METOX Detectable by Allied Aircraft

[Pharaoh49]

Playing over at Wolves at War, we are at the stage of the war where many of the boats are now installing the METOX radar detection device.

One of the fellows complained that when he used METOX he actually had more aircraft attacking him. To quote one of the other players:

I just found this on the internet (I forgot the website I'll look again for it later).

After Metox had entered service, U-boat crews found that allied aircraft had appeared even more frequently. By early 1943, it was apparent that despite the widespread use of Metox, allied aircraft were appearing too often, and were forcing U-boats to submerge and travel underwater. The German technical intelligence sought to find the reason behind the strange phenomenon, and found that the device itself transmitted a frequency which could be picked up for miles around. This frequency was being used by the allies as a means of homing in on U-boats and on July 31st 1943, Donitz issued a directive that the Metox was to be used sparingly. Later on August 13, interrogation of a British prisoner-of-war confirmed that the Brtish were indeed homing in on Metox signals, which led to the order to ban the use of Metox altogether.

The site he refers to is:

http://www.uboataces.com/

The big question here is, "Does anyone know if this is modeled into the game?"

Thanks

[Etienne]

Take this with a grain of salt, as I'm going from memory :

Metox was not really detected by allied aircraft. What happened is that the allies were, at the time, changing to another wave length for their radar, a wavelenght that Metox could not detect.

The british pilot was asked if they used Metox to home in on U-boat. He said yes, that the metox radiations could be detected for hundred of miles - He was BSing at a hundred miles an hour, and got lucky that the German believed him.

As far as I know, Metox wasn't used to home in on submarines. It just created a false sense of safety, that the allies, with their now-undetectable radar, capitalized upon.

But you might want to check some sources, just to be sure.

[Pharaoh49]

I appreciate the input.

I myself have watched aircraft at long distance disappear from sight so I am not so sure that they are picking it up. I was just lucky that they didn't spot me.

Still, if anyone else knows for sure, 100%, would be nice to know.

Thanks again.

[padualima]

You can read in the book "Iron coffins", from Herbert A. Werner, that Meteox was, indeed, detected by aicraft which could that way detect submarines even easier.

I also would like to know if that is modelled in the game...

[Etienne]

Fianlly did some research.

Uboat.net's page on radar detector

Basically, no, the Brits never detected the Metox. It could, theorically, have been done, but it never happened.

If you still have doubt, try to find the name of the device the allied used for this purpose. You'll search for a long time ; it doesn't exist.

[CptGrayWolf]

Originally Posted by padualima

You can read in the book "Iron coffins", from Herbert A. Werner, that Meteox was, indeed, detected by aicraft which could that way detect submarines even easier.

I also would like to know if that is modelled in the game...

Don't forget Werner made many mistakes in his book ( it's still great ).
Metox was NOT detected by allied aircraft.

[Sniper_1]

Metox was not detectable by the allies, it could theoretically be detected (it did emmit some radiation...like all electronic devices). The allies effectively deceived the Germans into believing that Metox was giving away their U-Boats, when in fact the allies had switched to centimetric radar, which the Germans did not detect for an additional few months as they focused on making Metox non-radiating.

[gdogghenrikson]

Originally Posted by Pharaoh49

Playing over at Wolves at War, we are at the stage of the war where many of the boats are now installing the METOX radar detection device.

One of the fellows complained that when he used METOX he actually had more aircraft attacking him. To quote one of the other players:

The site he refers to is:

http://www.uboataces.com/

The big question here is, "Does anyone know if this is modeled into the game?"

Thanks

I believe it is!!

[CCIP]

No, I don't think it could be. In fact I'm not even sure whether the enemy even has actual radar detectors - I'm yet to see confirmation of this in the game.

As far as air strikes, there is simply no dynamic factors other than time of day, being within sight of an enemy surface unit and/or having been sighted by it, having been attacked by another plane recently, and radio messages sent that actually have any influence on the appearance of aircraft. :hmm:

[joea]

Concerning the history, METOX was never detectable by the Allies, looks like that pilot's story is still fooling people, plus that website is repeating that story as history which is even worse. I think I'll drop them a note.

[HMCS]

It was not detectable. Metox was only a receiver, of the passive type - to detect radar waves of the earlier types. It was the arrival of the 10cm radar sets in large #'s that threw the Germans off. They went on believing that 10cm radar was impossible until they picked one out of the wreckage of a British plane and turned the thing on.

The story about the British pilot b.s.'ing them is true - and as to the website that is perpetuating the erroneous info: that's the difference between history buffs and historians. Check your sources!

[joea]

Got an e-mail from the site: they fixed their wrong information, very good of them look here: http://www.uboataces.com/radar-warning.shtml

After Metox had entered service, U-boat crews found that allied aircraft had appeared even more frequently. By early 1943, it was apparent that despite the widespread use of Metox, allied aircraft were appearing too often, and were forcing U-boats to submerge and travel underwater. The German technical intelligence sought to find the reason behind the strange phenomenon, and found that the device itself transmitted a frequency which could be picked up for miles around. This led to suspicions that the allies used the frequency as a means of homing in on U-boats and on July 31st 1943, Donitz issued a directive that the Metox was to be used sparingly.

The British were indeed trying to home in on the signals, but had abandoned all efforts as it proved too difficult. Unknown to the Germans, the real reason behind the increase in aircraft appearance was due to the introduction of the new British ASV MkIII radar.

Later on August 13, a British prisoner-of-war under interrogation deceived the Germans by informing that the British were indeed homing in on Metox signals. This led to the order to ban the use of Metox altogether.

Pays to let the webmasters know, if they are serious they'll correct it.