Convoy tactics in 44

I must say that now I'm loosing the itch... Lost my VIIC in late 43 in the Med (one DD made me to go too deep) so I've started a new campaign with VIIC/41 from Cobald. This time it's ok with planes, they don't bother me too much, if they are single my twin M42 does it's job. Schnorchel is useless while without radar warning my crew spots planes to late and its too late for anything than reloading my save so I'm doing the old way - surface/dive.

I've tried 2 times to approach a convoy but before anything escorts go straight at me (they have a perfect lock on me from 9km). Can't do anything as crawling underwater doesn't make sense. It's a very dark night, with my brightness high visibility is still low. If an escort goes straight at me he gets an eel but now they zig-zag while approaching. Also I would like to keep my cargo for fat merchants, enough of killing DDs...

Now for 4 hrs? I'm trying to loose a pesky american DD. Everything fails. Bold, depth and course changes, sneaking behind his back etc but everytime he circles he finds me again and again. He must have dropped 300 DCs... Maybe Bold 1 is the problem? Couldn't upgrade to v3 but hey. DDs were easy! Never needed to use decoys.

I'm pissed and tired just like my crew. Event can't shoot him as my tubes are damaged and need a whole day to fix em.......

Any ideas? Or should I start again with VIIB in 1939...

[ReM]

Frustrating though it may be, it sounds pretty realistic to me....1939 does have its charms....1944 is hell on earth.

[joegrundman]

i just got to early 44 in my viic/41. Still haven't been offered a schnorkel, but my first convoy approach turned out to be easy as anything. It was a flat calm and perfect visibilty. I was spotted from 12km out and three DD's, nearly half the escort raced out to the datum, but of course with the time it took to get there i was not in their search circle anymore. I just drifted in to the middle of the convoy and got 22000 BRT and slipped away.

One DD found me but I let out some bold 2 and dived straight down to 250m and they never found me again.

My first impression of cobald's viic/41 is wow, seems like i got the edge back after the hell of 43.

That extra depth capacity sure makes you feel less stressed when diving deep

[TarJak]

Welcome to the big league. '44 is a real challenge and anyone who can survive it derserves much respect even if their tonnage scores are low. 1944 is one of the most difficult and probably frustrating periods of the war. You are forced to think through and plan almost every move you make from leaving harbour through to attacks when you get the opportunity.

Tactically you best bet is to avoid heavily escorted convoys (this is pretty much all of them by this stage of the war) and concentrate on hitting single ships where you can find them. Most of your time will however be spent submerged and attempting to avoid aircraft. The true challenge in '44 is to survive rather than to rack up major tonnage scores and as long as you shift your goals and thinking in this regard it can still be quite rewarding.

It is however not the same as being able to rock up to the nearest gathering of ships sink what you want and cruise home. If that's what you want play then in 1939.

[Mooncatt]

i think Tarjax has hit the nail on the head there, so big applause for him/her.
ive never been further the 11/43 which was getting very hard by then and i was leaving heavily guarded escorts to their own devices. single shipping is the way to go.
yes its very realistic in those years, thats when the war in the Atlantic turned dramically for the german u-boats. and UK and US DDs started to get some seriously good anti-uboat shnizzle.

[joegrundman]

in terms of tactics (non-convoy) late war, i haven't been through the bay of biscay for over a year now, even if i'm sent to the AL zone.

I'll always hug the coast all the way to the northwestern tip of spain and then head straight out into the atlantic on a constant latitude. I keep going straight out until i reach the appropriate longitude and head north. I may even go further west and head into the patrol grid from the west, anything to keep at the extreme limit of air cover. Do it all at 8kts and fuel isn't a problem.

Also i always dive whenever I get neue Empfange Funkmesssignal. I find if planes ever make contact with me the chances of finding another one when i surface greatly increase. Incidentally do radar warning sets ever give directional information in this game?

[Heibges]

Basically, in 1944 and beyond, you have to pray the convoy steams right over you, or else you have no chance to intercept, at least if you are playing realistically.

[GoldenRivet]

dont let the late war get you down too badly.

Your tactics will just have to be slightly modified. Try to intercept a convoy by getting way out ahead of it while remaining outside of radar range. about the time you start receiving radar warnings they are just barely getting into radar range of you so you might be able to stay on the edges of their radar range limits.

You going to have to hunt in areas where you know that shipping will bottle neck and run across ships on blind luck.

1939-1942 you had a wonderful time going about unchallenged sinking hundreds of merchants... but this pissed a few allied leaders off and sent them looking for innovative new ways to serve your head on a plate.

1943-1945 they discovered a lot of neat new ways to kill U-boats with frigthening accuracy... more potent depth charges, hedge hogs, search lights, hunter killer groups... i dont think there are many more appropriate discriptions of how the hunters became the hunted in any war ever. More advancements in anti-submarine warfare were made in 1942 - 1945 than probably any time period since then.

after 1943 your objective should be cut and dry simple... do whatever it takes to SURVIVE. Of course your orders are still to seek out and engage the enemy, but that big juicy convoy might have to just roll by you. Try hunting almost exclusively by hydrophones, you will still rack up tonnage by running across single merchants in high traffic areas. By now you have to cool off your aggression a bit, penetrating a convoy though possible is very very difficult. The war by 1944 has been lost for Germany... most officers and crew knew that, but valiantly they continued their struggle to serve their country. After 1943 and especially 1944 and 45 you need to think like a captain who knows its over - be conservative and bring your boys home. thats you objective now. You will hear a lot of banter about "serving the fatherland" and "doing your duty"... you can still do those things while keeping your crew out of harms way, you just wont pile up hundreds of thousnads of tons in the process.

Good luck out there!

remember your two objectives

1. Bring home the fathers, brothers and sons of Germany to their families
2. Be as large a thorn in the allies sides as you can without getting yourself killed

~GR

[Heibges]

The thing is, you really should be snorkelling all the time, so this really doesn't give you the opportunity to get ahead of a convoy.

[GoldenRivet]

Originally Posted by Heibges

The thing is, you really should be snorkelling all the time, so this really doesn't give you the opportunity to get ahead of a convoy.

not 100% accurate.

You should be submurged a majority of the time... i dont know about snorkeling all the time. If your snorkel protrudes above the water allied radar can detect it. Leave the thing extended for longer than a short while and your going to spring a leak from the enemy bombs from allied aircraft.

It is possible under some circumstances to get out ahead of a convoy late in the war, with practice and luck in plotting their path it can be done. But not with the same ease as early war intercepts... also in the late war an intercept might put you quite a ways away from the convoy, far off from where you intended to be.

My tactic after 1943 is to remain submerged until the batteries are around 50%, surface to recharge air and batteries, or use the snorkel to recharge back to 100%. This allows me to remain submerged most of the time.

Instead of relying on visual and hydrophone contacts i rely mostly on hydrophones, slow speeds at depths of around 40 - 60 meters and i will close in on any contact i find at the highest speed possible. the downside is that you almost always ONLY sink lone merchants, or merchants travelling in groups of 2 or 3. also your patrols drag out taking twice as long as pre-1943 patrols due to being stuck underwater at 2 knots most of the time.

Thx for replys, I see we all think the same. I play as realistic as possible. Now I let myself to shoot down some planes if they come too close too fast and don't have time to dive but in general nothing changed. Schnorchel would be good if they could switch to electric engines faster. It just takes so much time to start diving while it should go like a brick on crash dive. Schnorscheling all the time is not realistic, u need quite a flat sea. Also you'll get detected by radar very soon.

If I can shake this DD off am going home, rethink, reequip and try to survive. 6000 BRT in destroyers should make Onkel Karl happy either way.

PS In Biscay I've encounter our infamous hunt/kill group of 6 Swans........

[ReM]

Originally Posted by Heibges

The thing is, you really should be snorkelling all the time, so this really doesn't give you the opportunity to get ahead of a convoy.

Snorting all the time is not accurate....U-boats used to snort only for a couple of hours a day, leaving them almost blind because the vibrations from the engines running at high speeds made the use of the periscope almost impossible and tended to disturb the alignment of the glasses in it, running submerged with diesels clanking makes use of the hydrophones pretty useless as well, making the U-boat alomost deaf.

Running around submerged making a lot of noise, while yourself being almost blind and deaf, now that is inviting trouble.....they had to do it though to charge their batteries.....or surface into the hornets nest above.

I am reading The hunted by Clay Blair....I devoured the first volume and the first part of the second book; I do have some trouble getting through the last part from the end of 1943 onwards. It is a pretty sad tale of scores of U-boats being destroyed without standing a chance, many on their first patrols. Pure sacrifice of young men to keep intact the 'outer defense' for Germany.

The 'Happy Times' were named that for a reason.................

10hrs and witch each circle he has me. I can bold, rapidly change depth and course while behind his tail and 2 minutes later he's got me again... 230m is my max depth right now because of damage. Any ideas or should I surrender? This happens for the second time, no chance to loose the bastard for more than one circle.

[ReM]

He's got you by the **lls

[CapnMike U-69]

Hi Kaleun Hadrys,
I suppose you already tried the following technique, which I found quite by accident on eveneing after too much beer made me hit the wrong keys:-

Change course 15-20 degrees so the DD follows you around, med speed, rise in depth about 25m so he starts his attack run, and then rapidly change Direction (ie: hit reverse emergency) with full opposite rudder. After 20 secs, use your bold and then go silent 1knt forward opposite track to DD, and then do the wiggle waggle and go deeper and change speed etc... ?

I have found that a HARD reverse and depth change sometimes works in conjunction with Bold - especially in a type VII. Usually it fails in a whale (sorry - I meant Type IX)

Sorry if this is all 'Old hat' but I'm a relative newbie.

Also, very occasionally if you are in very shallow water (Yup, I get caught there
!!), keep going backawards instead- blow ballast and get a Ba*llsy stern tube impact snap shot !!! But needs nerves of steel ..... or a few beers first :-)
However it is a hell of a rush when it works... and I got two C class like that in AM52 recently, I think it was in '43.

Good luck anyway, and happy Huntin' . Let us know what happened, Please!

Capn Mike U-69