German school capitulates to ethnic violance

[Skybird]

... but left and green politicians are already there again to declare that it all is not so bad.

http://www.welt.de/data/2006/03/30/867413.html
http://archiv.tagesspiegel.de/archiv...06/2443961.asp
http://morgenpost.berlin1.de/content...ik/820170.html

In Berlin, the first school in Germany has switched it's working conditions to red alert. Teachers got attacked, things get thrown at them, chairs and boxes get thrown out of windows, vandalism is considered to be "in", teachers only dare to enter classes with their handies ready to call for help. The scenes to be seen on TV were chaotic. Juveniles are short of attacking camera men. Private guards to protect the houses seem to be helpless - they tell people to go away, then retreat into the building and close and lock the doors. Only a handful of students in classes, druing hours, the rest on the street, fighting, or smoking, or hanging around. Violence and gang clashes are daily routine. The teachers have given up and demanded in an open letter that the schoold should be closed and disbanded.

Berlin police said yesterday that at least thirty schools in Berlin are known centres for gang-buuilding and hotspots for recrutiing young ones for gangs and organized crime. Severe violence (physical, drugs, sexual attacks) are on the daily chart. First schools in Germany have started to separate students from different schools using the same schoolyard by high scurity fences - scenes like from a prison yard, but the aggression is just redirected, not controlled.

Reports like these are circulating in German Tv since quite some time now. And always my impression was: I see a vast majority of non-German teens and juveniles, only a small number of Germans there. So far it was an subjective impression, and telling that loiud would have earned me an accusation of being a racist in Germany. since yesterday, official numbers had been published. In the example of the school in berlin, only 13% there are Germans, while 87% are foreigners. One third and one quarter are Albanians and Turks, then quite some others, 13% Germans - a minority. Germans a minority in a German school???. The school is located in a central sector of Berlin, Neukölln, with high crime and high unemployment: up to 45%. It is problematic ground. Part of the violence is due to the lack of perspectives. But the conflict also describes psychological realities. They do not want to be so much German as that they would be considered to be German. And Germans do not want so many strangers like the politicians are pushing in, which creates a growing unwillingness of Germans to give the strangers chances to integrate themselves. Russians and Poles have it easier, they are closer to our culture and habits, often have german roots in their families, try harder to adopt, to fit in, learn the language. Arabas, Truks and people from the Balkans, and muslims in general, are not perceived to be so close to us and our origins in history, traditon, culture. Which only is correct. It is a fact. We have far more in common with the Germans in Russia thta now are coming back, than with the for example Turkmen (originating from nothern Iran and Afghanistan). there are differences in general mentalities. It is easier for us to deal with german Russians and Poles, than with Arabs. Hell, there are differences in the mentalities and ways of behaving even between the people inside Europe! All this does not make it easier to create perspectives for the students at this school. Truth is, if oyu nail it down: many people do not want to give strnagers like them chances to settle down in Germany. They are not wanted. It is not fair to them, I agree. It also is not fair that our politicians push forward the idea to call in even more of them. And it is not fair towards Germans that they are told again and again that they have to want more of them. More and more Germans want NOT. since politicans have created a mess that only creates unfairness to all, why are politicians not sent to hell, simply?

I know that Germans are fleeing the city since the mid-90s. Due to mismanagement and a fincial scandal, the city has sensationally high debts that dooms it's politicians to be out of action for decades to come. Due to the evading Germans, ansd the incoming immigrants who do not propduce tax incomes like economical businessmen, but often hit the social budgets of the city, the finance of Berlin are in a very critical condition. Germans drive in to work there, but leave after work, and the surrounding area is another federal state than Berlin itself, so the city does need to pay them for their work, but does not get sufficient taxes, and thus: income for the city's treasurechest.

I know from ex-colleagues who are streetworkers that the situation cnstantly is detoriating, and since some time also is getting more and more dangerous with regard to physical violence. And pverty amongst children is exploding. statistically every 5th schoolchuldren under the age of 15 gets a hot meal only every 3rd day at home, since the parents do not have any money to pay for more. These kids depend on the meals being given by private charity projects. Of these there are not so much, private charity work has not that strong tradition in Germany and many other european countries like in anglosaxon countries. Nevertheless - Germany is considered to be one of the wealthiest nations on the globe.

This all reminds me very much of the very tensed and highly critical situation in suburbs of French major cities, namely Paris and Marseille. Only that due to the longer "preparation time" the pressure has had to mount upin Berlin, and several other German cities were this developing MCA stubbornly is ognored by sociologists and politicians (even is actively denied), maybe will lead to a far greater social explosion. And of course, lacking integration, lacking willingness to do so, lacking willingness of local resdients to accept a flood of foreoigners being rushed to their places, has something to do with it. But this unwelcomed truth is denied again these days by politicians.

The end of mutlicultural wischiwaschi-dreams. Quote: "Früher haben die Türken die Afrikaner gejagt. Jetzt jagen die Araber die Türken." (In the past the Turks hunted the Africans. Today the Arabs hunt the Turks).

The Berlin senate, in all his well-wishing and good intentions (what else!?) has decided to send two socialworkers to that school that are fluid in arabaic and Turkish language. Aren'T these kids not expected to speak German when having a German passport? Two socialworkers certainly will get under control what has been allowed since twenyt to go beyond control. Oh, and since today teachers enter and leave the shcool under police protection

Still wanting mutli-culti, and even more foreigners from Arabic, Turkish and Balkan regions? Na dann Prost, meine lieben weichgespülten Landsleute. The events may be politically uncorrect, and may be ignored by planners and wishers and strategists in Brussel - but they are a hard, solid social reality on the ground. It does not go away just because some smart humansists want it to go away. I stays, and mounts in pressure and destructive energy.

And not only in Berlin, Germany.

[STEED]

Welcome to the world of England’s schools in are case teachers have so many stupid rules to follow and the kids can get away with it.

[micky1up]

yep we have similar problems in the uk but not so extreme maybe the intergration of these minority groups could be handled better, this i feel is going to bring down the EU unless it is checked how they are going to handle it i dont know but i feel shutting the borders maybe the only solution ,this is the PC world we live in now and its gonna take a hell of lot to get it back to what i would call normality

[TteFAboB]

It was inevitable wasn't it, with the sectarian policy, making schools for Muslims only or whatever, with only a handful of locals always as a minority. Great way to get foreigners integrated and make them feel at home...at their old home, or their new segregated home, as they live in their own special neighborhoods too don't they? And only have contact with others of their own, don't they?

It's like living in a bubble. How long can it last?

[Sixpack]

The first and foremost cause of our societal problems today are our own people. I am not (primarily) talking politics here. I am going to let that one sink in for a while now............

Okay, check the unemployment rates in Germany and Holland in the last 2 decades, and specifically today because today we can make changes.

I wont beat around the bush with you: Shot term thinking companies are already screaming bloody murder again about the lack of good employees now and in the forseeable future. Already they are talking more immigration, regardless the present issues in society. Those silly cretins.

I say the employers should make good use of the vast army of unemployed first (train them fcol !! It's not as if most jobs are as tough as job descriptions would suggest) and cut very heavy on the (unemployment) social welfare to get the lazy bums among the number of unemployed back to work (for money). They lose their houses when they'd refuse to cooperate ? Good ! We have a shortage of houses, so working people can move into their houses.

In short, if we would use our present labor potential wiser, there would not be so much need for immigrants (of whom almost half soon ends up unemployed or 'disabled' anyway )

And must I remind you our world is still getting more and more technologized every day ? It's an irreversible process. And internet speeded it up. I foresee a not so distant future (can take 3 or more generations still, depending on world affairs; after all, everything is interconnected) in which actual smart robots have actually taken over a great (like 60%) part of the service business people do today, let alone in factories. I forsee a western society in which leasure will become the main thing. Yes indeed.

Economic principles will get a whole new meaning. Distribution of money will be different. It's ironic and perhaps scary to some but that way we'll be heading to a sort of economic communism lead by a relatively small elite of rulers (we will be made to believe it's still democracy) but without the totalitarian regime.

Anyway, IMO there's no more immigration needed in the next 10 years if we now change our social welfare system drastically and thus actually motivate many unemployed to get back to work plus at the same time order companies to hire unemployed of all ages, and reward/compensate them i.e. by lower taxes on their wages. For sure saves alot of money compared to the costs of immigration and the pointless integration of many muslims.

[jumpy]

Originally Posted by STEED

Welcome to the world of England’s schools in are case teachers have so many stupid rules to follow and the kids can get away with it.

Speaking as one who has not been educated at public school - no of course not, never been, don't know what you're talking about, what school tie reunion is that?

Private schools are the way forward, pay to send your kids to schools where the rabble cannot afford to get places
Better staff, better facilities, better behaviour, better teaching, better chances = better people (from a social behaviour point of view as regards violence and 'gang' culture in schools today).
Given the choice I wouldn't send my kids to a state run school, no chance.

[STEED]

jumpy, I was referring to State run schools and as for private a better class person not likely our Prime Minister is opening the door for the misfits. I wonder what a private school will be like in 20 years from now. As for the remark a better class person your joking these people also snort cocaine, drink large volumes of alcohol live for money back stab their friends and so on these people are just as bad but in a different way.

[jumpy]

yer, I hope you saw the funny side of what I was saying
I wouldn't touch a state school with a bargepole and my experience of private school is pretty much par for the course
In comparrison between kids at a state run school and those from a private establishment, the kids at private school were on the whole better behaved at school than those of their state counterparts- the sort of thing that seems acceptable at state run school would have got me a pasting at private school... seems that the level of disciplin and respect for the school is no longer instilled at state schools.

And as for a 'better class' of person I was only really refering to their behaviour whilst attending schooling; not so much yobbish behaviour- what they become after leaving school was not in question.

Unfortunately, these days you can't help but live for money... just the way society works now But I take solace in the fact that I'm public school educated and I turned out a fairly decent person, even if I may say so myself *regards others with a lofty expression* :rotfl:

Really, it's a shame that schools of all kinds have these stupid 'don't interfere with my life justification/validation as a pain in the arse' things, if more of these violent little s***'s got the occasional thrashing in their former years then they might grow up with a little more respect for their elders and betters... but now I'm harking back to the bygone era where people actually gave a s**t about anything; no doubt the same era that these uncaring ppl would consider as the dark days of institutionalised oppression and backwardness ...halcyon days :hmm:

[joea]

Originally Posted by Skybird

Still wanting mutli-culti, and even more foreigners from Arabic, Turkish and Balkan regions?

What? Since when are the Balkans not part of Europe? WHAT Balkans do you meant in fact?

[STEED]

Hey jumpy, as you said the problem is the Cain and slipper have been banned result no discipline and the stupid rules teachers have to follow, one prime example they can place a band aid on a child what a joke.

[TteFAboB]

Originally Posted by joea

What? Since when are the Balkans not part of Europe? WHAT Balkans do you meant in fact?

The Muslim part, if that wasn't obvious enough.

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by joea

What? Since when are the Balkans not part of Europe? WHAT Balkans do you meant in fact?

Hm? Did I say Balkans is (geographically) not Europe? It's the outer rim, a zone of transition where europe fades out, the Orient comes in, and both also faces Slawic Christian orthodxy. But the Muslim culture, Balkan or not, certainly is no part of Europe.

[joea]

Ahh I see so, in your view, Greek, Bulgarian or Slovenians would fit as immigrants (I know there are many Greeks in Western Europe) say in Germany, but not Bosnian or Albanian muslims? Albanian catholics ok though? Reason I am asking is in Switzerland there were large numbers of Kosovar refugees (Muslims) during and after the wars and upheavals of the 1990s..and there was a lot of tension as a result.

[Konovalov]

Originally Posted by Skybird

But the Muslim culture, Balkan or not, certainly is no part of Europe.

No Muslims full stop I would say, right Sky?

No Muslims be they black, white, brown. No Muslims be they from the Middle East, the USA, Australia, Africa or wherever. No Muslims be they highly skilled workers, doctors, dentists, chemists. But what would you do with those German citizens who are Muslim Sky? What would you like your government to do? How would you like this problem dealt with? You must have some ideas surely.

Would I be able to travel to your country for a holiday? Should there be a law that a persons religion must be stated on their passport/identification papers? Or should this be taken further with some form of visual ID/marking on ones person that indicates them being Muslim? Could I take up employment in your country on a work permit visa with my parent company in Germany?

[TLAM Strike]

Don’t send kids to private schools once they have been in public schools unless those schools are REALLY bad. I attended public school from Pre to 3rd grade then in 4th grade I went to a private school- St. Theodore’s a catholic school. In the end my education got really screwed up. The next year I went back to public school and found I was at least a year behind my schoolmates and a few skills even got worse. That followed me till around sophomore year when I finally caught up (although my math and hand writing are still bad.)