War in the Pacific (Admiral's Edition)

Te Kaha · 12-22-09, 02:06 PM

Is there anyone playing this game, or pondering to buy it?

Am asking because I am thinking about buying it, but reading the reviews, this title seems to have such a depth that you can more or less forget about real life... I'm married with kids...

Opinions?

eddie · 12-22-09, 06:40 PM

I have the original version of WitP, so get ready for lots of detail and micromanaging,lol If you like those things in a sim, then go for it! But,keep 2 things in mind before you do-

1-Check to see if your family has any problems with you being in front of your pc for long extended periods of time,like on weekends, during holidays, meal times, etc.

2-Make sure your employer will put up with you missing a day here and there, and ask him to overlook your appearence when you show up late, and looking like you haven't slept or shaved in about 3 days!

Torplexed · 12-22-09, 09:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Te Kaha

Is there anyone playing this game, or pondering to buy it?

Am asking because I am thinking about buying it, but reading the reviews, this title seems to have such a depth that you can more or less forget about real life... I'm married with kids...

Opinions?

It's not for the faint of heart. I've played the Coral Sea scenario and the Guadalcanal one, but have yet to take the campaign game plunge. It certainly helps if you have a deep abiding interest in the subject matter of the Pacific War, as it was hardly an even contest as time goes on and Japan slowly gets buried by Allied material advantages. The toughest part is tackling the situation in China where the Allies are blessed with many, many almost worthless Chinese units on a long meandering front. Happily there is a campaign scenario now where this sector remains mostly quiet, so you don't have to micro-manage it. If you play as Japan you really have to struggle to manage Japan's industry well as most resources are overseas and you never seem to have enough merchant ships.

I do like the little touches they have added. Your ships in combat can take damage from each other as well as the enemy in the form of collisions. The Pearl Harbor attack can be a one day affair or go through several days of repeat attacks. The "improved" fog of war means it may be months before you confirm through intelligence that an enemy ship you think you sank in battle did sink...or was even that particular ship. All in all well done.

Arclight · 12-23-09, 08:33 AM

Still considering getting this for Christmas. imho it's the ultimate naval sim, if you have the time to play it. The scale is just mind-boggling.

Te Kaha · 12-23-09, 06:30 PM

Thanks for the input, gentlemen. Just one more question, how long does it take on average to play a single turn?

Torplexed · 12-23-09, 08:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Te Kaha

Thanks for the input, gentlemen. Just one more question, how long does it take on average to play a single turn?

I've heard of some people taking many hours if not a whole day with the first turn as you have to set invasion and strike force convoys in motion as Japan, move aircraft forward from rear areas to better bases, start loading troops and supplies in follow-up convoys, move subs to likely interdiction points, fortify far-flung bases, decide which ships to convert or stop production on, start expanding airfields and ports, lay mines, set optimum aircraft patrols, set priority for which ships receive repair first, etc, etc. If playing as the Allies you have to react to all these moves in a similar fashion.

Once past that point it's not nearly as bad as task forces and ground regiments often many turns to reach their destinations. Maybe an hour or even less for a turn if not much is happening. Although it doesn't hurt to keep a note book of what is going where for why as the one-day turns means that supply convoy you loaded with P-40 fighter planes on December 8th in San Diego on the US West Coast won't arrive in Sydney, Australia until February and you may have forgotten where you intended those aircraft to go from there, or even that that particular convoy existed.

All those subs take a bit of micro-managing too.

Dowly · 12-23-09, 09:07 PM

Jebus! Who has time for games like this?

Torplexed · 12-23-09, 09:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dowly

Jebus! Who has time for games like this?

Real strategic level game micro-management freaks.

Which I'll admit to being guilty of at times.

I was born in Japan and lived for several years as a youth in Okinawa so I've always been deeply interested in the Pacific War. Plus, the game system seems to fit the theater real well.

Dowly · 12-23-09, 09:48 PM

Is there a demo or something? I dont mind games like this, but they gotta be goooood for me to keep the interest up.

Torplexed · 12-23-09, 09:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dowly

Is there a demo or something? I dont mind games like this, but they gotta be goooood for me to keep the interest up.

No demo unless you want to pick up the original WITP which is probably cheap now. I can direct you to the forum for WitP Admirals Edition.

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tt.asp?forumid=528

However, it's an old school war game originally released in 2004 without much in the way of animation or visuals. You're basically at the position of the Joint Chiefs of Staff or Imperial HQ moving lots and lots of little flags around the giant table top map. There's some very simple animation for combat, but a lot is left to the imagination. The AARs are probably useful to read at first.

Dowly · 12-23-09, 10:13 PM

Thanks mate, will have a look.

eddie · 12-24-09, 01:47 PM

Have to mention this Dowly, if you get the original WitP, don't expect a whole lot from the AI. It was supposed to be fixed, but they decided they would have to rewrite too much of the code, and that's one of the main reasons the AE came out, easier to write new code then fix the old. That sim is best played against a human opponent, they have had some great times doing that.

Gibbons · 01-10-10, 05:37 PM

WITP is not really a sim. It is turn based, and as noted it is definitely for someone who likes detail.

For instance, you can give units, ranging from commando size to divisions, a future objective for which they will begin to prepare as if they are training. Their training progresses from 0-100. If you just load them on a transport without preparing them and dump them on some atoll they will take horrendous casualties. Also, if you don't use proper landing craft and instead say load them on a cargo ship, which unloads slowly and with alot of confusion, they will take higher casualties, much like the real war. It is also best to have an HQ (headquarters) unit with the invasion force as it reduces their confusion and boosts their fighting ability some. Tip: As soon as you get a new ground unit at one of the staging bases like San Francisco or Karachi, immediately give it a target to prepare for. Even if you change it later at least you have them getting ready for SOMETHING rather than twidding their thumbs.

If the island has any defensive guns you need to send fleets there to pound the base into submission before invading, and/or include some cruisers or battleships with the invasion fleet to absorb defensive gunnery and fire back.

The first year is pretty much a holding action for the Americans as everything they have is outclassed by the Japanese, especially the aircraft. And you don't have alot of stuff where it needs to be. So you'll spend the first few months loading transports at San Francisco/LA, Karachi, to build up forward bases and resupply and reinforce Australia. Moving bomber and fighter groups to forward areas (long range bombers can fly from SF to Pearl, but fighters and smaller bombers have to be loaded on transports and shipped there. It all takes time. The replacements for lost aircraft are also slow at the beginning, and the experience level and morale of air crews is low so losses are relatively high. If you send a bomber group to bomb a base and they take high losses, morale drops alot and you then have to idle those squadrons or groups for a week or two to allow them to recover.

At the start the Jap carriers and planes far outclass the U.S. stuff so any direct confrontations will not go well. The same for any contact between U.S. carrier TFs and longrange land-based bombers.

The first order of business (when you start a whole-war campaign) is to load up tranports and get supplies and fuel moving from the U.S. mainland and Karachi to Pearl and Australia. Pick a few of the larger Aussie bases and make them main supply depos, keeping them supplied with the maximum supplies and fuel, then distributing from those out to any forward smaller bases. All transports should be either loading, unloading, or moving at all times. I use Noumea, Brisbane and Broome in the south Pacific, and Colombo and Diamond Harbor near India.

The first few turns take more than an hour and as noted you could spend hours if you wanted to. After that the time diminishes down to as little as fifteen minutes. Depends how 'hands on' you are, i.e. if you want to check every single unit every turn. If not the turns can go quickly.

If you like the detail this game is great. One of the best done of the Pacific War. It isn't perfect but it gets close enough.

Gibbons

Maserati · 01-13-10, 07:01 PM

Tip: As the Allied player, hold on to Rabaul. I've had some fantastic battles around that spot. The Aussies have just enough to put a defense force with a little air cover on the island before the IJN shows up in force. it totally breaks the back of their Southern strategy.

Raiding supply routes with carriers is also a big plus, I nailed a fleet HQ and all the transports carrying it once.

Arclight · 01-16-10, 08:29 AM

Cool, an actually decent manual! Remember those days?

12-22-09, 02:06 PM	#1
Te Kaha Navy Dude Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Austrian landlubber Posts: 178 Downloads: 75 Uploads: 2	War in the Pacific (Admiral's Edition) Is there anyone playing this game, or pondering to buy it? Am asking because I am thinking about buying it, but reading the reviews, this title seems to have such a depth that you can more or less forget about real life... I'm married with kids... Opinions? __________________ "E hoa, ka whawhai tonu mātou, Āke! Āke! Āke!" (Friend, we will fight on forever, forever and forever!) Rewi Maniapoto's reply to British calls for surrender, Orakau, 1864

12-23-09, 08:33 AM	#4
Arclight Navy Seal Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Land of windmills, tulips, wooden shoes and cheese. Lots of cheese. Posts: 8,467 Downloads: 53 Uploads: 10	Still considering getting this for Christmas. imho it's the ultimate naval sim, if you have the time to play it. The scale is just mind-boggling. __________________ Contritium praecedit superbia.

12-23-09, 06:30 PM	#5
Te Kaha Navy Dude Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Austrian landlubber Posts: 178 Downloads: 75 Uploads: 2	Thanks for the input, gentlemen. Just one more question, how long does it take on average to play a single turn? __________________ "E hoa, ka whawhai tonu mātou, Āke! Āke! Āke!" (Friend, we will fight on forever, forever and forever!) Rewi Maniapoto's reply to British calls for surrender, Orakau, 1864

01-16-10, 08:29 AM	#15
Arclight Navy Seal Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Land of windmills, tulips, wooden shoes and cheese. Lots of cheese. Posts: 8,467 Downloads: 53 Uploads: 10	Cool, an actually decent manual! Remember those days? __________________ Contritium praecedit superbia.

12-22-09, 06:40 PM	#2
eddie Ocean Warrior Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Minnesota Posts: 3,023 Downloads: 99 Uploads: 0	I have the original version of WitP, so get ready for lots of detail and micromanaging,lol If you like those things in a sim, then go for it! But,keep 2 things in mind before you do- 1-Check to see if your family has any problems with you being in front of your pc for long extended periods of time,like on weekends, during holidays, meal times, etc. 2-Make sure your employer will put up with you missing a day here and there, and ask him to overlook your appearence when you show up late, and looking like you haven't slept or shaved in about 3 days!

12-23-09, 09:07 PM	#7
Dowly Lucky Jack Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Finland Posts: 25,052 Downloads: 32 Uploads: 0	Jebus! Who has time for games like this?

12-23-09, 09:48 PM	#9
Dowly Lucky Jack Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Finland Posts: 25,052 Downloads: 32 Uploads: 0	Is there a demo or something? I dont mind games like this, but they gotta be goooood for me to keep the interest up.

12-23-09, 10:13 PM	#11
Dowly Lucky Jack Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Finland Posts: 25,052 Downloads: 32 Uploads: 0	Thanks mate, will have a look.

12-24-09, 01:47 PM	#12
eddie Ocean Warrior Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Minnesota Posts: 3,023 Downloads: 99 Uploads: 0	Have to mention this Dowly, if you get the original WitP, don't expect a whole lot from the AI. It was supposed to be fixed, but they decided they would have to rewrite too much of the code, and that's one of the main reasons the AE came out, easier to write new code then fix the old. That sim is best played against a human opponent, they have had some great times doing that.

01-10-10, 05:37 PM	#13
Gibbons Swabbie Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 10 Downloads: 8 Uploads: 0	WITP is not really a sim. It is turn based, and as noted it is definitely for someone who likes detail. For instance, you can give units, ranging from commando size to divisions, a future objective for which they will begin to prepare as if they are training. Their training progresses from 0-100. If you just load them on a transport without preparing them and dump them on some atoll they will take horrendous casualties. Also, if you don't use proper landing craft and instead say load them on a cargo ship, which unloads slowly and with alot of confusion, they will take higher casualties, much like the real war. It is also best to have an HQ (headquarters) unit with the invasion force as it reduces their confusion and boosts their fighting ability some. Tip: As soon as you get a new ground unit at one of the staging bases like San Francisco or Karachi, immediately give it a target to prepare for. Even if you change it later at least you have them getting ready for SOMETHING rather than twidding their thumbs. If the island has any defensive guns you need to send fleets there to pound the base into submission before invading, and/or include some cruisers or battleships with the invasion fleet to absorb defensive gunnery and fire back. The first year is pretty much a holding action for the Americans as everything they have is outclassed by the Japanese, especially the aircraft. And you don't have alot of stuff where it needs to be. So you'll spend the first few months loading transports at San Francisco/LA, Karachi, to build up forward bases and resupply and reinforce Australia. Moving bomber and fighter groups to forward areas (long range bombers can fly from SF to Pearl, but fighters and smaller bombers have to be loaded on transports and shipped there. It all takes time. The replacements for lost aircraft are also slow at the beginning, and the experience level and morale of air crews is low so losses are relatively high. If you send a bomber group to bomb a base and they take high losses, morale drops alot and you then have to idle those squadrons or groups for a week or two to allow them to recover. At the start the Jap carriers and planes far outclass the U.S. stuff so any direct confrontations will not go well. The same for any contact between U.S. carrier TFs and longrange land-based bombers. The first order of business (when you start a whole-war campaign) is to load up tranports and get supplies and fuel moving from the U.S. mainland and Karachi to Pearl and Australia. Pick a few of the larger Aussie bases and make them main supply depos, keeping them supplied with the maximum supplies and fuel, then distributing from those out to any forward smaller bases. All transports should be either loading, unloading, or moving at all times. I use Noumea, Brisbane and Broome in the south Pacific, and Colombo and Diamond Harbor near India. The first few turns take more than an hour and as noted you could spend hours if you wanted to. After that the time diminishes down to as little as fifteen minutes. Depends how 'hands on' you are, i.e. if you want to check every single unit every turn. If not the turns can go quickly. If you like the detail this game is great. One of the best done of the Pacific War. It isn't perfect but it gets close enough. Gibbons

01-13-10, 07:01 PM	#14
Maserati Watch Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 26 Downloads: 28 Uploads: 0	Tip: As the Allied player, hold on to Rabaul. I've had some fantastic battles around that spot. The Aussies have just enough to put a defense force with a little air cover on the island before the IJN shows up in force. it totally breaks the back of their Southern strategy. Raiding supply routes with carriers is also a big plus, I nailed a fleet HQ and all the transports carrying it once.