Some Q's, mainly about lock on range

Gedscho · 03-27-07, 09:47 AM

Hello, everybody.

First let me say i think its not really a good idea to have people register just to use the search function of the forums. i really dont know why you wouldnt want non registered visitors to use the search.

now to my question, which i couldnt answer, even WITH the help of the search function

since i installed GWX i frequently "lose locks" on ships. it seems it has something to do with range, but im not sure. im using the 16km view range thingy too, btw.
its like... i lock the contact with the periscope and about 10 seconds later or so i lose the lock again.

this can get really annoying. as i understand it, when im at periscope depth and have no map updates i need to measure the distance to the contact at 0:00 and at 3:15 on my nifty junghans watch. i can then proceed to plot the contacts speed and course.

now how would i be able to measure the distance to the contact without using the stadimeter? i think, while submerged, there is no other (Accurate) way.
and afaik i can only use the stadimeter when i have the periscope locked on the contact.

is there a setting in any cfg file that determines how far a contact can be for my periscope to maintain the lock?

im pretty sure i didnt have this kind of behavior in vanilla SH III, but it didnt have 16km view range in the first place, ey.

another question i cant answer would be the options of the radioman. i know what "feindfahrtbericht senden" does. but im not EXACTLY sure of "Fühlungsmeldungen schicken" and i have no ****ing clue what "Kontake melden" does. i always get a "Keine Funksprüche erhalten" on that one.

any help appreciated!

Gedscho · 03-27-07, 11:12 AM

please forgive my shameless bump, but im rather eager to find out, why the periscope doesnt maintain its locks.

doesnt any of you encounter said behaviour?

Deep-Six · 03-27-07, 11:16 AM

Someone will be by to explain.

03-27-07, 11:57 AM

You're probably correct in that it has to do with distance. If under 1500 meters, it would probably stay locked.

You might try holding down the lock button (L). I do this to ID ships, little aggrivating but it helps.

P_Funk · 03-27-07, 03:04 PM

Well one way to use the stadimeter while submerged if you're losing the target lock is to pause the game at the exact moment that you have the crosshair lined up with the ship's hull on the waterline. When paused you can use the notepad tools so that way if you can get a lock and get the line on the waterline then you can do it handily.

Another thing to consider is that while U-boats spent much of the war submerged, they were designed to fight on the surface, and to that end the bridge mounted Uzo has a built in gyro stabilizer to facilitate easier observation since the small size of the u-boat causes great rocking. However despite the relative sophistication of the attack scope itself, it lacks any kind of stabilization so it can be hard to maintain a lock that way or to get the stadimeter to be useful in anything but absurdly calm seas.

So if you can, make your observations on the surface. The added bonus of that is that your WO can give you the range and bearing of the nearest target down to the a hundred meters. Useful for quick tracking of a whole convoy.

Hope that helps.

Gedscho · 03-27-07, 04:06 PM

yeah both your replies helped a lot. still, it bugs me a little.
its not the fact that i lose the lock but the fact, no matter how well i use the stadimeter i cant get no readout because the notepad loses the shiptype when the lock breaks.

and in this particular case i really dont want to run surfaced, as im in the street of dover atm, and theres a lot of stuff going on i dont want to get involved with

pausing or holding down l is an option, but it seems like a bandaid solution.

you know, im just curious, why the game makes me lose the lock. i want to plot an interception course with map updates disabled, have my contact about 8km out or so (id estimate), its big enough so i can use the stadimeter precisely, but the lock keeps breaking after 10secs or so. and i didnt encounter that in the vanilla version of the game. which i played only for 2 days or so.

i think basically i want to know, why it does that and how i can stop it.

03-27-07, 08:03 PM

I hope you are running GWX with the just released 1.03 update.

Also, Rubini has just posted a Visual Hydrophone Workaround Mod which enhances crew visual sightings and hydrophone contacts. My crew now spots targets at 9000 meters in the day and 5500 meters at night. This is not possible with the stock SH3 or with the stock GWX.

So, as soon as the crew spots the target, the lock becomes functional. This has been in calm weather so far, not sure how it will handle in storms yet.

cardician · 03-28-07, 05:03 AM

As far as losing lock, happens to me all the time but I don't think any more so with GWX. I used to lose lock a lot with stock SH3. It always corresponded with a wave submerging the scope and making you actually lose visual contact. I guess its more realistic that way?

Quote:

Originally Posted by von Zelda

Also, Rubini has just posted a Visual Hydrophone Workaround Mod which enhances crew visual sightings and hydrophone contacts. My crew now spots targets at 9000 meters in the day and 5500 meters at night. This is not possible with the stock SH3 or with the stock GWX.

One question. Is this realistic? Now I'm not worried about hardcore realism like some folks

Mines only at around 45-50% (still need targetting help), but would it actually be possible for the crew to see a ship 9000 meters away with binoculars? I'm really just asking as I have no idea and am curious.

Oh, also, I agree with registering to search. Hate when boards make you do that. But I think some of the more highly trafficked boards do it because searching uses up more bandwidth than other actions. It puts a heavier load on the server and such, hence it costs them more money. So in order to keep costs down they limit searching. Pretty sure thats often the reason anyway. Inconvenient sure, but I guess its valid.

Gedscho · 03-28-07, 06:03 AM

aha, didnt think so far with the search function. makes perfectly sense now.

and about losing the lock: i dont know what the waves are doing to the sub, but the periscope is above the water at all times when i lose lock.

and even stranger: once i GOT a lock that stays the waves can cover up the whole periscope and i wont lose it.

i thought there was a simple answer... like... if contact is farther away than x km/spotrange of most tired watchman/whatever you will frequently lose locks. or something.

03-28-07, 06:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cardician

Quote:

Originally Posted by von Zelda

Also, Rubini has just posted a Visual Hydrophone Workaround Mod which enhances crew visual sightings and hydrophone contacts. My crew now spots targets at 9000 meters in the day and 5500 meters at night. This is not possible with the stock SH3 or with the stock GWX.

One question. Is this realistic? Now I'm not worried about hardcore realism like some folks

Mines only at around 45-50% (still need targetting help), but would it actually be possible for the crew to see a ship 9000 meters away with binoculars? I'm really just asking as I have no idea and am curious.

Generally, smoke which extends quite high was observed well before the mast of a ship. It is my understanding that smoke on the horizon could be seen at 15 nautical miles on a clear day. This is approximately 27-kilometers.

I've always felt that the stock visual detection distance was too small. Being able to spot a ship at 9000 meters or approximately 4.85 nautical miles makes the game play better for me. I also believe that this is why GWX developers offer a 16-kilometer option. But my laptop will not handle it.

cardician · 03-28-07, 07:42 AM

I have the 16km addition turned on in my GWX mod. A question about that though. I read the thread on the Rubini mod you mentioned here. Makes me worry quite a bit as it seems now destroyers and such will be able to see me miles away before I'm able to see them, or my crew is at least? Am I understanding that correctly?

This is not good and there is currently no Rubini mod for the 16km thing so I guess I'm at a huge disadvantage for now. Looks like the computer is going to be kicking my butt big time.

03-28-07, 12:13 PM

I think Rubini's next project is the mod for the 16km game. So hang on for awhile.

As to spoting you, I think his changes only apply to spoting the enemy.

I use the stock 8km version and his mod is great. I think he is working on spoting aircraft at a great distance as well. Keep reading his posts to find out the latest chnages.

Sailor Steve · 03-28-07, 05:31 PM

Another problem with the lock function is that it let's the Weapons Officer identify ships at a much longer range than you can yourself. I used to repeatedly hit the lock just to make him do it; these days I wait until I can see for myself.

I hate to change someone's topic, but this is driving me crazy:

Quote:

Originally Posted by P_Funk

Another thing to consider is that while U-boats spent much of the war submerged, they were designed to fight on the surface, and to that end the bridge mounted Uzo has a built in gyro stabilizer to facilitate easier observation since the small size of the u-boat causes great rocking.

I've heard many people make that claim over the last two years, and so far no one has been able to back it up. Could you please show me a picture or even an official description of this stabilizer? The very first GYRO-stabilized (as opposed to a counterweight, as some claim?) fire-control system that I'm aware of was tested by the United States late in 1945. Even American, British German and Japanese battleships didn't have stabilized rangefinders during the war, so can you please show me some real evidence of how a u-boat managed it for a pair of binoculars?

Gedscho · 03-28-07, 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

I hate to change someone's topic, but this is driving me crazy:

i dont mind, id like to hear more about this too.

but back to my question... im feeling really stupid by now, because i think i asked it three times in different ways, and i get the feeling this is starting to get on everyones nerves..

but ill risk it one more time, and put it yet another way: is there a setting, a fixed number or something that determines at what range i can maintain periscope lock?

i wouldnt mind increasing this to viewrange... im pretty sure its an artificial function anyway

just cant imagine how they would have made their periscopes follow stuff on the horizon on their own

i mean, pausing the game, yeah, thats an option.
but it still bugs me. i need the lock to perform most basic stuff, and i really want to know, what makes the periscope behave like that. and its NOT the waterline.
i tried it with the 'scope well above the water.

im pretty sure its a range thing. but can it be changed, or is it fixed?

edit: there was something i think i didnt quite read before

Quote:

Originally Posted by von Zelda

So, as soon as the crew spots the target, the lock becomes functional. This has been in calm weather so far, not sure how it will handle in storms yet.

is this true all the time? i mean, they spotted my target, i dove to periscope depth and then the lock losing starts . (at least thats how i remember it). perfectly calm seas and totally clear weather, too.

cardician · 03-29-07, 04:54 AM

You're right. Playing last night I noticed this much more than I had before. The ship was still a ways out and even in a calm ocean I would constantly lose lock almost immediately after locking. Very annoying. I used to think it was due to waves, but then when the ship got closer I would maintain lock even through waves. So I'm with you, its annoying but I have no idea what to do about it.

03-27-07, 09:47 AM	#1
Gedscho Watch Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 26 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Some Q's, mainly about lock on range Hello, everybody. First let me say i think its not really a good idea to have people register just to use the search function of the forums. i really dont know why you wouldnt want non registered visitors to use the search. now to my question, which i couldnt answer, even WITH the help of the search function since i installed GWX i frequently "lose locks" on ships. it seems it has something to do with range, but im not sure. im using the 16km view range thingy too, btw. its like... i lock the contact with the periscope and about 10 seconds later or so i lose the lock again. this can get really annoying. as i understand it, when im at periscope depth and have no map updates i need to measure the distance to the contact at 0:00 and at 3:15 on my nifty junghans watch. i can then proceed to plot the contacts speed and course. now how would i be able to measure the distance to the contact without using the stadimeter? i think, while submerged, there is no other (Accurate) way. and afaik i can only use the stadimeter when i have the periscope locked on the contact. is there a setting in any cfg file that determines how far a contact can be for my periscope to maintain the lock? im pretty sure i didnt have this kind of behavior in vanilla SH III, but it didnt have 16km view range in the first place, ey. another question i cant answer would be the options of the radioman. i know what "feindfahrtbericht senden" does. but im not EXACTLY sure of "Fühlungsmeldungen schicken" and i have no ****ing clue what "Kontake melden" does. i always get a "Keine Funksprüche erhalten" on that one. any help appreciated!

03-27-07, 11:16 AM	#3
Deep-Six Sonar Guy Join Date: May 2005 Location: Dallas, TX Posts: 399 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	Someone will be by to explain. __________________

03-27-07, 03:04 PM	#5
P_Funk Ocean Warrior Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Canada, eh? Posts: 2,537 Downloads: 129 Uploads: 0	Well one way to use the stadimeter while submerged if you're losing the target lock is to pause the game at the exact moment that you have the crosshair lined up with the ship's hull on the waterline. When paused you can use the notepad tools so that way if you can get a lock and get the line on the waterline then you can do it handily. Another thing to consider is that while U-boats spent much of the war submerged, they were designed to fight on the surface, and to that end the bridge mounted Uzo has a built in gyro stabilizer to facilitate easier observation since the small size of the u-boat causes great rocking. However despite the relative sophistication of the attack scope itself, it lacks any kind of stabilization so it can be hard to maintain a lock that way or to get the stadimeter to be useful in anything but absurdly calm seas. So if you can, make your observations on the surface. The added bonus of that is that your WO can give you the range and bearing of the nearest target down to the a hundred meters. Useful for quick tracking of a whole convoy. Hope that helps. __________________

03-27-07, 08:03 PM	#7
von Zelda Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	A Solution for you I hope you are running GWX with the just released 1.03 update. Also, Rubini has just posted a Visual Hydrophone Workaround Mod which enhances crew visual sightings and hydrophone contacts. My crew now spots targets at 9000 meters in the day and 5500 meters at night. This is not possible with the stock SH3 or with the stock GWX. So, as soon as the crew spots the target, the lock becomes functional. This has been in calm weather so far, not sure how it will handle in storms yet.

03-28-07, 06:03 AM	#9
Gedscho Watch Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 26 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	thanks aha, didnt think so far with the search function. makes perfectly sense now. and about losing the lock: i dont know what the waves are doing to the sub, but the periscope is above the water at all times when i lose lock. and even stranger: once i GOT a lock that stays the waves can cover up the whole periscope and i wont lose it. i thought there was a simple answer... like... if contact is farther away than x km/spotrange of most tired watchman/whatever you will frequently lose locks. or something.

03-27-07, 11:12 AM	#2
Gedscho Watch Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 26 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	please forgive my shameless bump, but im rather eager to find out, why the periscope doesnt maintain its locks. doesnt any of you encounter said behaviour?

03-27-07, 11:57 AM	#4
von Zelda Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	You're probably correct in that it has to do with distance. If under 1500 meters, it would probably stay locked. You might try holding down the lock button (L). I do this to ID ships, little aggrivating but it helps.

03-27-07, 04:06 PM	#6
Gedscho Watch Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 26 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	yeah both your replies helped a lot. still, it bugs me a little. its not the fact that i lose the lock but the fact, no matter how well i use the stadimeter i cant get no readout because the notepad loses the shiptype when the lock breaks. and in this particular case i really dont want to run surfaced, as im in the street of dover atm, and theres a lot of stuff going on i dont want to get involved with pausing or holding down l is an option, but it seems like a bandaid solution. you know, im just curious, why the game makes me lose the lock. i want to plot an interception course with map updates disabled, have my contact about 8km out or so (id estimate), its big enough so i can use the stadimeter precisely, but the lock keeps breaking after 10secs or so. and i didnt encounter that in the vanilla version of the game. which i played only for 2 days or so. i think basically i want to know, why it does that and how i can stop it.

03-28-07, 07:42 AM	#11
cardician Torpedoman Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 115 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	I have the 16km addition turned on in my GWX mod. A question about that though. I read the thread on the Rubini mod you mentioned here. Makes me worry quite a bit as it seems now destroyers and such will be able to see me miles away before I'm able to see them, or my crew is at least? Am I understanding that correctly? This is not good and there is currently no Rubini mod for the 16km thing so I guess I'm at a huge disadvantage for now. Looks like the computer is going to be kicking my butt big time.

03-28-07, 12:13 PM	#12
von Zelda Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	I think Rubini's next project is the mod for the 16km game. So hang on for awhile. As to spoting you, I think his changes only apply to spoting the enemy. I use the stock 8km version and his mod is great. I think he is working on spoting aircraft at a great distance as well. Keep reading his posts to find out the latest chnages.

03-29-07, 04:54 AM	#15
cardician Torpedoman Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 115 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	You're right. Playing last night I noticed this much more than I had before. The ship was still a ways out and even in a calm ocean I would constantly lose lock almost immediately after locking. Very annoying. I used to think it was due to waves, but then when the ship got closer I would maintain lock even through waves. So I'm with you, its annoying but I have no idea what to do about it.