Dems pass bill to hasten defeat

[Yahoshua]

Bush will veto it for sure, but if this bill becomes law we're going to lose the war for sure. Then the attacks will be on our homes themselves, and we'll know who to point the finger at when the time comes full.


http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070327/ap_on_go_co/us_iraq

[Skybird]

The war is lost since long. Get your boys home and back to their families, don't put them at risk all for nothing. That's the least thing that is owned to them now.

McCain deeply dissapointed me today with his comment that Gen. Patreus is driving around in an unarmed Hummer. As CCN put it, this time "he has tipped out the baby with the bathwater." CCN reporter said that troops and officers in Iraq where laughing when hearing that comment.

Two terror attacks in two Bagdhad regions today that Bush short time ago referred to as having been successfully brought under control. Grim laughter on my mind.

[Yahoshua]

We're still fighting, the war hasn't been lost yet.

[Enigma]

Bush will veto it for sure, but if this bill becomes law we're going to lose the war for sure. Then the attacks will be on our homes themselves, and we'll know who to point the finger at when the time comes full.

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Yahoshua

We're still fighting, the war hasn't been lost yet.

That stubborness to resist any sense of realism gives a new meaning to the term "just killing time".

[Yahoshua]

I'm a very pragmatic person.

What I see is a battle being fought against an enemy being supplied from outside Iraq (much like the Vietnam War and the Korean War). The battle isn't over, and it isn't about fighting an entity so much as it is an idealism that has become a scourge among people.

We will not declare victory when when "stability" occurs as we perceive it in the West since this will NEVER occur (look at Israel and the Arabs for example). We will win when the Iraqi gov't can stand on their own without our help, and the Iraqi people can vote democratically and decide their own future. That is victory.

Vietnam we lost because the politicians willed it to happen as it is happening now, seeing as how from a military standpoint we won EVERY engagement in the Vietnam war when we were involved. But we tied the hands of our commanders, limiting them to sentry duties in South Vietnam instead of destroying North Vietnams' infrastructure. We created our own demise. Once we abandoned South Vietnam, the south collapsed, and the United States is responsible for it.

When the U.S. leaves Iraq, all hell will break loose. If the Iraqi gov't collapses, we have lost the war. If we leave Iraq now, failure is guaranteed.

[Kazuaki Shimazaki II]

Originally Posted by Yahoshua

When the U.S. leaves Iraq, all hell will break loose. If the Iraqi gov't collapses, we have lost the war. If we leave Iraq now, failure is guaranteed.

Typical gambler's mentality. I might just win if I continue playing, so even if the odds look unfavorable, I'd still keep putting money on the table and lose it.

By your logic, the Soviet Union should have toughed it out in Afghanistan back in the 80s, because if they leave, failure (defined as propping up their favored government) is guaranteed and they MIGHT just succeed if they continue.

[Ark]

At least Dean and a few others know what they are talking about.

[The Avon Lady]

Originally Posted by Skybird

The war is lost since long. Get your boys home and back to their families, don't put them at risk all for nothing. That's the least thing that is owned to them now.

I only disagree with sending the boys back home. Leave Iraq but reposition nearby and wait for more important battles in the near future.

[tycho102]

Originally Posted by Yahoshua

Bush will veto it for sure, but if this bill becomes law we're going to lose the war for sure. Then the attacks will be on our homes themselves, and we'll know who to point the finger at when the time comes full.

Bush?

For refusing to secure the borders because it will impact Republican financial donors and influential hedge-fund managers?

For refusal to actually build nuclear power plants, alleviating the need for crude oil from hostile and malicious nations?

For refusal to jeopardise the $20 trillion business model of Halliburton, Exxon, Mobil, Phillips, DuPont, Boeing, British Petroleum, Shell, who all tend to lobby the Republican party more than the Democratic Party?

For refusal to let the moslems kill each other, driving up the price of oil, allowing the "free market" to develop energy alternatives to the oil industry's $20 trillion infrastructure investment?


Why, yes. I know where to "point the finger". (NESFW, not entirely safe for work)

[dean_acheson]

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/3/27/83651/6231


Thank God there are folks out there helping us simpletons understand the news....

Pentagon Psyops? Sometimes it is hard to tell the parody from the real anymore.....

[Enigma]

Dude.

Yesterday, it was:

I guess it doesn't matter, the Dems will pull funding, the whole region will fall further into despotism and bloodshed, and the left will blame Bush.

...and today, this.

Yeah, yeah yeah. The left hates America. Wants to lose the war. zzzzzz *snore*.

I havent read the whole link you posted. Why? Because as a guy that leans and tends to vote to the left, i find Kos to be a huge pile of paranoid noise making foil hat wearing maniacs that give liberalism a bad name. I criticize the Joe Klein's and Ann Coulters of the world daily for their lunacy and downright stupidity. But I dont assume they are like the rest of the right wingers I know. I guess its easy to sit there and assume that because I voted for Democrats, think the current administration is a joke, and because your sources for left leaning view point comes from trash heaps like Kos, that somehow we are all America hating traitors. Well, thats really too bad for you. Too bad.

It would be too bad if I were to begin to assume that Coulter, Klein, and the like speak for you.

...or...do they?

[Enigma]

Oh, and by the way....the left will blame bush when Iraq becomes a disaster after the funding is pulled?
Who, then, is to blame for the last 4 years of consecutive disasters, not only in Iraq, but here at home, too?

Dont bother answering.

[Yahoshua]

Originally Posted by tycho102

Bush?

For refusing to secure the borders because it will impact Republican financial donors and influential hedge-fund managers?

For refusal to actually build nuclear power plants, alleviating the need for crude oil from hostile and malicious nations?

For refusal to jeopardise the $20 trillion business model of Halliburton, Exxon, Mobil, Phillips, DuPont, Boeing, British Petroleum, Shell, who all tend to lobby the Republican party more than the Democratic Party?

For refusal to let the moslems kill each other, driving up the price of oil, allowing the "free market" to develop energy alternatives to the oil industry's $20 trillion infrastructure investment?


Why, yes. I know where to "point the finger". (NESFW, not entirely safe for work)

Both Republicans and Democrats have refused to defend our southern border, both sides are guilty on this issue.

Both sides have propogated their side of donors in return for "campaign donations." And letting the Moslems have at eachother over there doesn't necessarily mean that Texaco is immediatly going to go out and invent a renewable energy source. They're gonna want to empty our wallets before that happens.

As for nuclear power; who complains the loudest over environmental issues but decries the building of hydroelectric dams and other attempts made toward discovering renewable energy? It certainly isn't the right that is doing so.

Along the same lines of Left Vs. Right: Why is it that the left criticizes the United States for inaction on Darfur when European nations are perfectly capable of doing something about it themselves? Or that the massacres against civilians is so horrid, yet push for "womens' choice" in killing their unborn child? How do you justify that?

How do you rationalize leaving the Iraqis to be slaughtered by the Islamofascists while the Left ties the hands of our soldiers in this war?