6 Destroyers and Illustrious class carrier versus the unlucky U-53

Crécy · 07-27-10, 06:16 AM

I encounterd (first time ever!) a carrier north from England isles and 6 destroyers. I drew a rough picture from the situation:

As you can see the distance between me and carrier is approx. 9 kilometers and rising. U-53, the unlucky one, and her crew desperately needs the scalp of the carrier. So, I'm asking from you more experienced kaleun's advices to intercept and sink the carrier. It's November and the dark comes early. At the moment the clock is around 2pm and it's getting darker but it's still a long way to pitch black. How can I get ahead of the carrier? No fog and sea is quite rough. Should I take distance to it and run at the surface to get ahead of it? How close and how fast can I move to remain unnoticed?

Herr-Berbunch · 07-27-10, 06:42 AM

Having never been in this situation I don't know, but to quote the mighty Frau, "taking on enemy warships with guns is NOT A GOOD IDEA!"

I take it the carrier is in the lead? If you're still on the surface at the moment, send a contact report ASAP!

Check the speed, and plot a course where you can scoot round and end up in front, it may take all night - and you may loose them - but surely worth a go

. I think the distance you can remain undetected will vary depending on if you've got mods like GWX 16km, the sea state (rough is good but slows you down!), weather and time - no hard and fast rule unfortunately!

Other than that, good luck and let us know how you do!

That's enough waffle from moi, I'll let somebody else have an input now...

07-27-10, 06:42 AM

It matters, how late it's in the game. If it's mid '42 or later and you're surfacing, you're getting yourself creamed.
If it's earlier, how fast is this Taskforce going? Everything faster as 15 knots leads only to a high fuel-consumption and the probability that you're scorring against the carrier ist smaller then 20%.

I say, let her go, curse a bit and if you're feeling adventurous, head for Scapa.

Jankowski · 07-27-10, 06:46 AM

ok, do a few long shots and dive as far as you can down. if they didnt notice you before, they wouldnt increase thier speed.

Crécy · 07-27-10, 07:01 AM

Forgot to meantion few important things. It's 1939 November. The carrier is indeed in the lead. Biggest problem is that they are propably going around 9-12 knots and my fuel is low.

Thank you for your advices. I'm going to try to get it. This is third war patrol and I've sunk only three ships. Morale is down. Bad weathers have persecuted us and made it almost impossible to attack when we've encounterd ships. There is a rumor going on among the crew that the captain is cursed. So I have to atleast try and by succeeding, dispel the rumor. I'll let you know how it went.

frau kaleun · 07-27-10, 07:53 AM

If you attempt an attack in daylight or even a well-lit night you should probably go to periscope depth as soon as you come back within visual range of the task force. Also go to silent running and stay that way.

This means that you will need to get far enough ahead of the carrier's projected course to make your attack run submerged at about 2 knots max and still get close enough to have a decent shot at hitting her.

I've gotten within 3 km of a destroyer escorting a convoy at night without being spotted, but a whole task force - I don't know if I'd risk that on the surface regardless of the conditions.

At any rate, if you are able to get close enough to take a decent shot, fire all your forward tubes at her and then don't stick around to see if they hit. Stay silent and start diving - set a course away from the scene and go deep. With any luck you'll remain undetected unless and until one or more of your eels hits home and if you're deep enough and far enough away from where you were when you fired, the destroyers will never come close to looking in the right spot even with their ASDIC engaged.

That's the only way I ever managed to sink the Courageous in the single mission for it and still get away clean.

Crécy · 07-27-10, 10:36 AM

U-53 is cursed. We took distance to the task force, surfaced and tried to get ahead of it. Maybe ten minutes later watch officer spots a swordfish coming right at us. Crash dive. Moments later we surface again, only to discover there were two swordfish flying around us. To the periscope depth and course toward home. Rough sea made it impossible to catch the TF since it was so close to the shore. Propably heading to Loch Ewe.

I wanted to try my luck in Scapa Flow but it was way too crowded and barely got out unnoticed. Then we headed straight to home, 4 eels remaining, three ships sunk. Approx. 12 GRT.

Herr-Berbunch · 07-27-10, 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crécy

U-53 is cursed. We took distance to the task force, surfaced and tried to get ahead of it. Maybe ten minutes later watch officer spots a swordfish coming right at us. Crash dive. Moments later we surface again, only to discover there were two swordfish flying around us. To the periscope depth and course toward home. Rough sea made it impossible to catch the TF since it was so close to the shore. Propably heading to Loch Ewe.

I wanted to try my luck in Scapa Flow but it was way too crowded and barely got out unnoticed. Then we headed straight to home, 4 eels remaining, three ships sunk. Approx. 12 GRT.

Better to survive to fight another day...

...personally I avoid TFs like the plague, half a dozen torps against all their armaments never seemed like a fair fight to me!

Damo · 07-30-10, 04:47 PM

I never actively seek to destroy taskforces, they really are not worth the risk, especially in a DiD campaign. The only time I will attack one is if I chance into the path of one and the hard work of positioning is already done, I'm in a sub that hasn't already had two shades of s**t knocked out of it, and I've got at least 100 meters below me. This situation is rare but I've taken out a few Bogue Carriers and a couple of Southampton classes due to chance encounters, one in fog, ship spotted at 800 meters...

I also took down the Nelson, but that was when I first started playing, at less than 60% difficulty, so I don't count that one. My favorite TF that I WILL always go for though is the one I always seem to run into early war, north of Scapa is the 1 destroyer, 2 auxiliary cruisers set up. Normally cruising along at 12 knots it's relatively easy to get ahead of and you only have to evade 1 destroyer. I only throw ordnance at destroyers in self defense if evading techniques fail me, or if there's only one guarding a convoy. I use GWX and Community Units so a lot of merchies, even early war are armed so ploughing into the middle of them deckgun blazing is normally suicidal.

sergei · 07-30-10, 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damo

My favorite TF that I WILL always go for though is the one I always seem to run into early war, north of Scapa is the 1 destroyer, 2 auxiliary cruisers set up. Normally cruising along at 12 knots it's relatively easy to get ahead of and you only have to evade 1 destroyer.

Yeah, I've ran into these fellas a few times now, in '39 or early '40.
Easy prey, good tonnage

07-27-10, 06:16 AM	#1
Crécy Grey Wolf Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Dark forest Posts: 793 Downloads: 316 Uploads: 0	6 Destroyers and Illustrious class carrier versus the unlucky U-53 I encounterd (first time ever!) a carrier north from England isles and 6 destroyers. I drew a rough picture from the situation: As you can see the distance between me and carrier is approx. 9 kilometers and rising. U-53, the unlucky one, and her crew desperately needs the scalp of the carrier. So, I'm asking from you more experienced kaleun's advices to intercept and sink the carrier. It's November and the dark comes early. At the moment the clock is around 2pm and it's getting darker but it's still a long way to pitch black. How can I get ahead of the carrier? No fog and sea is quite rough. Should I take distance to it and run at the surface to get ahead of it? How close and how fast can I move to remain unnoticed?

07-27-10, 06:42 AM	#2
Herr-Berbunch Kaiser Bill's batman Join Date: May 2010 Location: AN72 Posts: 13,203 Downloads: 76 Uploads: 0	Having never been in this situation I don't know, but to quote the mighty Frau, "taking on enemy warships with guns is NOT A GOOD IDEA!" I take it the carrier is in the lead? If you're still on the surface at the moment, send a contact report ASAP! Check the speed, and plot a course where you can scoot round and end up in front, it may take all night - and you may loose them - but surely worth a go . I think the distance you can remain undetected will vary depending on if you've got mods like GWX 16km, the sea state (rough is good but slows you down!), weather and time - no hard and fast rule unfortunately! Other than that, good luck and let us know how you do! That's enough waffle from moi, I'll let somebody else have an input now... __________________

07-30-10, 04:47 PM	#9
Damo Captain Join Date: May 2009 Location: Forever stuck in Data folder... Posts: 482 Downloads: 259 Uploads: 0	I never actively seek to destroy taskforces, they really are not worth the risk, especially in a DiD campaign. The only time I will attack one is if I chance into the path of one and the hard work of positioning is already done, I'm in a sub that hasn't already had two shades of s**t knocked out of it, and I've got at least 100 meters below me. This situation is rare but I've taken out a few Bogue Carriers and a couple of Southampton classes due to chance encounters, one in fog, ship spotted at 800 meters... I also took down the Nelson, but that was when I first started playing, at less than 60% difficulty, so I don't count that one. My favorite TF that I WILL always go for though is the one I always seem to run into early war, north of Scapa is the 1 destroyer, 2 auxiliary cruisers set up. Normally cruising along at 12 knots it's relatively easy to get ahead of and you only have to evade 1 destroyer. I only throw ordnance at destroyers in self defense if evading techniques fail me, or if there's only one guarding a convoy. I use GWX and Community Units so a lot of merchies, even early war are armed so ploughing into the middle of them deckgun blazing is normally suicidal. __________________ The owl and the pussycat went to sea in a beautiful pea-green boat. It only took one T1 eel to convince that boat not to float.

07-27-10, 06:42 AM	#3
gmuno Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	It matters, how late it's in the game. If it's mid '42 or later and you're surfacing, you're getting yourself creamed. If it's earlier, how fast is this Taskforce going? Everything faster as 15 knots leads only to a high fuel-consumption and the probability that you're scorring against the carrier ist smaller then 20%. I say, let her go, curse a bit and if you're feeling adventurous, head for Scapa.

07-27-10, 06:46 AM	#4
Jankowski Frogman Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 306 Downloads: 17 Uploads: 0	ok, do a few long shots and dive as far as you can down. if they didnt notice you before, they wouldnt increase thier speed.

07-27-10, 07:01 AM	#5
Crécy Grey Wolf Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Dark forest Posts: 793 Downloads: 316 Uploads: 0	Forgot to meantion few important things. It's 1939 November. The carrier is indeed in the lead. Biggest problem is that they are propably going around 9-12 knots and my fuel is low. Thank you for your advices. I'm going to try to get it. This is third war patrol and I've sunk only three ships. Morale is down. Bad weathers have persecuted us and made it almost impossible to attack when we've encounterd ships. There is a rumor going on among the crew that the captain is cursed. So I have to atleast try and by succeeding, dispel the rumor. I'll let you know how it went.

07-27-10, 07:53 AM	#6
frau kaleun Rear Admiral Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Skyri--oh who are we kidding, I'm probably at Lowe's. Again. Posts: 12,706 Downloads: 168 Uploads: 0	If you attempt an attack in daylight or even a well-lit night you should probably go to periscope depth as soon as you come back within visual range of the task force. Also go to silent running and stay that way. This means that you will need to get far enough ahead of the carrier's projected course to make your attack run submerged at about 2 knots max and still get close enough to have a decent shot at hitting her. I've gotten within 3 km of a destroyer escorting a convoy at night without being spotted, but a whole task force - I don't know if I'd risk that on the surface regardless of the conditions. At any rate, if you are able to get close enough to take a decent shot, fire all your forward tubes at her and then don't stick around to see if they hit. Stay silent and start diving - set a course away from the scene and go deep. With any luck you'll remain undetected unless and until one or more of your eels hits home and if you're deep enough and far enough away from where you were when you fired, the destroyers will never come close to looking in the right spot even with their ASDIC engaged. That's the only way I ever managed to sink the Courageous in the single mission for it and still get away clean.

07-27-10, 10:36 AM	#7
Crécy Grey Wolf Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Dark forest Posts: 793 Downloads: 316 Uploads: 0	U-53 is cursed. We took distance to the task force, surfaced and tried to get ahead of it. Maybe ten minutes later watch officer spots a swordfish coming right at us. Crash dive. Moments later we surface again, only to discover there were two swordfish flying around us. To the periscope depth and course toward home. Rough sea made it impossible to catch the TF since it was so close to the shore. Propably heading to Loch Ewe. I wanted to try my luck in Scapa Flow but it was way too crowded and barely got out unnoticed. Then we headed straight to home, 4 eels remaining, three ships sunk. Approx. 12 GRT.