a shocking CCTV video about violence in a bus.

HunterICX · 04-13-09, 06:55 AM

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=843_1238976341

the video really shocked me , also by disbelief for what I see.

So this can happen like that?
why are the others not helping, together your stronger then these punks
or is the usual ''meh, its not my problem so I don't care''

this kind of senseless violence caused by scumbags on the street I read almost every day..violence is busses, fighting with ambulance crew which where called to help a victim.
and nothing really is be done against it.
at least nothing serious to make it stop.

HunterICX

AVGWarhawk · 04-13-09, 07:32 AM

This is why some folks do not belong in the gene pool. It is a shame that these things happen....and daily. All you can hope for is that one day the instigators pick the wrong person to screw with and they get the butts handed to them.

Skybird · 04-13-09, 08:23 AM

The result of too less education and/or too much pedagogics and missing deterrance of the legal system.

The symptom of bystanders and groups witnessing a crime not doing anything, not even calling help, is not new to social psychology. Even murder could happen with people just looking, doing nothing.

Concerning myself, I learned by experience that the more people are around me, the less help I could expect in case I would need help. the bigger the group, the more rason the individual has to assume tha he/she doesnot count, and any of the other would do something. But today, our societies also live by the principle of cowardice, and de facto weakness. Responsibility is delegated to others, and is handed over to institutions. If you pick up respinsibility yourself, you couldf even end up seeing yourself in conflict with the law, and social standards.

It makes me sick. qweakness is no virtue, and no sign of civilisation. It never is anything else but - weakness. Many of us feel the lack there is. That'S why it gives us a feeling of satisfaction to celebrate non-conformist people that dare to violate the expected victim-role, and that we then label as "heroes", like the captain and that crew of that US freighter that just got hijacked and where the crew fought back instead of turning into a flock of sheep.

P.S. The Public Transportation Service BVG in Berlin has many dozens of cases from the past months only where juveniles attacked the bus drivers, beat and kicked them, spitting at them, pulling their hairs, etc. Often it is filmed via cellphones. It has become an epidemic problem in Berlin. They now have started to add plexiglass "armour" around the driver's cabin in busses.

there is more behind it as if it could be solved by courts alone. It is reaching deep into our rotting societies and failing social standards that are the symptom of our falling civilisation.

Onkel Neal · 04-13-09, 08:53 AM

Hmm... I couldn't tell who started it? The dope with the scarf (wearing a scarf in public, isn't that asking for trouble?

) appears to go over to white hoodie and then drags him to the ground...

At one point, one bystander trips one of the thugs, and gets punched in the face. Then he gets another punch as the thug is leaving.

Problem with the others not helping, half of them are women, and they only get in a fighting mood if you mess with their money. Another problem with getting involved, you jump in the middle of something like that, next thing you know the knives come out and you're slashed and stabbed to death. Oh yeah, and most people are nice, normal people without enough aggression to be effective fighters.

All it takes if one CHL carrier to shot that down with a bang. Where's Bernie Goetz when you need him?

Schroeder · 04-13-09, 09:36 AM

I didn't watch the clip but by the reactions here I can guess what it is about. Well, there is a simple answer why no one is helping. Can you be sure that the guy next to you will help too? Or will you face those thugs all alone? As long as you can't be sure that the others will stand by your side you should think twice before trying to help someone. What good is bravery if you end up dead or heavily injured because all the others continued to look the other way? Let alone that a lot of people are not in a fighting shape (me included). I could only serve as an extra sandbag in such a situation.

My question is more, what makes people so aggressive these days? There is no limit any more in the use of violence. People get beaten to death for minor things or nothing at all.

Sometimes my species is making me sick.

Dowly · 04-13-09, 10:11 AM

Those gits are obviously way drunk or high on something, especially the wanker in the white hoody. Drag them behind the sauna and put a round to their heads. ****ing idiots.

EDIT: Ow and Neal, if you watch closely when the git in the green adidas thingy goes to the guy in scarf the first time, you can see the other ****face in the white hoody takes something out of the scarf's pocket. And you can see the scarf trying to search for it before realising the white bossum took it.

HunterICX · 04-13-09, 10:37 AM

They took his wallet, and when he tried to get it back hell broke lose.

HunterICX

Kapitan_Phillips · 04-13-09, 10:40 AM

Thats an occassion when I would have intervened. Sure there may have been knives, but there's a line.

SpeedyPC · 04-13-09, 10:45 AM

Welcome to the real world and trust no one unless otherwise.

Frame57 · 04-13-09, 10:46 AM

Where is Billy Jack when you need him?

Onkel Neal · 04-13-09, 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frame57

Where is Billy Jack when you need him?

+10!

Onkel Neal · 04-13-09, 11:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dowly

Those gits are obviously way drunk or high on something, especially the wanker in the white hoody. Drag them behind the sauna and put a round to their heads. ****ing idiots.

EDIT: Ow and Neal, if you watch closely when the git in the green adidas thingy goes to the guy in scarf the first time, you can see the other ****face in the white hoody takes something out of the scarf's pocket. And you can see the scarf trying to search for it before realising the white bossum took it.

Ah, I see. One thing I noted for sure, I would never stand with my back to people like Scarfy. That's just dumb. Even at the end, he has his guard down.

I agree with Schroeder, it's hard for most people to get involved, they know that could lead to serious pain, injury, and death. And they don't know if they will be alone in stepping forward. When they have time to talk and formulate a plan, like the heroes on United 93, they can do incredibly brave things.

UnderseaLcpl · 04-13-09, 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skybird

Concerning myself, I learned by experience that the more people are around me, the less help I could expect in case I would need help. the bigger the group, the more rason the individual has to assume tha he/she doesnot count, and any of the other would do something. But today, our societies also live by the principle of cowardice, and de facto weakness. Responsibility is delegated to others, and is handed over to institutions. If you pick up respinsibility yourself, you couldf even end up seeing yourself in conflict with the law, and social standards.

I totally agree. Individual responsibility is key, even in the area of personal security. Somehow, though, I think you'll disagree with my assertion that such an incident would have not occurred or would have been less severe if one or more of the passengers had been armed. I do not intend to turn this into another gun policy debate, but I'd like your opinion on how prevalent private ownership of weapons might have affected such a situation.
I promise I won't answer your post with a barrage of counter-arguments, I'm just trying to se where you would draw the line on individual responsibility.

porphy · 04-13-09, 01:14 PM

That's terrible stuff.

They all seem very drunk, and that includes the victim. It's a really bad idea to be very drunk, alone and male. (and with your radar totally shut down, as Neal pointed out) That combination means a very real risk to get into all kinds of trouble at night and a high risk of being a victim to robbery and violence.

It's not easy to defuse a gang like that, that would need coordinated action of some kind. If you do anything alone they will have a go at you all at the same time. You can see a few persons protesting and trying to hold things back, but you can't talk to guys like these cause they punch anyone who oppose them. So that means it's all or nothing, a few of equal size and very quick and determined guys, preferably not drunk as people are terrible at fighting when drunk, could contain these idiots. But that won't happen very often unfortunately.

I remember once riding the tram when a drunk man started to verbally abuse me. I refused to give in to his insults and threats and I didn't move. He was clearly threatening, although I wasn't afraid as I was totally sober and this man had problems even walking, so a fight would have been a joke. The point is, no one did a thing for 5-10 minutes. No signs of support at all. The person next to me just upped the volume of the mp3 player... People simply ignored what was going on, because if they said something they feared to be the next target of this guy... Eventually this very old lady with her handbag in her lap had had enough and told this guy to shut up!

She was the only one that did or said anything! All my respect to her. At the end of the day I actually felt more like telling the other fellow commuters how incredible spineless they were, rather than jump on the abuser...

A gun in a bus with drunk and scared people in the way? I don't know if it's a good idea really... I can't imagine it is that easy to control something like that with a gun, and if you act on your own, who knows if someone else pulls out a gun. But it's certainly better than people end up getting kicked to death or get severely handicapped for the rest of their lives by a bunch of scum bags.

cheers porphy

Jimbuna · 04-13-09, 03:53 PM

The scum of society....every country has such an element.

It's just a pity there weren't a male group of law abiding males sitting at the rear to even the odds a little.

04-13-09, 06:55 AM	#1
HunterICX Rear Admiral Join Date: May 2006 Location: Malaga, España Posts: 10,750 Downloads: 8 Uploads: 0	a shocking CCTV video about violence in a bus. http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=843_1238976341 the video really shocked me , also by disbelief for what I see. So this can happen like that? why are the others not helping, together your stronger then these punks or is the usual ''meh, its not my problem so I don't care'' this kind of senseless violence caused by scumbags on the street I read almost every day..violence is busses, fighting with ambulance crew which where called to help a victim. and nothing really is be done against it. at least nothing serious to make it stop. HunterICX __________________

04-13-09, 07:32 AM	#2
AVGWarhawk Lucky Jack Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: In a 1954 Buick. Posts: 28,253 Downloads: 90 Uploads: 0	This is why some folks do not belong in the gene pool. It is a shame that these things happen....and daily. All you can hope for is that one day the instigators pick the wrong person to screw with and they get the butts handed to them. __________________ “You're painfully alive in a drugged and dying culture.” ― Richard Yates, Revolutionary Road

04-13-09, 08:23 AM	#3
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 42,604 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	The result of too less education and/or too much pedagogics and missing deterrance of the legal system. The symptom of bystanders and groups witnessing a crime not doing anything, not even calling help, is not new to social psychology. Even murder could happen with people just looking, doing nothing. Concerning myself, I learned by experience that the more people are around me, the less help I could expect in case I would need help. the bigger the group, the more rason the individual has to assume tha he/she doesnot count, and any of the other would do something. But today, our societies also live by the principle of cowardice, and de facto weakness. Responsibility is delegated to others, and is handed over to institutions. If you pick up respinsibility yourself, you couldf even end up seeing yourself in conflict with the law, and social standards. It makes me sick. qweakness is no virtue, and no sign of civilisation. It never is anything else but - weakness. Many of us feel the lack there is. That'S why it gives us a feeling of satisfaction to celebrate non-conformist people that dare to violate the expected victim-role, and that we then label as "heroes", like the captain and that crew of that US freighter that just got hijacked and where the crew fought back instead of turning into a flock of sheep. P.S. The Public Transportation Service BVG in Berlin has many dozens of cases from the past months only where juveniles attacked the bus drivers, beat and kicked them, spitting at them, pulling their hairs, etc. Often it is filmed via cellphones. It has become an epidemic problem in Berlin. They now have started to add plexiglass "armour" around the driver's cabin in busses. there is more behind it as if it could be solved by courts alone. It is reaching deep into our rotting societies and failing social standards that are the symptom of our falling civilisation. __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert. Last edited by Skybird; 04-13-09 at 10:33 AM.

04-13-09, 08:53 AM	#4
Onkel Neal Born to Run Silent Join Date: Jan 1997 Location: Cougar Trap, Texas Posts: 21,383 Downloads: 541 Uploads: 224	Hmm... I couldn't tell who started it? The dope with the scarf (wearing a scarf in public, isn't that asking for trouble? ) appears to go over to white hoodie and then drags him to the ground... At one point, one bystander trips one of the thugs, and gets punched in the face. Then he gets another punch as the thug is leaving. Problem with the others not helping, half of them are women, and they only get in a fighting mood if you mess with their money. Another problem with getting involved, you jump in the middle of something like that, next thing you know the knives come out and you're slashed and stabbed to death. Oh yeah, and most people are nice, normal people without enough aggression to be effective fighters. All it takes if one CHL carrier to shot that down with a bang. Where's Bernie Goetz when you need him? __________________ SUBSIM - 26 Years on the Web

04-13-09, 09:36 AM	#5
Schroeder Navy Seal Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Banana Republic of Germany Posts: 6,170 Downloads: 62 Uploads: 0	I didn't watch the clip but by the reactions here I can guess what it is about. Well, there is a simple answer why no one is helping. Can you be sure that the guy next to you will help too? Or will you face those thugs all alone? As long as you can't be sure that the others will stand by your side you should think twice before trying to help someone. What good is bravery if you end up dead or heavily injured because all the others continued to look the other way? Let alone that a lot of people are not in a fighting shape (me included). I could only serve as an extra sandbag in such a situation. My question is more, what makes people so aggressive these days? There is no limit any more in the use of violence. People get beaten to death for minor things or nothing at all. Sometimes my species is making me sick. __________________ Putting Germ back into Germany.

04-13-09, 10:11 AM	#6
Dowly Lucky Jack Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Finland Posts: 25,052 Downloads: 32 Uploads: 0	Those gits are obviously way drunk or high on something, especially the wanker in the white hoody. Drag them behind the sauna and put a round to their heads. **ing idiots. EDIT: Ow and Neal, if you watch closely when the git in the green adidas thingy goes to the guy in scarf the first time, you can see the other **face in the white hoody takes something out of the scarf's pocket. And you can see the scarf trying to search for it before realising the white bossum took it.

04-13-09, 10:37 AM	#7
HunterICX Rear Admiral Join Date: May 2006 Location: Malaga, España Posts: 10,750 Downloads: 8 Uploads: 0	They took his wallet, and when he tried to get it back hell broke lose. HunterICX __________________

04-13-09, 10:40 AM	#8
Kapitan_Phillips Silent Hunter Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Swansea Posts: 3,903 Downloads: 204 Uploads: 0	Thats an occassion when I would have intervened. Sure there may have been knives, but there's a line. __________________ Well, here's another nice mess you've gotten me into.

04-13-09, 10:45 AM	#9
SpeedyPC Officer Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 241 Downloads: 67 Uploads: 0	Welcome to the real world and trust no one unless otherwise.

04-13-09, 10:46 AM	#10
Frame57 Sea Lord Join Date: May 2008 Location: 1300 feet on the crapper Posts: 1,860 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	Where is Billy Jack when you need him? __________________ "My Religion consists of a humble admiration of the illimitable superior spirit who reveals himself in the slight details we are able to perceive with our frail and feeble minds." Albert Einstein

04-13-09, 01:14 PM	#14
porphy Commodore Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Sweden Posts: 603 Downloads: 4 Uploads: 0	That's terrible stuff. They all seem very drunk, and that includes the victim. It's a really bad idea to be very drunk, alone and male. (and with your radar totally shut down, as Neal pointed out) That combination means a very real risk to get into all kinds of trouble at night and a high risk of being a victim to robbery and violence. It's not easy to defuse a gang like that, that would need coordinated action of some kind. If you do anything alone they will have a go at you all at the same time. You can see a few persons protesting and trying to hold things back, but you can't talk to guys like these cause they punch anyone who oppose them. So that means it's all or nothing, a few of equal size and very quick and determined guys, preferably not drunk as people are terrible at fighting when drunk, could contain these idiots. But that won't happen very often unfortunately. I remember once riding the tram when a drunk man started to verbally abuse me. I refused to give in to his insults and threats and I didn't move. He was clearly threatening, although I wasn't afraid as I was totally sober and this man had problems even walking, so a fight would have been a joke. The point is, no one did a thing for 5-10 minutes. No signs of support at all. The person next to me just upped the volume of the mp3 player... People simply ignored what was going on, because if they said something they feared to be the next target of this guy... Eventually this very old lady with her handbag in her lap had had enough and told this guy to shut up! She was the only one that did or said anything! All my respect to her. At the end of the day I actually felt more like telling the other fellow commuters how incredible spineless they were, rather than jump on the abuser... A gun in a bus with drunk and scared people in the way? I don't know if it's a good idea really... I can't imagine it is that easy to control something like that with a gun, and if you act on your own, who knows if someone else pulls out a gun. But it's certainly better than people end up getting kicked to death or get severely handicapped for the rest of their lives by a bunch of scum bags. cheers porphy __________________ "The only remedy for madness is the innocence of facts." O. Mirbeu "A paranoid is simply someone in possession of all the facts." W. B. Last edited by porphy; 04-13-09 at 04:02 PM.

04-13-09, 03:53 PM	#15
Jimbuna Chief of the Boat Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: 250 metres below the surface Posts: 190,473 Downloads: 63 Uploads: 13	The scum of society....every country has such an element. It's just a pity there weren't a male group of law abiding males sitting at the rear to even the odds a little. __________________ Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because they have to say something. Oh my God, not again!!