Hitler would be proud

I really think the the English goverment has lost the plot - Now the policewant to DNA database children as young as 5 if they misbehave so as to identify "Future Criminals" and the Goverment seems to think it's a good idea

http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599...67-401,00.html

Whats next , type kids by race to ID future terrorists , Neo nazi's or any other group that the police and goverment are worried or annoyed at?

sorry if the thread title offends but this is something that would've been fitted right into some of the nazi eugenic's programs..

[Kapitan_Phillips]

It doesnt offend me. This is why I'm getting out and having my kids someplace else.

[Yahoshua]

Looks like the U.S. is heading down the same road England is (we've got all 3 of our current candidates vying for the lead no less!!).

A small piece of land and the idea of my own little country sounds like a more attractive idea as the months go by.

[Knipper]

Tell you what Darius, it's the grown-ups who should be DNA'd so they can be identified as 'Future Criminal Parents'. My wife works with 'difficult' kids and she reckons it's easy to see how they got that way and 99 times out of a hundred, it's because their parent's don't give a toss about them. And you're right, we've lost the plot on the whole civil liberties thing. If I go into town (and Bath is a relatively small one) and stroll around for an hour, by the time I get back, I'll probably be on upwards of 50 CCTV camera's. They're even rolling out cameras that allow the operators to yell at you if you're spotted dropping litter or something (not as I do). I think if I was younger, I'd be on the same boat out of here as Kapitan Phillips. Anyway, I hear there are a load of jobs going at the Ministry of Truth for loyal Proles like me, so I think I'll stick around.

[Skybird]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gattaca

One of the most underrated and underestimated movies I know of. It matches the vision of "Blade Runner" nicely.

And somehow i feel this one
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equilibrium_%28film%29
aims for comparable things.

Sad, but impressive movies. Impressive, but sad.

[Knipper]

Can't say I've heard of either of those Skybird, but I'll certainly check them out. Thanks for the refs, they sound right up my street.

Incidentally, re Steed's quote which you now use for your signature, have you ever read 'A Canticle For Leibowitz', by Walter M Miller Jr? It's about that sort of thing, as well as being post-apocalypse. Sounds like it might be one for you.

[AntEater]

Seems the brits are way ahead of us in this one. It always amazes me how the very country that invented civil liberties is so hell bent on abolishing them.
CCTV in Germany is (sofar) limited to busy downtown metro stations and some squares.
The constitutional court has recently made some quite interesting decisions on public surveilance which should at least slow down the increase.

Generally, regardless of country, sometimes I ask myself:
Who's actually in favor of all this? I've never seen anyone either in real life nor in any kind of internet discussion who actually favored data mining, surveilance and all that.
Yet these measures increase year by year, despite being opposed by practically every educated citizen in every nation in question.
Of course there are the "tabloid reading uneducated masses", but these people are mostly indifferent and if you bother to ask them they're mostly opposed as well, regardless of what the tabloids tell them.
Who's the driving force behind this? The industry? Older generation politicians who can't handle progress? Is it preparation for a totalitarian society? I doubt it since today's politicians can't think long term.

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by AntEater

Seems the brits are way ahead of us in this one. It always amazes me how the very country that invented civil liberties is so hell bent on abolishing them.
CCTV in Germany is (sofar) limited to busy downtown metro stations and some squares.
The constitutional court has recently made some quite interesting decisions on public surveilance which should at least slow down the increase.

Generally, regardless of country, sometimes I ask myself:
Who's actually in favor of all this? I've never seen anyone either in real life nor in any kind of internet discussion who actually favored data mining, surveilance and all that.
Yet these measures increase year by year, despite being opposed by practically every educated citizen in every nation in question.
Of course there are the "tabloid reading uneducated masses", but these people are mostly indifferent and if you bother to ask them they're mostly opposed as well, regardless of what the tabloids tell them.
Who's the driving force behind this? The industry? Older generation politicians who can't handle progress? Is it preparation for a totalitarian society? I doubt it since today's politicians can't think long term.

I recommend to read Machiavelli: Discorsi, 1st book, chapter 2: "How many types of states there are, and to which the Roman state belongs" Reading that short chapter immediately reminded me of the questions you ask, and the way in which I see America having turned into a plutocracy, and Europe turning into an oligarchy, and all history of states and societies always seem to move in cycles.

I recommend the whole book in fact. I started to read it two weeks ago (already having red an in-depth biography about him longer time ago): a real eye-opener. Cannot understand that sinister reputation around the figure of Machiavelli. The guy was a reasonable thinker and an unerring observer - necessarily he comes to other conclusions by that than wishful dreamer and hopeful idealists. That's all sinistre about him. Admitted, realism sometimes leads you to tough conclusions, and that often is already too much for many. But that is their problem - not Machiavellis.

[kiwi_2005]

I could just see it now.

DNA data programed into human database with warning comments:

Asian born: Known to be bad tippers, will not accept a bargain when they say its 1 dollar its 1 dollar nothing less although more is sometimes accepted. Knows Kung fu staying at a distance is recommended, breeds like rabbits could be a possible future threat. Positives: Experts in tunnel warfare.

Black born: Has revolved over the centuries to become a simple hunter/gatherer to experts in their own enigma coded lanuguage known as Rap & masters at firing handguns sideways. Positives: Would make brilliant enemy vehicle hijackers.

White Born: Tends to drum into other races how supreme they are and if it wasn't for them your be all f**ked. Positives: If it wasn't for them we did all be f**ked.

Jewish Born: Rumor has it this race has discovered immorality hard to exterminate, not to be under-estimated attack them will only lead to heavy losses with no hope of a peaceful outcome. Avoid. Positives: Only real enemy is Satan. Threat very low unless Muslim or German.

German Born: Also class as White but once claim to be the Master race. Should be monitored 24/7. When they talk of peace war is about to commense. Masters at deceiving their own. Postives: Will support their leader right to the last man.

Kiwi Born: Greenpeace. Anti-nuclear. Extermination is recommended. :p

[Knipper]

Originally Posted by kiwi_2005

: Rumor has it this race has discovered immorality hard to exterminate, not to be under-estimated attack them will only lead to heavy losses with no hope of a peaceful outcome. Avoid. Positives: Only real enemy is Satan. Threat very low unless Muslim or German.

Err, shouldn't that be 'immortality'?

[Knipper]

American born: Negatives: Not to be trusted with money. Unreliable with intelligence about middle eastern countries, likely to mislead or even lie to their allies. Known for leaving it until the last minute before helping their friends out. Positives: They do a good St Patrick's day parade.:rotfl:

[August]

Originally Posted by Knipper

American born: Negatives: Not to be trusted with money. Unreliable with intelligence about middle eastern countries, likely to mislead or even lie to their allies. Known for leaving it until the last minute before helping their friends out. Positives: They do a good St Patrick's day parade.:rotfl:

I call foul! Other than the St. Patricks day parade that could describe any country.

[Knipper]

No way August, you are totally wrong. In the UK we dont lend people money if they can't.... oh well maybe we do. Well what about France or Germany? they don't er, well. OK, well listen chum, it's really hard to get a mortgage in Bukino Faso OK? Doesn't that prove my point huh? eh? Doesn't it'? Eh? Doesn't it? (Sinks into a corner sobbing because August is right but Knipper is unwilling to admit it.) Think I'll go sink some American ships...

[Kapitan_Phillips]

Burkina Faso? I must've made over 4 billion off of their dead ministers

[August]

Originally Posted by Knipper

No way August, you are totally wrong. In the UK we dont lend people money if they can't.... oh well maybe we do. Well what about France or Germany? they don't er, well. OK, well listen chum, it's really hard to get a mortgage in Bukino Faso OK? Doesn't that prove my point huh? eh? Doesn't it'? Eh? Doesn't it? (Sinks into a corner sobbing because August is right but Knipper is unwilling to admit it.) Think I'll go sink some American ships...

Well best I can do is invite you to the next St. Paddys day parade. Wear something green.