US Submarines

08-08-10, 04:05 PM	#4
Rockin Robbins Navy Seal Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: DeLand, FL Posts: 8,900 Downloads: 135 Uploads: 52	I would add that you should make your target the longest of all the ships in the convoy. That will make you more likely to get hits. Don't waste your time shooting at multiple targets--take out the big one for sure! You're out there risking your life. Make some of them pay with theirs! __________________ Sub Skipper's Bag of Tricks, Slightly Subnuclear Mk 14 & Cutie, Slightly Subnuclear Deck Gun, EZPlot 2.0, TMOPlot, TMOKeys, SH4CMS

08-09-10, 09:51 AM	#6
Diopos Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Athens, the original one. Posts: 1,226 Downloads: 9 Uploads: 0	Here is a thought concerning convoys. Needs verification from the moding crew or people who have "played around" with the mission editor. A. Convoy speed is based on the speed of their slowest members. B. If you take out the "slow movers" the convoy speed increases (based on the speed of remaining set of "slow movers"). C. If you are planning on multiple attacks on the convoy, you'd prefer a "slow" rather a "fast" moving convoy, as it will be more easy to reposition your sub for a subsequent attack. D. Based on the above, the highest priority targets would be ships with high maximum speeds so as to ensure that the convoy speed won't increase. E. From the above ''''''analysis'''''' exclude escorts. Personally I shoot whtever seems a probable hit and get the hell outa there! . __________________ - Oh God! They're all over the place! CRASH DIVE!!! - Ehm... we can't honey. We're in the car right now. - What?... er right... Doesn't matter! We'll give it a try anyway! Last edited by Diopos; 08-09-10 at 11:59 AM. Reason: repaired syntax/grammar on paragraph "D".

08-05-10, 04:48 PM	#2
Ducimus Rear Admiral Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 12,987 Downloads: 67 Uploads: 2	Something i scribbled into MS Paint some years ago: Come in from ahead, and at an oblique angle. Gives you overlapping targets, and you stay out of the lead Tin Can's way. Only problem is your showing your broadsides to the flanking escort. So when the lead escort crosses your bow, move in before the flanking escort reach's you. Try not to get any closer then 2200 yards from escorts if possible. Flanking escort will be the problem, If you can get inside him, you've bought yourself more time. Or you can fire before he reach's your position if you don't think you can make the speed to get to the inside. If your forced to do that, you won't have much time to fire, but you'll still have the opportunity to make the shot if your focused. Either way the lead escort doesn't become a problem until later. Whatever you do, don't do this. EDIT: What you may have to do (considering theres 6 escorts) is come in at an angle to the convoy, and then run a parrell course to the escort screen to minimize your profile. If you can pull that off, what will happen is you'll get to the inside, will have to make a sharp 90 degree turn, and fire. You won't have much time, so you'll ahve to put extra turns on your screws, which will make you rather noisy. So, once you've made it inside, your basically unzipping your fly, and dropping your pants the instant you start making your hard turn to port or starboard, so be quick with your shot, and start heading for the cellar before the fish hit.

08-08-10, 10:13 PM	#5
Armistead Rear Admiral Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: on the Dan Posts: 10,880 Downloads: 364 Uploads: 0	Tried and true, but flank escort is a pain. I actually will turn at an angle from him towards the lead escort and usually can shoot with bows and sterns at the convoy. Not realistic in reality, but works great in game....I always try to shoot multiples if not spotted. Gonna get driven down anyway and hate doing more end arounds.