Is it finally time to buy DW?

MarkShot · 08-13-07, 05:47 PM

I've had SC since 2001.

I see that I can now get the SFI version of DW for $10 USD. This would seem to be a good price even if they do overlap in the area of sub ops.

I do have some questions:

(1) Will all the mods I see over at Sub Guru work for the SFI version and not just the Battlefront version?

(2) With DW v1.04 what's the main difference in the engine for sub play between SCX and DW?

(2a) Do counter measures still cause weapons to detonate?

(2b) Has the physics of diving/surfacing been improved?

(2c) Is autocrew-TMA still providing perfect solutions?

(2d) Is thermocline modeling different or more pronounced from SC?

(2e) Was some warning of subroc launches besides a transient on BB added?

(2f) Were sonar tracker bugs fixed?

(2g) Are there more than a few scenarios for playing the Kilo?

(3) Are there more than a few scenarios for playing the non-sub platforms?

(4) Was an improved replay facility provided for the game?

If I am mainly going to command a sub and already have SC is DW still worth getting? Have I overlooked anything in regards to differences between SC and DW sub play that I should have asked?

Thanks.

Dr.Sid · 08-14-07, 03:19 AM

1) can't tell .. AFAIK no problem
2a) CM solved in 1.04 and LWAMI
2b) diving improved against 1.03 witch was flawed .. can't compare to SC
2c) solution is practically perfect after 5 lines, not perfect before that.
2d) can't compare thermocline to SC, but with 1.04 it seems to be quite realistic.
2e) subroc launches gives you warning when fired from sub, introduced by LWAMI
2f) most sonar bugs was fixed.
2g,3) There are few scenarios to play anything, but you have the mission editor, some user missions, quick mission editor, and mutliplayer.
4) replay sux. No 3D, slow seeking, sometimes events are played in wrong order, typically after seeking. Can't tell if it is better than SC.

DW is worth getting. Also, there soon will be no chance to get it at all I'm afraid.

MarkShot · 08-14-07, 07:00 AM

What's going on? Is DW being discontinued? Thanks.

OneShot · 08-14-07, 10:31 AM

Quote:

DW is worth getting. Also, there soon will be no chance to get it at all I'm afraid.

I've got no idea where you deduced that from ... DW is sold by SF, BB and over Steam and I seriously doubt that it will be unavailable anytime soon.

@MS : Even if you prefer to play Subs at the moment, buy DW if you look around you can get it reasonably cheap and with Patch 1.04 and the LwAmi mod it is far better then SC (even with SCX). So that should be a no-brainer. And if you ever get bored of subs ... DW offers other vastly different platforms with a different playing style to continue enjoying Naval Warfare.

Dr.Sid · 08-14-07, 10:37 AM

Well I said it because currently I don't know any place where to buy it (except steam). Can you post some links ?
I know just several shops which were selling it but are not anymore.

MarkShot · 08-14-07, 01:03 PM

What do folks do about the near perfect TMA when playing?

In SCX, especially in a high contact environment, I usually auto-crew the TMA except for the a target which I am engaging. For targets, I will often switch to manual TMA and wire guide once I have launched a spread.

So, with DW TMA is going to start out perfect already. Of course, one could do all TMA manually, but then the that becomes a pretty heavy work load.

So, what do players do about the high degree of auto crew TMA accuracy?

---

Personally, I always thought that for both the sonar and TMA stations the player should be able to give certain contacts to the AI to follow. This would allow the AI to maintain a general profile while the player focuses on an actual target and its prosecution.

Dr.Sid · 08-14-07, 02:45 PM

DW Auto TMA will give you quite good solution even from 5 parallel lines (which normally would give no solution at all).
Instead of solving TMA the autocrew takes real position and it adds some error to it. As you are getting more lines the error is smaller. But that is all. It is simulation of TMA process. Sometimes it gives better results that human would be able (sometimes human would be better on the other hand).

OneShot · 08-14-07, 04:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr.Sid

Well I said it because currently I don't know any place where to buy it (except steam). Can you post some links ?
I know just several shops which were selling it but are not anymore.

There is a big fat link at the top right of the forum ... buy it directly from Strategy First either as download or get the boxed version. The only thing you wont get anymore (except maybe on ebay) is the printed manual.

Dr.Sid · 08-14-07, 04:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OneShot

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr.Sid

Well I said it because currently I don't know any place where to buy it (except steam). Can you post some links ?
I know just several shops which were selling it but are not anymore.

There is a big fat link at the top right of the forum ... buy it directly from Strategy First either as download or get the boxed version. The only thing you wont get anymore (except maybe on ebay) is the printed manual.

Ah !

Thanx

MarkShot · 08-14-07, 05:28 PM

Bought it new from NWS at $9.99 USD. The price was just too good to pass up.

So, what are the must have mods which I should install when I get it?

Dr.Sid · 08-14-07, 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarkShot

Bought it new from NWS at $9.99 USD. The price was just too good to pass up.

So, what are the must have mods which I should install when I get it?

Official patch 1.04 (google it). Latest LWAMI realism mod from www.subguru.com. All other non-essential mods are there too.
But maybe you should start with stock DW and user manual. When you are sure you understand all (most) and you feel the problems of stock version, then use LWAMI. You should understand the long long change-list of LWAMI perfectly. If you don't, don't use it.

MarkShot · 08-15-07, 09:06 AM

Maybe I will just install one stock copy of DW and one modded copy of DW.

I assume that the procedure for multiple installs of DW and switching between them by first saving the registry tree branch and then reimporting it is the same as it was for Sub Command?

Thanks.

PS: Is anyone using JSGME with DW to manage mods? It's pretty much the norm among the SH3/SH4 communities these days.

OneShot · 08-15-07, 09:16 AM

Check the CADC here : http://www.commanders-academy.com/fo...read.php?t=168 on the topic of multiple installs.

As for JSGME ... when you download the LwAmi Mod (Full Version) JSGME is included and it works great with LwAmi.

08-13-07, 05:47 PM	#1
MarkShot Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 1,134 Downloads: 93 Uploads: 0	Is it finally time to buy DW? I've had SC since 2001. I see that I can now get the SFI version of DW for $10 USD. This would seem to be a good price even if they do overlap in the area of sub ops. I do have some questions: (1) Will all the mods I see over at Sub Guru work for the SFI version and not just the Battlefront version? (2) With DW v1.04 what's the main difference in the engine for sub play between SCX and DW? (2a) Do counter measures still cause weapons to detonate? (2b) Has the physics of diving/surfacing been improved? (2c) Is autocrew-TMA still providing perfect solutions? (2d) Is thermocline modeling different or more pronounced from SC? (2e) Was some warning of subroc launches besides a transient on BB added? (2f) Were sonar tracker bugs fixed? (2g) Are there more than a few scenarios for playing the Kilo? (3) Are there more than a few scenarios for playing the non-sub platforms? (4) Was an improved replay facility provided for the game? If I am mainly going to command a sub and already have SC is DW still worth getting? Have I overlooked anything in regards to differences between SC and DW sub play that I should have asked? Thanks. __________________ War games, not wars! --- Only a small few profit from war (that should not stand)!

08-14-07, 07:00 AM	#3
MarkShot Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 1,134 Downloads: 93 Uploads: 0	What's going on? Is DW being discontinued? Thanks. __________________ War games, not wars! --- Only a small few profit from war (that should not stand)!

08-14-07, 01:03 PM	#6
MarkShot Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 1,134 Downloads: 93 Uploads: 0	What do folks do about the near perfect TMA when playing? In SCX, especially in a high contact environment, I usually auto-crew the TMA except for the a target which I am engaging. For targets, I will often switch to manual TMA and wire guide once I have launched a spread. So, with DW TMA is going to start out perfect already. Of course, one could do all TMA manually, but then the that becomes a pretty heavy work load. So, what do players do about the high degree of auto crew TMA accuracy? --- Personally, I always thought that for both the sonar and TMA stations the player should be able to give certain contacts to the AI to follow. This would allow the AI to maintain a general profile while the player focuses on an actual target and its prosecution. __________________ War games, not wars! --- Only a small few profit from war (that should not stand)!

08-14-07, 05:28 PM	#10
MarkShot Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 1,134 Downloads: 93 Uploads: 0	Bought it new from NWS at $9.99 USD. The price was just too good to pass up. So, what are the must have mods which I should install when I get it? __________________ War games, not wars! --- Only a small few profit from war (that should not stand)!

08-15-07, 09:06 AM	#12
MarkShot Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 1,134 Downloads: 93 Uploads: 0	Maybe I will just install one stock copy of DW and one modded copy of DW. I assume that the procedure for multiple installs of DW and switching between them by first saving the registry tree branch and then reimporting it is the same as it was for Sub Command? Thanks. PS: Is anyone using JSGME with DW to manage mods? It's pretty much the norm among the SH3/SH4 communities these days. __________________ War games, not wars! --- Only a small few profit from war (that should not stand)!

08-14-07, 03:19 AM	#2
Dr.Sid The Old Man Join Date: May 2005 Location: Czech Republic Posts: 1,458 Downloads: 6 Uploads: 0	1) can't tell .. AFAIK no problem 2a) CM solved in 1.04 and LWAMI 2b) diving improved against 1.03 witch was flawed .. can't compare to SC 2c) solution is practically perfect after 5 lines, not perfect before that. 2d) can't compare thermocline to SC, but with 1.04 it seems to be quite realistic. 2e) subroc launches gives you warning when fired from sub, introduced by LWAMI 2f) most sonar bugs was fixed. 2g,3) There are few scenarios to play anything, but you have the mission editor, some user missions, quick mission editor, and mutliplayer. 4) replay sux. No 3D, slow seeking, sometimes events are played in wrong order, typically after seeking. Can't tell if it is better than SC. DW is worth getting. Also, there soon will be no chance to get it at all I'm afraid.

08-14-07, 10:37 AM	#5
Dr.Sid The Old Man Join Date: May 2005 Location: Czech Republic Posts: 1,458 Downloads: 6 Uploads: 0	Well I said it because currently I don't know any place where to buy it (except steam). Can you post some links ? I know just several shops which were selling it but are not anymore.

08-14-07, 02:45 PM	#7
Dr.Sid The Old Man Join Date: May 2005 Location: Czech Republic Posts: 1,458 Downloads: 6 Uploads: 0	DW Auto TMA will give you quite good solution even from 5 parallel lines (which normally would give no solution at all). Instead of solving TMA the autocrew takes real position and it adds some error to it. As you are getting more lines the error is smaller. But that is all. It is simulation of TMA process. Sometimes it gives better results that human would be able (sometimes human would be better on the other hand).

08-15-07, 09:16 AM	#13
OneShot Grey Wolf Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Germany Posts: 956 Downloads: 9 Uploads: 0	Check the CADC here : http://www.commanders-academy.com/fo...read.php?t=168 on the topic of multiple installs. As for JSGME ... when you download the LwAmi Mod (Full Version) JSGME is included and it works great with LwAmi. __________________ All the things you always wanted to know about Dangerous Waters but never dared to ask!