Merchant spots my periscope at 5000 meters?!

Schwuppes · 02-04-08, 05:29 AM

Oh hi!

Well I had intercepted a medium cargo, weather was good, 2 meter winds, 10km visibilty, only light cloud and it was 4 o clock in the afternoon...

I was approaching for the kill submerged at 6 knots and had my periscope up... I was just about to take some new measurements to see if I had to corect my course/attack plan when I see that he starts zig zagging.... OMG I thought, how is this possible that a merchant spots my periscope from around 5 kilometers... a destroyer...yes, but not a pesky merchant... I felt like an idiot... lol
How am I supposed to gather the data for plotting and attack etc?!

I know GWX has improved enemy AI which is awesome and I'm not bashing... but is this realistic?

Yoriyn · 02-04-08, 05:36 AM

Maybe he spot you before you dive.

Schwuppes · 02-04-08, 05:45 AM

Hi Yoriyn!

I'm quite sure he wasn't zig zagging before I submerged....

Yoriyn · 02-04-08, 05:52 AM

Maybe when you start diving. In good weather the merchant spot me in good weather from long distance (I use type IIB).
Second thing, i only rise periscope max. 1m above water level.
Sometimes when you stop submerged your u-boot going up 2-3 m, and your conning tower is visible.

JG10r_Bull · 02-04-08, 05:55 AM

how high was your periscope out of the water i try not to have a wake of water from the Scope and that's real good weather too I have had ships spot my scope from around 3km but not 5 but not that big of a deal just keep your attack line and run mag shot under him it's the right weather 4 it

Uncle Goose · 02-04-08, 05:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Schwuppes

Oh hi!

Well I had intercepted a medium cargo, weather was good, 2 meter winds, 10km visibilty, only light cloud and it was 4 o clock in the afternoon...

I was approaching for the kill submerged at 6 knots and had my periscope up... I was just about to take some new measurements to see if I had to corect my course/attack plan when I see that he starts zig zagging.... OMG I thought, how is this possible that a merchant spots my periscope from around 5 kilometers... a destroyer...yes, but not a pesky merchant... I felt like an idiot... lol
How am I supposed to gather the data for plotting and attack etc?!

I know GWX has improved enemy AI which is awesome and I'm not bashing... but is this realistic?

Why shouldn't this be possible?? Merchants also had a watchcrew and are higher than a destroyer, so with good bino's they could spot you just as much (or even more) as a destroyer.

melnibonian · 02-04-08, 06:04 AM

Don't forget that in GWX Merchants can zig-zag even if they don't spot you. It was a standard procedure during the war for all merchants to zig-zag from time to time to avoid U-Boat attacks.

Abd_von_Mumit · 02-04-08, 08:32 AM

I bet it wasn't the very periscope that was spotted, but ITS WAKE - at 6 knots it's like a small motorboat leaving trace on the water. It's been said repeatedly not to raise your periscope if travelling faster than 2 knots.

TomcatMVD · 02-04-08, 08:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Abd_von_Mumit

I bet it wasn't the very periscope that was spotted, but ITS WAKE - at 6 knots it's like a small motorboat leaving trace on the water. It's been said repeatedly not to raise your periscope if travelling faster than 2 knots.

I agree

Commanders' handbook tells you not to raise your scope when going faster than 4knts, but then... they didn't use GWX when they wrote the handbook

bruschi sauro · 02-04-08, 11:10 AM

.........SURE IS THE WAKE OF PERISCOPE....6 KNOTS, BRRRR.......

papa_smurf · 02-04-08, 12:05 PM

Quote:

I bet it wasn't the very periscope that was spotted, but ITS WAKE - at 6 knots it's like a small motorboat leaving trace on the water. It's been said repeatedly not to raise your periscope if travelling faster than 2 knots.

I agree with that, I only travel at 2-3 knts when my periscope is up.

Jimbuna · 02-04-08, 12:08 PM

The wake is a more easily spotted target than the head of a periscope.

A sure sign you've been spotted is when they commence zig zagging.

Remember, there have been random waypoints inserted into GWX2.0.

02-04-08, 12:13 PM

I have to agree with the others: I highly doubt that the periscope was, itself, spotted, as much as 1) it's feather (the spray kicked up, much like a bow wave) and 2) the wake it was leaving behind.

You very very rarely see any straight lines in nature. The weather was good and still quite a bit of daylight. With only 2 meter winds the sea was quite calm. Depending on how long you had the scope up you were likely kicking up and leaving quite a long, straight wake, especially at 6 knots. The merchie crew might not know exactly what they'd seen, or known for sure it was a U-boat. But zigzagging for half an hour beats just dumbly stooging along in a straight line and risk becoming easy meat.

Best thing to do under those circumstances is drop your speed to ahead slow or all stop, wait until you slow or stop, then raise your scope and take your bearings, ranges, speeds, etc. Then lower the scope and speed up again. That way you won't be spotted as easily.

Sailor Steve · 02-04-08, 01:56 PM

One question hasn't been asked: how long did you leave your periscope up? The longer it's visible, the better chance that they'll see it.

Schwuppes · 02-05-08, 02:12 AM

Hi guys!

Thnks for your replies, yes after a while of thinking it dawned on me too that it was probably the wake of my periscope that gave me away....

I will follow your advice and stick to 2 or 3 knots when using it....

02-04-08, 05:29 AM	#1
Schwuppes 中国水兵 Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 279 Downloads: 22 Uploads: 0	Merchant spots my periscope at 5000 meters?! Oh hi! Well I had intercepted a medium cargo, weather was good, 2 meter winds, 10km visibilty, only light cloud and it was 4 o clock in the afternoon... I was approaching for the kill submerged at 6 knots and had my periscope up... I was just about to take some new measurements to see if I had to corect my course/attack plan when I see that he starts zig zagging.... OMG I thought, how is this possible that a merchant spots my periscope from around 5 kilometers... a destroyer...yes, but not a pesky merchant... I felt like an idiot... lol How am I supposed to gather the data for plotting and attack etc?! I know GWX has improved enemy AI which is awesome and I'm not bashing... but is this realistic? __________________ E8400 @ 4.00Ghz standard vCore, Gigabyte P35C DS3R @ 445 Mhz, Leadtek GTX 280, 3 x 1GB Kingston DDR2 800 @ 890Mhz, 250GB +160GB HDD, Terratec DMX 6fire 24/96, Silverstone ST60F 600W, Logitech Z-5500 THX

02-04-08, 05:36 AM	#2
Yoriyn Planesman Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Control room Posts: 181 Downloads: 154 Uploads: 0	Maybe he spot you before you dive. __________________ Oblt.zS. Kurt Hanke, commander of U-83 (Type VIIB) in WaW 5. Patrol 1 - at sea : 5 ships - 10095 BRT My filefront mods link To Battle Station order mod for SH3 and more

02-04-08, 05:45 AM	#3
Schwuppes 中国水兵 Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 279 Downloads: 22 Uploads: 0	Hi Yoriyn! I'm quite sure he wasn't zig zagging before I submerged.... __________________ E8400 @ 4.00Ghz standard vCore, Gigabyte P35C DS3R @ 445 Mhz, Leadtek GTX 280, 3 x 1GB Kingston DDR2 800 @ 890Mhz, 250GB +160GB HDD, Terratec DMX 6fire 24/96, Silverstone ST60F 600W, Logitech Z-5500 THX

02-04-08, 05:52 AM	#4
Yoriyn Planesman Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Control room Posts: 181 Downloads: 154 Uploads: 0	Maybe when you start diving. In good weather the merchant spot me in good weather from long distance (I use type IIB). Second thing, i only rise periscope max. 1m above water level. Sometimes when you stop submerged your u-boot going up 2-3 m, and your conning tower is visible. __________________ Oblt.zS. Kurt Hanke, commander of U-83 (Type VIIB) in WaW 5. Patrol 1 - at sea : 5 ships - 10095 BRT My filefront mods link To Battle Station order mod for SH3 and more

02-04-08, 05:55 AM	#5
JG10r_Bull Seaman Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Oz Posts: 41 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	how high was your periscope out of the water i try not to have a wake of water from the Scope and that's real good weather too I have had ships spot my scope from around 3km but not 5 but not that big of a deal just keep your attack line and run mag shot under him it's the right weather 4 it __________________

02-04-08, 06:04 AM	#7
melnibonian Ocean Warrior Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Reading UK Posts: 3,473 Downloads: 90 Uploads: 0	Don't forget that in GWX Merchants can zig-zag even if they don't spot you. It was a standard procedure during the war for all merchants to zig-zag from time to time to avoid U-Boat attacks. __________________ http://www.thegreywolves.com/ http://wolvesatwar.com/ Download GWX and other goodies: http://hosted.filefront.com/melnibonian

02-04-08, 08:32 AM	#8
Abd_von_Mumit The Old Man Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Warszawa, Polska Posts: 1,453 Downloads: 46 Uploads: 4	I bet it wasn't the very periscope that was spotted, but ITS WAKE - at 6 knots it's like a small motorboat leaving trace on the water. It's been said repeatedly not to raise your periscope if travelling faster than 2 knots. __________________ Long, hard, wet and full of seamen. My precious. SH3+GWX+OLC — sunk x4, retired x2; SH5+TDW — still exploring My SH5 mods: EQuaTool - Elite Quality Map Tools, Patrol Routine Scripts, No Logo Intro Menu_Animation, Less Annoying Stopwatch Links: SH5 mods I use, FileFront, Manual plotting how-to

02-04-08, 11:10 AM	#10
bruschi sauro Frogman Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Florence Italy Posts: 307 Downloads: 64 Uploads: 0	.........SURE IS THE WAKE OF PERISCOPE....6 KNOTS, BRRRR.......

02-04-08, 12:08 PM	#12
Jimbuna Chief of the Boat Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: 250 metres below the surface Posts: 190,500 Downloads: 63 Uploads: 13	The wake is a more easily spotted target than the head of a periscope. A sure sign you've been spotted is when they commence zig zagging. Remember, there have been random waypoints inserted into GWX2.0. __________________ Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because they have to say something. Oh my God, not again!!

02-04-08, 12:13 PM	#13
Albrecht Von Hesse Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	I have to agree with the others: I highly doubt that the periscope was, itself, spotted, as much as 1) it's feather (the spray kicked up, much like a bow wave) and 2) the wake it was leaving behind. You very very rarely see any straight lines in nature. The weather was good and still quite a bit of daylight. With only 2 meter winds the sea was quite calm. Depending on how long you had the scope up you were likely kicking up and leaving quite a long, straight wake, especially at 6 knots. The merchie crew might not know exactly what they'd seen, or known for sure it was a U-boat. But zigzagging for half an hour beats just dumbly stooging along in a straight line and risk becoming easy meat. Best thing to do under those circumstances is drop your speed to ahead slow or all stop, wait until you slow or stop, then raise your scope and take your bearings, ranges, speeds, etc. Then lower the scope and speed up again. That way you won't be spotted as easily.

02-04-08, 01:56 PM	#14
Sailor Steve Eternal Patrol Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: High in the mountains of Utah Posts: 50,369 Downloads: 745 Uploads: 249	One question hasn't been asked: how long did you leave your periscope up? The longer it's visible, the better chance that they'll see it. __________________ “Never do anything you can't take back.” —Rocky Russo

02-05-08, 02:12 AM	#15
Schwuppes 中国水兵 Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 279 Downloads: 22 Uploads: 0	Hi guys! Thnks for your replies, yes after a while of thinking it dawned on me too that it was probably the wake of my periscope that gave me away.... I will follow your advice and stick to 2 or 3 knots when using it.... __________________ E8400 @ 4.00Ghz standard vCore, Gigabyte P35C DS3R @ 445 Mhz, Leadtek GTX 280, 3 x 1GB Kingston DDR2 800 @ 890Mhz, 250GB +160GB HDD, Terratec DMX 6fire 24/96, Silverstone ST60F 600W, Logitech Z-5500 THX