Whats your take on this?

[Torpex752]

No doubt some may dismiss this as some sort of conspiracy mumbo-jumbo, however I find the evidence very interesting. Kinda hard to dispute science- Frank


Apr 23, 2009

640 Architects and Engineers Call for New 9/11 Investigation

Evidence of Explosives Found in Destruction of All 3 WTC High-Rises

AE911Truth to Display Evidence at National AIA Convention 4/30 — 5/2, Moscone Center
Press Conference/Speaking Engagement Saturday May 2 at 4 pm, Westin Market Street Hotel

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
Contact Phone: 510-292-4710
Site: AE911Truth.org
Email: Contact rg-aia at ae911truth.org
Berkeley, CA, April 23, 2009 — More than 640 Architects & Engineers for 9/11 Truth (AE911Truth) are calling for a new, independent investigation into the destruction of the World Trade Center high-rises. These building professionals cite evidence of explosive demolition at all three WTC high-rises on 9/11 and document the evidence at their website. Michael Heimbach, assistant director of the FBI's counterterrorism division, wrote that their claims and conclusion were "backed by thorough research and analysis."
AE911Truth will host exhibitor's information booth #2609 at this year's annual convention of the prestigious American Institute of Architects (AIA). The convention, with more than 800 exhibitors and more than 20,000 participating architects, will take place in San Francisco's Moscone Center, April 30-May 2.
read more...
Apr 22, 2009

Scientists Find Unignited Explosive Residues in WTC Dust

— Gregg Roberts

Red/Gray Chips Match Advanced Thermitic Materials Developed in US Government Labs

Berkeley, CA, April 23, 2009— A team of scientists that includes 9/11 luminaries Steven Jones, Kevin Ryan, and seven other authors from three countries announced this month the long-awaited publication of their 25-page article "Active Thermitic Material Discovered in Dust from the 9/11 World Trade Center Catastrophe."

The team analyzed dust samples that were collected from four locations near Ground Zero. One sample was collected ten minutes after the North Tower exploded, so it could not have been contaminated with particles from the cleanup efforts. All four samples contained the same unusual, tiny red/gray chips, which turned out to consist not only of the ingredients of conventional thermite but also carbon, silicon, and other elements.

The ingredients are all found in an ultra-fine-grained form that speeds the chemical reaction when the mixture is ignited. While conventional thermite is considered an incendiary, burning hot and fast at steel-melting 4500-degree temperatures, so-called "nano-thermite" or "super-thermite" mixtures can be explosive —
read more...

[SteamWake]

Truth.org..

[Kapitan_Phillips]

Interesting read

[SteamWake]

I dident see in their where the levels or concentration was mentioned.

Also wasent there a previous bombing attempt? Pretty sure there was. Possible residual traces? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1993_Wo...Center_bombing

Here is an interesting fact. Seawater has the same amount of trace elements in it no matter where the sample is taken. Be it the north pole or the south atlatic. These traces include nearly every base element and mineral found on earth. So without a good reference point it could be said that the seawater taken from Antartica came from Bermuda.

I read a news story last week about traces of cocaine and LSD found in the atmosphere in spain.

My point is if you look hard enough you can find a trace of just about anything, anywhere.

Had one more thought.

Now I dont know where the building materials for the WTC came from but that region was heavily contested in the 1700's many many battles were fought there with muskets, cannons and the likes. Could it be possible that the trace remains of all that black powder made it into the building materials?

[Torpex752]

Thats a thought I could see.

My problem is that the stuff they found matches the steel erosion that the 911 comission called unexplaned. Nanothermite is only used in construction demolition as it is man made. I find it very sad to find this actually, not overjoyed.

Combine that with the nearly free fall speed of all buildings and it lends merit to the probability that the planes & fire didnt bring the buildings down. Its not impossible, but I find it a little hard to believe that these engineers are completely wrong.

I dont support the govt did it theory, however I am curious why when I look at other catostrophic events involving steel structures failing, submarines not returning to the surface, ships hitting iceburgs, or airplanes crashing, the level of investigation and reconstruction to find out why was and remains much more intense and thorough then this event/situation.

I guess I feel it necessary to say that after serving in the US Submarine force for 20 years and having a "questioning attitude" instilled in me as a critical means of survival and proper way of conducting daily business, after looking at this event from both sides, I have a few unanswered questions. The questions I have are not rocket science, yet there is no sensible answer found to date in any "official" report. None that satifies my understandings.

Frank

[CaptainHaplo]

Carbon - naturally occuring element
Silicon - naturally occuring element

etc etc.

Now I am not saying don't ask questions, but sometimes people look too deeply for the answer when its laying in front of them.

Ever hear of a shistovite (sp)? Its a grain shaped material that is shock heated quartz. Usually only found in nuke craters.

The point here is you had high temps, massive pressures, loads of a large variety of "ingredient" materials (concrete, steel, fiberglass,etc other metals and suchvarious ). Chemistry and physics often go hand in hand, so it is NOT suprising that under the circumstances there could be "trace" concoctions created. Diamonds are superheated and compressed coal - its not unreasonable to assume that the vast pressures and temps involved in building collapses such as this would cause all kinds of "unexplained" reactions. After all - when building are brought down normally - everyone expects that there could be "traces" of explosive elements found. But who is to say all the various things used to build buildings dont contribute to those elements?

I can personally think of a number of "potentially explosive" elements used in building. The key here is that they are elements of a potential explosive - not an explosive waiting to go off. In their molecular form, with the right combinations - BOOM. Our understand of the molecular processes that occur when something that size comes down is so incomplete its not even funny.

The website you pointed to has repeatedly claimed that the US Government was responsible for 9/11. Instead of looking into other possibilities, they find "elements" and traces of things that support their view (at first glance) and then run with it. Thats not science, thats a political agenda.

I am not knocking asking questions, but I have issues with those (not you OP) that pick and choose the facts they present to the public to create a sentiment for political purposes.

BTW - who had the "forethought" to take a SOIL sample 10 MINUTES after the North Tower went down? What human would say "Oh god - there musta been 2000 people in there - I better take a soil sample instead of going and trying to help out!"? That right there shows that they are NOT being entirely forthright.

[Torpex752]

Good points, cant argue.

There are certain events that do not lend themselves to the definitions, explanations provided to us/me.

For instance, specifically; Days and weeks after we heard of reports of 'fires continuing to burn in the rubble" Back when i heard that I was ok with it. Then add into the equation, a film clip of the excavator pulling up a clump of molten steel, the fire chief telling his crew not to hit it with water because it will flash/steam and the operator wont be able to see what he's doing. The crew was within 50 feet of the stuff, if there was a fire hot enough to melt steel in the rubble, they would not be able to be that close. Steel requires @2500degF to melt. I personally have used a torch to cut steel, it takes an enormous amount of fuel to do this. These were class 'A" buildings, the stuff in them does not combine to produce this type of fuel/fire. It does not, it never has in the numerous steel high rise structure fires before of after 9/11. That molten steel that was present in the basement of both towers and WTC 7 does not belong there based on my experience with steel for a number of years. The fire codes wont allow enough combustables, to melt steel.

So, lets go with the natural elements combining to form nano thermite, and somehow the stuff in the buildings combined into an element that could melt 5" thick steel (the thickness of the 47 steel colums in the base core of the towers), dont you think there would have been a nationwide revaluation/study to make sure that this stuff was not in every other high rise steel structure on the planet? I promise you I mean no malice in that statement, I am only going on the possibility you are right.
I was a facility manager for 5 years, and after 9/11 there were no changes at all to any of the national fire codes. So draw your own conclusions. As`I see it since every item is acceptable in an office high rise, its likelyhood of causing steel to melt is nil.

Now, the dust that was collected is suspect because it was collected within 10 min. I have to agree, seems odd. Maybe a better explanation is in order. Now, if we question that (logically) then should we not question the passport that survived the crash? it is equally odd dont you agree that a paper and plastic passport could survive the fireball/crash, but other things didnt. Not being argumentative, but I am willing to accept that piece of evidence on faith, then the dust deserves the same consideration, yes?

I certainly dont like the negative spin that the word conspiracy theory has. On one hand some of the groups immediately point the finger which leads us to look at them like nuts. However, if you dont like how they say it, then just look at what they are saying. The A/E group seems to be focusing on the premise that;
1-The towers were designed and built to withstand exactly what happened, yet the fell.
2-They are not saying who, just that whomever it was had to have access to the structural steel.

My feelings are that no theory of why/how those buildings fell should be chasticed. If someone came out and said the Titanic sank because the rivets were made of an inferior grade/mix of steel, people would listen, test, evaluate, and give an answer. They wouldnt call them names, conspiracy nuts, liars or anything else. Now if they came out and said that the rivets failed and we found out that White Star Lines bought them from a company in Germany, we might see things reacted to differently.

The debunking of the A/E I have seen is poorly done in my opinion and doesnt specifically adress the claims to a point in all cases.

Either way I can see facts that need better explanation. The truth lies somewhere in the middle as I see it now.

(I am a stickler for factual hard evidence) Taking the reports the news gave me vs what I have looked for myself with my own two eyes and seen, now makes me wonder.

Frank

So this dust , would that compound be like that you get from some printers which are in widespread use

[Raptor1]

Originally Posted by CaptainHaplo

shistovite (sp)?

I'm sure you mean Stishovite

[Torpex752]

Unfortunately no, its man made.

"Abstract We have discovered distinctive red/gray chips in all the samples we have studied of the dust produced by the destruction of the World Trade Center. Examination of four of these samples, collected from separate sites, is reported in this paper. These red/gray chips show marked similarities in all four samples. One sample was collected by a Manhattan resident about ten minutes after the collapse of the second WTC Tower, two the next day, and a fourth about a week later. The properties of these chips were analyzed using optical microscopy, scanning electron microscopy (SEM), X-ray energy dispersive spectroscopy (XEDS), and differential scanning calorimetry (DSC). The red material contains grains approximately 100 nm across which are largely iron oxide, while aluminum is contained in tiny plate-like structures. Separation of components using methyl ethyl ketone demonstrated that elemental aluminum is present. The iron oxide and aluminum are intimately mixed in the red material. When ignited in a DSC device the chips exhibit large but narrow exotherms occurring at approximately 430 °C, far below the normal ignition temperature for conventional thermite. Numerous iron-rich spheres are clearly observed in the residue following the ignition of these peculiar red/gray chips. The red portion of these chips is found to be an unreacted thermitic material and highly energetic."

Frank

[SteamWake]

The word 'exotherm' rang a bell.

Exothermic welding is actually quite common in use of electrical construction, espically in lightning protection systems and grounding systems.

http://www.exothermicwelds.com/index...st&iCategory=3

Its presence in such a large structure does not supprise me one bit.

[Torpex752]

Because of the good electrical conductivity and high stability in the face of short-circuit pulses, exothermic welds are one of the options specified by §250.8 of the United States National Electrical Code for grounding conductors and bonding jumpers.[4] It is the preferred method of bonding, and indeed it is the only acceptable means of bonding copper to galvanized cable.[3]

Well, IMO, its possible, but not probable to find nano thermite material as a result of any exothermic welding. Not saying its inpossible, but the flux you are referring to would have to be cleaned up after the process was complete. The likelyhood of finding it nearly 30 years after the building was built is slim. Additionally, any bonding that required that level of connection would have been where the main power substation and transformers were, far below in the basement.

Frank

[SteamWake]

What level of concentration, or did I miss that?

[Torpex752]

They didnt list a specific concentration.

I think the issue is that nano or superthermite is not the same stuff.

Its in the "Thermite" family, but its specific applications are limited.

Thats what makes this pretty upsetting, its a specific type of thermite, not like what you mentioned, unfortunately. It very unique. Its production is even classified in some applications.

Frank

[AVGWarhawk]

Just a thought and I do not know if it was mentioned anywhere, the towers were attacked twice I believe and specifially in the parking garage. These are the known attacks. What about possible attacks that did not go off as planned. In other words, explosives placed but never detonated for whatever reason? This material now found after the tower clean up. I think it is a distinct possibility. People have been attempting to blow up the towers since Clinton. Do you think that is a plausible cause for finding this material at the site?