Bloodthirsty Americans....

Bulkhead · 03-24-09, 04:13 PM

Dont get me wrong, its for this thread i called it bloodthirsty americans. The japanese was probably equals.
Well, anyway. Isnt this proof (looks real!?!) of that there was bloodspill on both side of the war? Shooting humans drifting helpless like that is far beyond war if you ask me.
War is hell

FIREWALL · 03-24-09, 04:33 PM

Yeah. I would guess US sailors weren't to sympathectic to Japanese after Dec 7 1941

Rip · 03-24-09, 04:33 PM

You can't know without having lived it. The dynamics of compassion are far to complex to understand from a highly edited clip fest. There are several good books that do a good job of communicating the moral struggles that were faced by every man from top to bottom on both sideas. But keep in mind that no matter what you thought when your commander( no matter whether Japanese or American or any other nation in WWII) said shoot those unarmed combatants. You either did so or were shot yourself. A lot was learned about morals and war on all sides in all theaters. Probably best we resist judging to diligently without having lived the troubled times of which we speak. Truly horrible things were cast upon humanity from all sides involved. But even that often was created from the absolute noblest of intentions.

Quote:

"Judge not, that ye be not judged. For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again. And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye? Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye? Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye" (Matthew 7:1-5).

Max2147 · 03-24-09, 04:50 PM

As far as I'm aware, there was only one incident each for the Germans, Americans, and British where submariners deliberately killed shipwrecked survivors.

The German commander was executed after the war as a war criminal. The American commander (Mush Morton) probably lost a shot at the Medal of Honor for his actions but wasn't otherwise punished (he was later killed in action). The British commander survived the war and won the Victoria Cross.

All the combatants gave their submarines orders to not assist shipwrecked crews.

Task Force · 03-24-09, 04:53 PM

Yea. The japanease also do stuff like this. (remember reading something about a liberty ship and a japanease sub.)

Bulkhead · 03-24-09, 04:55 PM

Oh yes, no doubt that there is alot to think about when it comes to war, dont get me wrong, but i just find the clip interesting. Just came over some info of why they did this....one japanese floating in the water that was picked up and taken below deck did in several accations blow them selves up with a handgrenade and took with them....who knows....
War is hell, thats for sure. And i do respect every soldier who fights for hes country.

Bulkhead · 03-24-09, 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Max2147

As far as I'm aware, there was only one incident each for the Germans, Americans, and British where submariners deliberately killed shipwrecked survivors.

The German commander was executed after the war as a war criminal. The American commander (Mush Morton) probably lost a shot at the Medal of Honor for his actions but wasn't otherwise punished (he was later killed in action). The British commander survived the war and won the Victoria Cross.

All the combatants gave their submarines orders to not assist shipwrecked crews.

"Not assist shipwrecked crews" as in "kill them". they are obviously very close related orders

Loud_Silence · 03-24-09, 05:43 PM

There is no "nation of monsters." Only individuals are monsters or heroes. But when a monster comes to power, **** happens.

Nisgeis · 03-24-09, 05:58 PM

That clip is heavily editted and the clips do not seem to be from the same sub. For example, at the start, they are manning a 4/50" bow deck gun and the next shot they are firing a 5/25" stern mounted deck gun. The shot of the sub firing at the sinking ship, doesn't look like a standard fleet boat sub, it looks like it's been modified and if anything it looks like it's firing rockets at the target. There's no actual shot of a guy shooting and then a pan to the victim in the water. The people shooting out to sea with rifles are generally shooting far too high to be shooting at the people depicted floating in the water.

The one shot that does look like it could have been a shooting is the one where the guy has a grenade he's trying to throw. That particular clip looks like it's been shot from a destroyer, as the equipment and structure don't match a fleet boat and nor does the decking.

Just a few edits and the next YouTube sensation: US Sub kills Bambi.

Morpheus · 03-24-09, 06:35 PM

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Color_TV

dont belive every crap you see on internet

//EDIT: but i am sure this happens in every war somehow somewhere ...

Max2147 · 03-24-09, 06:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bulkhead

"Not assist shipwrecked crews" as in "kill them". they are obviously very close related orders

Like I said, there was only one documented case for each country of a submarine crew deliberately killing shipwrecked crews.

Ivan Putski · 03-24-09, 07:29 PM

More of a mercy killing than anything else, they are not about to bring them aboard, shooting them out right is better than floating around dying from the eliments, or being eaten alive by sharks. There`s dozens of incidents of this nature, nothing new.

Kapitan_Phillips · 03-24-09, 07:37 PM

We've had a great many discussions about this subject, and all of them ended up turning as sour as a sour lemon on a bed of sour grapes served at sour hour.

Gonna close this one for now, gentlemen.

03-24-09, 04:13 PM	#1
Bulkhead 中国水兵 Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Norway, Hordaland Posts: 279 Downloads: 153 Uploads: 0	Bloodthirsty Americans.... Dont get me wrong, its for this thread i called it bloodthirsty americans. The japanese was probably equals. Well, anyway. Isnt this proof (looks real!?!) of that there was bloodspill on both side of the war? Shooting humans drifting helpless like that is far beyond war if you ask me. War is hell __________________ KHJ

03-24-09, 04:33 PM	#2
FIREWALL Eternal Patrol Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: CATALINA IS. SO . CAL USA Posts: 10,108 Downloads: 511 Uploads: 0	Yeah. I would guess US sailors weren't to sympathectic to Japanese after Dec 7 1941 __________________ RIP FIREWALL I Play GWX. Silent Hunter Who ???

03-24-09, 04:53 PM	#5
Task Force Rear Admiral Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: SPACE!!!! Posts: 10,142 Downloads: 85 Uploads: 0	Yea. The japanease also do stuff like this. (remember reading something about a liberty ship and a japanease sub.) __________________ Task Force industries "Taking control of the world, one mind at a time"

03-24-09, 04:55 PM	#6
Bulkhead 中国水兵 Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Norway, Hordaland Posts: 279 Downloads: 153 Uploads: 0	Oh yes, no doubt that there is alot to think about when it comes to war, dont get me wrong, but i just find the clip interesting. Just came over some info of why they did this....one japanese floating in the water that was picked up and taken below deck did in several accations blow them selves up with a handgrenade and took with them....who knows.... War is hell, thats for sure. And i do respect every soldier who fights for hes country. __________________ KHJ

03-24-09, 05:58 PM	#9
Nisgeis Ocean Warrior Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 2,909 Downloads: 77 Uploads: 11	That clip is heavily editted and the clips do not seem to be from the same sub. For example, at the start, they are manning a 4/50" bow deck gun and the next shot they are firing a 5/25" stern mounted deck gun. The shot of the sub firing at the sinking ship, doesn't look like a standard fleet boat sub, it looks like it's been modified and if anything it looks like it's firing rockets at the target. There's no actual shot of a guy shooting and then a pan to the victim in the water. The people shooting out to sea with rifles are generally shooting far too high to be shooting at the people depicted floating in the water. The one shot that does look like it could have been a shooting is the one where the guy has a grenade he's trying to throw. That particular clip looks like it's been shot from a destroyer, as the equipment and structure don't match a fleet boat and nor does the decking. Just a few edits and the next YouTube sensation: US Sub kills Bambi. __________________ -------------------------------- This space left intentionally blank.

03-24-09, 04:50 PM	#4
Max2147 Seasoned Skipper Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 714 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	As far as I'm aware, there was only one incident each for the Germans, Americans, and British where submariners deliberately killed shipwrecked survivors. The German commander was executed after the war as a war criminal. The American commander (Mush Morton) probably lost a shot at the Medal of Honor for his actions but wasn't otherwise punished (he was later killed in action). The British commander survived the war and won the Victoria Cross. All the combatants gave their submarines orders to not assist shipwrecked crews.

03-24-09, 05:43 PM	#8
Loud_Silence Planesman Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 193 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	There is no "nation of monsters." Only individuals are monsters or heroes. But when a monster comes to power, **** happens.

03-24-09, 06:35 PM	#10
Morpheus Ensign Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 234 Downloads: 17 Uploads: 0	http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Color_TV dont belive every crap you see on internet //EDIT: but i am sure this happens in every war somehow somewhere ...

03-24-09, 07:29 PM	#12
Ivan Putski Captain Join Date: May 2005 Location: Memphis, Tn. U.S.A. Posts: 548 Downloads: 21 Uploads: 0	More of a mercy killing than anything else, they are not about to bring them aboard, shooting them out right is better than floating around dying from the eliments, or being eaten alive by sharks. There`s dozens of incidents of this nature, nothing new. __________________ " Is He?..........Yeah..........Nothing Moving, But His Watch."

03-24-09, 07:37 PM	#13
Kapitan_Phillips Silent Hunter Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Swansea Posts: 3,903 Downloads: 204 Uploads: 0	We've had a great many discussions about this subject, and all of them ended up turning as sour as a sour lemon on a bed of sour grapes served at sour hour. Gonna close this one for now, gentlemen. __________________ Well, here's another nice mess you've gotten me into.