Suicidal Chinese Man Pushed Over Edge

Aramike · 05-23-09, 02:07 AM

This is an interesting story: http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,...est=latestnews

From the article:

Quote:

Chen Fuchao, a man heavily in debt, had been contemplating suicide on a bridge in southern China for hours when a passer-by came up, shook his hand — and pushed him off the ledge.

Also from the article:

Quote:

I pushed him off because jumpers like Chen are very selfish. Their action violates a lot of public interest," Lai was quoted as saying by Xinhua. "They do not really dare to kill themselves. Instead, they just want to raise the relevant government authorities' attention to their appeals."

Okay, clearly pushing the man over the edge is not the "right" thing to do. However, this begs the question: did the man pushing the suicidal man do anything wrong? Think about: if the suicidal man is truly suicidal, wouldn't the result be a foregone conclusion, anyway? If not, then is the man truly suicidal, or rather is he simply seeking attention?

Please share your thoughts. I have my own, but I'd like to see the conversation shape itself without my initial leanings.

Arclight · 05-23-09, 06:24 AM

My initial thought is that it's similar to assisted suicide. Not a "bad" thing to do IMO, if the person truly wishes it to be that way, but whether or not this was the case is impossible to determine in this scenario.

If the person was in fact going to jump, and assisted suicide is allowed by law, I don't think the guy who pushed the other did anything wrong.

Still, pretty bizarre story.

AngusJS · 05-23-09, 07:22 AM

Quote:

Traffic around the Haizhu bridge in the city of Guangzhou had been backed up for five hours and police had cordoned off the area.

That's all the justification the guy needed. Let him go!

The "jumper" only fell 26 feet. He probably spent all that time trying to think of a higher point to leap from. He's in Guangzhou. Why didn't he jump off a skyscraper?

But seriously, the jumper is the only one who knows if he's suicidal or not, and especially as he was injured in the fall, the guy who pushed him should be punished.

Platapus · 05-23-09, 07:47 AM

Where in the dreary capitol of our nation, there is a bridge called the Wilson bridge. Naturally this is a chokepoint for the crappy traffic we have to endure here.

A few years ago, this jerk was standing on the Wilson bridge and threatening suicide. Unfortunately he did not follow through with his threats.

For some reason still not understood, the law enforcement people decided it was necessary to block off all six lanes of this bridge while this jerk was vacillating. This F-ed up traffic for hours.

I am sure there were many many commuters who would have gladly pushed this jerk off and gotten it over with. Drivers were calling up radio stations to vent about this.

I think when the police were able to pull him off the edge, they had to put him in immediate protective custody as he was immediately one of the most hated people in the DC area.

JALU3 · 05-23-09, 07:58 AM

I for one am not a supporter of "assisted suicide". There are plenty of ways to kill yourself, by yourself, without the need of others help.

If there is a Jumper, say off the Coronado Bridge, I can understand restricting one lane of traffic, like they do for road repair, or what not, but all lanes is a bit over the top IMHO.
Now if it were to be a high rise, clear the area below, least someone be walking by and get hit with a body on the way down. If someone wants to commit suicide, that's up to them, but there's no need to take others who don't want to die with them.

porphy · 05-23-09, 08:03 AM

Obviously the only one looking for attention was the pusher. He will rightfully find himself in court, hopefully charged with attempted murder.

I can't even start to see a problem or anything unclear about if he was doing something wrong, morally or legally, in this case, as it is described in the article. Trying to dress this up as a moral dilemma or a vague legal situation doesn't work at all.

cheers Porphy

05-23-09, 08:22 AM

Well I don't know porphy , several times I have said to a friend over the past year "next time the bastard does it either just leave him to hypothermia or put your boot on his head to push him out of the eddy"
Suicide is selfish , and in the case I refer to the selfish bastard has not only wasted both taxpayers money and charitable donations he has also wasted the time of the Gardai ,Fire brigade and Lifeboatmen , but most importantly he has also risked their lives (and of course disrupted traffic, but as O'Briens bridge doesn't get much traffic anyway since pedestrianisation and traffic in Galway is screwed anyway that isn't really an issue) (OK he could do another bridge for his "suicide" and screw up traffic even more but they don't have the same eddies without the undertow so he would die like most of the other selfish bastards)

porphy · 05-23-09, 08:48 AM

I think the question was if the pusher was doing something wrong, not if suicide is the ultimate selfish thing. Anyway, according to you view on suicide, I would say that if one push the guy, you just helped him out with the most selfish thing. So that would still be a clear wrong to me.

Cheers Porphy

JALU3 · 05-23-09, 08:59 AM

Since one cannot assist suicide, by definition of suicide being taking of ones own life, anyone who "assist" is actually killing another individual. killing another individual, without intent, to kill is manslaughter; killing another individual, with intent, to kill is murder. If I am wrong in my definitions, I can stand to be corrected.

Jimbuna · 05-23-09, 10:10 AM

Quote:

The paper said Lai was released on bail Friday but did not give any details. It said he had been on medication for "a mental illness" for decades and had been on his way to a hospital for his pills.

Now that's one helluva suprise :rotfl:

Keep em both in a sanitorium to protect the public from them

bookworm_020 · 05-23-09, 11:56 PM

assisted suicide???

At least someone gave him a helping hand, just in the wrong direction!

Highbury · 05-24-09, 02:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arclight

My initial thought is that it's similar to assisted suicide. Not a "bad" thing to do IMO, if the person truly wishes it to be that way, but whether or not this was the case is impossible to determine in this scenario.

If the person was in fact going to jump, and assisted suicide is allowed by law, I don't think the guy who pushed the other did anything wrong.

Still, pretty bizarre story.

So called "Assisted Suicide" is a pact between two people. If one person states they want to die so another pulls out a gun shoots him is that assisted suicide? lol. I think the fact that the suicidal person had no idea it was comin' changes things.

XabbaRus · 05-24-09, 02:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tribesman

Well I don't know porphy , several times I have said to a friend over the past year "next time the bastard does it either just leave him to hypothermia or put your boot on his head to push him out of the eddy"
Suicide is selfish , and in the case I refer to the selfish bastard has not only wasted both taxpayers money and charitable donations he has also wasted the time of the Gardai ,Fire brigade and Lifeboatmen , but most importantly he has also risked their lives (and of course disrupted traffic, but as O'Briens bridge doesn't get much traffic anyway since pedestrianisation and traffic in Galway is screwed anyway that isn't really an issue) (OK he could do another bridge for his "suicide" and screw up traffic even more but they don't have the same eddies without the undertow so he would die like most of the other selfish bastards)

Sorry tribeman can't agrere with you there. Having viewed mental inllness up close and dealt with someone who is suicidal you can't second guess what is going on. I also don't think suicide is necessarily selfish. Your entitled to your opion but I do object to them being called bastards.

Arclight · 05-24-09, 04:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Highbury

So called "Assisted Suicide" is a pact between two people. If one person states they want to die so another pulls out a gun shoots him is that assisted suicide?

Yep, as far as I'm concerned.

Whether it's a doctor administering some drug, or someone shooting another in the face, they are just different means to the same end.

CaptainHaplo · 05-24-09, 12:31 PM

The difference is - legal assisted suicide (in the us as least) requires the person who dies to be suffering from mid to late stages of a terminal illness.

Just wanting to end it for the sake of ending it when there is life to be lived - isnt the same deal.

Also - assisted suicide is used for those that wish to die, but cannot bear to commit the act themselves. There are numerous reasons for this - including some religious ones. Pushing a jumper - is assualt with intent to kill at the least.

05-23-09, 06:24 AM	#2
Arclight Navy Seal Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Land of windmills, tulips, wooden shoes and cheese. Lots of cheese. Posts: 8,467 Downloads: 53 Uploads: 10	My initial thought is that it's similar to assisted suicide. Not a "bad" thing to do IMO, if the person truly wishes it to be that way, but whether or not this was the case is impossible to determine in this scenario. If the person was in fact going to jump, and assisted suicide is allowed by law, I don't think the guy who pushed the other did anything wrong. Still, pretty bizarre story. __________________ Contritium praecedit superbia.

05-23-09, 07:47 AM	#4
Platapus Fleet Admiral Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 19,361 Downloads: 63 Uploads: 0	Where in the dreary capitol of our nation, there is a bridge called the Wilson bridge. Naturally this is a chokepoint for the crappy traffic we have to endure here. A few years ago, this jerk was standing on the Wilson bridge and threatening suicide. Unfortunately he did not follow through with his threats. For some reason still not understood, the law enforcement people decided it was necessary to block off all six lanes of this bridge while this jerk was vacillating. This F-ed up traffic for hours. I am sure there were many many commuters who would have gladly pushed this jerk off and gotten it over with. Drivers were calling up radio stations to vent about this. I think when the police were able to pull him off the edge, they had to put him in immediate protective custody as he was immediately one of the most hated people in the DC area. __________________ abusus non tollit usum - A right should NOT be withheld from people on the basis that some tend to abuse that right.

05-23-09, 07:58 AM	#5
JALU3 Grey Wolf Join Date: May 2007 Location: 11SMS 98896 10565 Posts: 756 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	I for one am not a supporter of "assisted suicide". There are plenty of ways to kill yourself, by yourself, without the need of others help. If there is a Jumper, say off the Coronado Bridge, I can understand restricting one lane of traffic, like they do for road repair, or what not, but all lanes is a bit over the top IMHO. Now if it were to be a high rise, clear the area below, least someone be walking by and get hit with a body on the way down. If someone wants to commit suicide, that's up to them, but there's no need to take others who don't want to die with them. __________________ "The Federation needs men like you, doctor. Men of conscience. Men of principle. Men who can sleep at night... You're also the reason Section Thirty-one exists -- someone has to protect men like you from a universe that doesn't share your sense of right and wrong." -Sloan, Section Thirty-One

05-23-09, 08:03 AM	#6
porphy Commodore Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Sweden Posts: 603 Downloads: 4 Uploads: 0	Obviously the only one looking for attention was the pusher. He will rightfully find himself in court, hopefully charged with attempted murder. I can't even start to see a problem or anything unclear about if he was doing something wrong, morally or legally, in this case, as it is described in the article. Trying to dress this up as a moral dilemma or a vague legal situation doesn't work at all. cheers Porphy __________________ "The only remedy for madness is the innocence of facts." O. Mirbeu "A paranoid is simply someone in possession of all the facts." W. B.

05-23-09, 08:48 AM	#8
porphy Commodore Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Sweden Posts: 603 Downloads: 4 Uploads: 0	I think the question was if the pusher was doing something wrong, not if suicide is the ultimate selfish thing. Anyway, according to you view on suicide, I would say that if one push the guy, you just helped him out with the most selfish thing. So that would still be a clear wrong to me. Cheers Porphy __________________ "The only remedy for madness is the innocence of facts." O. Mirbeu "A paranoid is simply someone in possession of all the facts." W. B.

05-23-09, 08:22 AM	#7
Tribesman Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	Well I don't know porphy , several times I have said to a friend over the past year "next time the bastard does it either just leave him to hypothermia or put your boot on his head to push him out of the eddy" Suicide is selfish , and in the case I refer to the selfish bastard has not only wasted both taxpayers money and charitable donations he has also wasted the time of the Gardai ,Fire brigade and Lifeboatmen , but most importantly he has also risked their lives (and of course disrupted traffic, but as O'Briens bridge doesn't get much traffic anyway since pedestrianisation and traffic in Galway is screwed anyway that isn't really an issue) (OK he could do another bridge for his "suicide" and screw up traffic even more but they don't have the same eddies without the undertow so he would die like most of the other selfish bastards)

05-23-09, 08:59 AM	#9
JALU3 Grey Wolf Join Date: May 2007 Location: 11SMS 98896 10565 Posts: 756 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Since one cannot assist suicide, by definition of suicide being taking of ones own life, anyone who "assist" is actually killing another individual. killing another individual, without intent, to kill is manslaughter; killing another individual, with intent, to kill is murder. If I am wrong in my definitions, I can stand to be corrected. __________________ "The Federation needs men like you, doctor. Men of conscience. Men of principle. Men who can sleep at night... You're also the reason Section Thirty-one exists -- someone has to protect men like you from a universe that doesn't share your sense of right and wrong." -Sloan, Section Thirty-One

05-23-09, 11:56 PM	#11
bookworm_020 Navy Seal Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Sinking ships off the Australian coast Posts: 5,966 Downloads: 1 Uploads: 0	assisted suicide??? At least someone gave him a helping hand, just in the wrong direction! __________________ "There is always one person in any organization who knows whats going on, That person must be fired"

05-24-09, 12:31 PM	#15
CaptainHaplo Silent Hunter Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 4,404 Downloads: 29 Uploads: 0	The difference is - legal assisted suicide (in the us as least) requires the person who dies to be suffering from mid to late stages of a terminal illness. Just wanting to end it for the sake of ending it when there is life to be lived - isnt the same deal. Also - assisted suicide is used for those that wish to die, but cannot bear to commit the act themselves. There are numerous reasons for this - including some religious ones. Pushing a jumper - is assualt with intent to kill at the least. __________________ Good Hunting! Captain Haplo