hopeless ASW - how is a guy supposed to get killed here?

Keelbuster · 02-05-09, 05:33 PM

I've been testing out the AI for the purposes of training myself in evasion. I created a scenario where I'm detected by 4 Captain class DDs (crew set to Elite), in perfectly still water, june 1944. They proceed to asdic me and hunt me, doing DC run after DC run. Sadly, they can't score a hit. I'm driving along at 2kts at 100m, without silent running on. They've scored a few grazes, with minor damage, but nothing serious. I haven't even been taking evasive action - just driving along in a straight line. They've pinged right up until they're attack run, meaning they should have perfect information on me. Still, they can't seem to connect. I'm disappointed since they are so poor under perfect ASW conditions. They've been at it for over an hour, maybe 20 or 30 DC runs with hedgehogs, and no major hits.

I'm using GWX 3.0 with longer repair times mod. I was doing this 'training' in order to get used to the new damage model. Sadly, I can't seem to receive any damage. Worse, when I drop down to 165m, they lose me instantly - no asdic, they seem completely blind.

Anyone else notice this sort of pathetic ASW performance? I wonder if the LRT mod might have changed ASW behaviour? This might affect their detection abilities (I seem to remember that in previous mod setups - like earlier GWX, asdic could find you at a 165m), but not the precision on their basic DC attack, right? These guys can't seem to drop the cans on me. They're either the wrong depth, or more commonly, the DCs are dropped right on me so that by the time they go off, I've moved on (even at 2kts!). What they need to do is drive over me and drop them in front of my path, at my depth. Anybody else finding it hard to get killed?

FIREWALL · 02-05-09, 05:54 PM

More like the other way around for me.

in 43 I had a flower corvette that had an unlimited amount of dc's and stayed on me it seemed forever.

I went to 200m and silent running with a zigzag and that sucker stuck to me like glue.

Lanzfeld · 02-05-09, 06:14 PM

KeelBuster,

Are you, by chance, using SH-3 Commander in these tests?

If you are, maybe there is a "thermal layer" above you put in by SH-3 Commander.

Keelbuster · 02-05-09, 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lanzfeld

KeelBuster,

Are you, by chance, using SH-3 Commander in these tests?

If you are, maybe there is a "thermal layer" above you put in by SH-3 Commander.

Oh wow - good point. I didn't think of that. I'll check out SH3 commander when back to port. It really did feel like a thermal layer (I started asking myself if maybe it _was_ more realistic to disappear like that

. That might affect my detection problem, but what about my bonehead DD behaviour problem?

FIREWALL · 02-05-09, 07:42 PM

Is the thermal layer in SHC something you activate or is it just done by default ?

mx · 02-05-09, 08:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FIREWALL

Is the thermal layer in SHC something you activate or is it just done by default ?

it's in random_events.cfg in cfg folder at sh3cmdr location but i have no idea how to edit it to, for example, set the thermal layer to 200m or so..

FIREWALL · 02-05-09, 08:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mx

Quote:

Originally Posted by FIREWALL

Is the thermal layer in SHC something you activate or is it just done by default ?

it's in random_events.cfg in cfg folder at sh3cmdr location but i have no idea how to edit it to, for example, set the thermal layer to 200m or so..

@ mx Found it, opened it, looked at the thermal layer part and.... couldn't make heads nor tails of it.

BasilY · 02-05-09, 08:10 PM

DD in 44 is very lethal in GWX 2.1. Even with themal layer (which is rarely above 150 meters, I think), being at 100 meter should be VERY dangerous.

Weiss Pinguin · 02-05-09, 09:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mx

Quote:

Originally Posted by FIREWALL

Is the thermal layer in SHC something you activate or is it just done by default ?

it's in random_events.cfg in cfg folder at sh3cmdr location but i have no idea how to edit it to, for example, set the thermal layer to 200m or so..

The thermal layer is on by default with SH3, and it sets the layer to a random depth everytime you run SH3.

Keelbuster · 02-05-09, 09:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BasilY

DD in 44 is very lethal in GWX 2.1. Even with themal layer (which is rarely above 150 meters, I think), being at 100 meter should be VERY dangerous.

Yea - I was running at 100m, and clearly above any thermal layer because they were pinging me actively, and seemed to know where i was (making DC runs overtop of me). However, with no evasion whatsoever on my part, they weren't able to sink me - much less score a direct hit, and again, probably over about 20 or 30 DC runs.

mx · 02-05-09, 10:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keelbuster

Quote:

Originally Posted by BasilY

DD in 44 is very lethal in GWX 2.1. Even with themal layer (which is rarely above 150 meters, I think), being at 100 meter should be VERY dangerous.

Yea - I was running at 100m, and clearly above any thermal layer because they were pinging me actively, and seemed to know where i was (making DC runs overtop of me). However, with no evasion whatsoever on my part, they weren't able to sink me - much less score a direct hit, and again, probably over about 20 or 30 DC runs.

DD's are charging you're last known/current location, and when you're at 100m even at 2knt speec, by the time the DC's reach that depth you're gone. my guess is that in sh3 there is no coded behaviour that, well, predicts where you'll be in, let's say next 3-5 minutes. what i'm trying to say is: if i were a DD i would crap all over your current location, as well as further to it, at your last known course, but the sh3 DD's stop droping Depth charges after a 30-50m lenght or so, short bursts of depth charching and they turn arround

A Very Super Market · 02-05-09, 10:45 PM

Try setting the ship to veteran, elite may cause a bit of problems.

GoldenRivet · 02-06-09, 12:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A Very Super Market

Try setting the ship to veteran, elite may cause a bit of problems.

correct.

set the AI to veteran, run SH3 without running SH3 commander and try the test again.

you'll wish you didnt.

Keelbuster · 02-06-09, 12:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoldenRivet

Quote:

Originally Posted by A Very Super Market

Try setting the ship to veteran, elite may cause a bit of problems.

correct.

set the AI to veteran, run SH3 without running SH3 commander and try the test again.

you'll wish you didnt.

Ok - will sober up and try this asap. Thx.

BasilY · 02-06-09, 02:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keelbuster

Quote:

Originally Posted by BasilY

DD in 44 is very lethal in GWX 2.1. Even with themal layer (which is rarely above 150 meters, I think), being at 100 meter should be VERY dangerous.

Yea - I was running at 100m, and clearly above any thermal layer because they were pinging me actively, and seemed to know where i was (making DC runs overtop of me). However, with no evasion whatsoever on my part, they weren't able to sink me - much less score a direct hit, and again, probably over about 20 or 30 DC runs.

Even if they can't sunk you with depth charges, how are you going to re-supply oxygen if the DD's are on top of you?

02-05-09, 05:33 PM	#1
Keelbuster Ace of the Deep Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: BA 72 Posts: 1,092 Downloads: 43 Uploads: 0	hopeless ASW - how is a guy supposed to get killed here? I've been testing out the AI for the purposes of training myself in evasion. I created a scenario where I'm detected by 4 Captain class DDs (crew set to Elite), in perfectly still water, june 1944. They proceed to asdic me and hunt me, doing DC run after DC run. Sadly, they can't score a hit. I'm driving along at 2kts at 100m, without silent running on. They've scored a few grazes, with minor damage, but nothing serious. I haven't even been taking evasive action - just driving along in a straight line. They've pinged right up until they're attack run, meaning they should have perfect information on me. Still, they can't seem to connect. I'm disappointed since they are so poor under perfect ASW conditions. They've been at it for over an hour, maybe 20 or 30 DC runs with hedgehogs, and no major hits. I'm using GWX 3.0 with longer repair times mod. I was doing this 'training' in order to get used to the new damage model. Sadly, I can't seem to receive any damage. Worse, when I drop down to 165m, they lose me instantly - no asdic, they seem completely blind. Anyone else notice this sort of pathetic ASW performance? I wonder if the LRT mod might have changed ASW behaviour? This might affect their detection abilities (I seem to remember that in previous mod setups - like earlier GWX, asdic could find you at a 165m), but not the precision on their basic DC attack, right? These guys can't seem to drop the cans on me. They're either the wrong depth, or more commonly, the DCs are dropped right on me so that by the time they go off, I've moved on (even at 2kts!). What they need to do is drive over me and drop them in front of my path, at my depth. Anybody else finding it hard to get killed? __________________

02-05-09, 05:54 PM	#2
FIREWALL Eternal Patrol Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: CATALINA IS. SO . CAL USA Posts: 10,108 Downloads: 511 Uploads: 0	More like the other way around for me. in 43 I had a flower corvette that had an unlimited amount of dc's and stayed on me it seemed forever. I went to 200m and silent running with a zigzag and that sucker stuck to me like glue. __________________ RIP FIREWALL I Play GWX. Silent Hunter Who ???

02-05-09, 07:42 PM	#5
FIREWALL Eternal Patrol Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: CATALINA IS. SO . CAL USA Posts: 10,108 Downloads: 511 Uploads: 0	Is the thermal layer in SHC something you activate or is it just done by default ? __________________ RIP FIREWALL I Play GWX. Silent Hunter Who ???

02-05-09, 10:45 PM	#12
A Very Super Market The Old Man Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Deep in the Wild Canadian suburbs. Posts: 1,468 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Try setting the ship to veteran, elite may cause a bit of problems. __________________ The entire German garrison of Vanviken, right here in your thread!

02-05-09, 06:14 PM	#3
Lanzfeld Grey Wolf Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: New Tripoli, PA Posts: 994 Downloads: 64 Uploads: 0	KeelBuster, Are you, by chance, using SH-3 Commander in these tests? If you are, maybe there is a "thermal layer" above you put in by SH-3 Commander.

02-05-09, 08:10 PM	#8
BasilY Weps Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 359 Downloads: 4 Uploads: 0	DD in 44 is very lethal in GWX 2.1. Even with themal layer (which is rarely above 150 meters, I think), being at 100 meter should be VERY dangerous.